Simon Rattle Berliner Sibelius 1-7 Symphonies-----Lp set----like it alot so far......

Mike Lavigne

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a few have mentioned this 2015 set before....it's in stock and took about 2 weeks to arrive. my set was #324 of 2000. only listened to the first three Symphonies so far but really enjoy the sound and performances. nice hardbound book (i will read it, looks interesting) and beautiful box nicely done.


it's a 24/192 digital recording, but lovingly mastered on flat, quiet, clarity vinyl. typical quality production from this label. i compared the 24/96 Quboz streaming version on the MSB Select/Taiko Extreme with the vinyl masterings and it's no contest. the vinyl on the CS Port tt/arm/EMIA SUT/CS Port phono is much more alive, energetic and real sounding. more detailed and layered. i really like the performances which do the big space thing (love the scale and sweep of Sibelius) and lovely tone and textures. nothing in your face and edgy to my ears. maybe the actual download files sound better than the streaming version, but they are only 24/48 according to the website. not heard the CD's. the vinyl box set comes with a free download which i've not yet done.

money well spent to my ears. it seems like a good idea to buy this one if you are on the fence just to keep the classical vinyl machine moving forward. how many newly recorded classical vinyl titles do we see? not enough!!!!

a caution; i'm no classical music expert.....although large scale classical is my main musical focus. buyer beware. not yet compared it to other Sibelius pressings i own. when i do i will comment.
 
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Addicted to hifi

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a few have mentioned this 2015 set before....it's in stock and took about 2 weeks to arrive. my set was #324 of 2000. only listened to the first three Symphonies so far but really enjoy the sound and performances. nice hardbound book (i will read it, looks interesting) and beautiful box nicely done.


it's a 24/192 digital recording, but lovingly mastered on flat, quiet, clarity vinyl. typical quality production from this label. i compared the 24/96 Quboz streaming version on the MSB Select/Taiko Extreme with the vinyl masterings and it's no contest. the vinyl on the CS Port tt/arm/EMIA SUT/CS Port phono is much more alive, energetic and real sounding. more detailed and layered. i really like the performances which do the big space thing (love the scale and sweep of Sibelius) and lovely tone and textures. nothing in your face and edgy to my ears. maybe the actual download files sound better than the streaming version, but they are only 24/48 according to the website. not heard the CD's. the vinyl box set comes with a free download which i've not yet done.

money well spent to my ears. it seems like a good idea to buy this one if you are on the fence just to keep the classical vinyl machine moving forward. how many newly recorded classical vinyl titles do we see? not enough!!!!

a caution; i'm no classical music expert.....although large scale classical is my main musical focus. buyer beware. not yet compared it to other Sibelius pressings i own. when i do i will comment.
Great stuff.
 

tima

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Mike - I am interested to read your further comments about the Rattle/Sibelius set. I looked at it but have so much Sibelius, including several box sets, that I have held back thus far.

We can appreciate that DG was willing to make the investment in a live Sibelius symphonic cycle in the 21st Century and make it available on vinyl. Rattle has made other cycles with Berlin Philharmonic available on vinyl (Beethoven, Brahms, Schumann) and seems to enjoy it. He did Sibelius 1-7 on EMI with City of Birmingham Symphony available on LP, but I don't think there is box set.

Quite a few Sibelius symphonic cycles and 'semi-cycles' are available on vinyl and some are broadly excellent, though imo the best of the best will come selectively from different conductors. S wrote many lighter pieces and tone poems, but each of his symphonies is 'serious' music. Though mannered with 19th C tradition, his sound is truly unique - an amazing composer.
 
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matakana

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a few have mentioned this 2015 set before....it's in stock and took about 2 weeks to arrive. my set was #324 of 2000. only listened to the first three Symphonies so far but really enjoy the sound and performances. nice hardbound book (i will read it, looks interesting) and beautiful box nicely done.


it's a 24/192 digital recording, but lovingly mastered on flat, quiet, clarity vinyl. typical quality production from this label. i compared the 24/96 Quboz streaming version on the MSB Select/Taiko Extreme with the vinyl masterings and it's no contest. the vinyl on the CS Port tt/arm/EMIA SUT/CS Port phono is much more alive, energetic and real sounding. more detailed and layered. i really like the performances which do the big space thing (love the scale and sweep of Sibelius) and lovely tone and textures. nothing in your face and edgy to my ears. maybe the actual download files sound better than the streaming version, but they are only 24/48 according to the website. not heard the CD's. the vinyl box set comes with a free download which i've not yet done.

money well spent to my ears. it seems like a good idea to buy this one if you are on the fence just to keep the classical vinyl machine moving forward. how many newly recorded classical vinyl titles do we see? not enough!!!!

a caution; i'm no classical music expert.....although large scale classical is my main musical focus. buyer beware. not yet compared it to other Sibelius pressings i own. when i do i will comment.
Thanks for the heads up .
 

microstrip

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a few have mentioned this 2015 set before....it's in stock and took about 2 weeks to arrive. my set was #324 of 2000. only listened to the first three Symphonies so far but really enjoy the sound and performances. nice hardbound book (i will read it, looks interesting) and beautiful box nicely done.


it's a 24/192 digital recording, but lovingly mastered on flat, quiet, clarity vinyl. typical quality production from this label. i compared the 24/96 Quboz streaming version on the MSB Select/Taiko Extreme with the vinyl masterings and it's no contest. the vinyl on the CS Port tt/arm/EMIA SUT/CS Port phono is much more alive, energetic and real sounding. more detailed and layered. i really like the performances which do the big space thing (love the scale and sweep of Sibelius) and lovely tone and textures. nothing in your face and edgy to my ears. maybe the actual download files sound better than the streaming version, but they are only 24/48 according to the website. not heard the CD's. the vinyl box set comes with a free download which i've not yet done.

money well spent to my ears. it seems like a good idea to buy this one if you are on the fence just to keep the classical vinyl machine moving forward. how many newly recorded classical vinyl titles do we see? not enough!!!!

a caution; i'm no classical music expert.....although large scale classical is my main musical focus. buyer beware. not yet compared it to other Sibelius pressings i own. when i do i will comment.

Are you sure about the bit rates? As far as I see the digital download also supplies the stereo 24/192 files (6.9 GB) .
 
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Mike Lavigne

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Are you sure about the bit rates? As far as I see the digital download also supplies the stereo 24/192 files (6.9 GB) .

when you buy the Lp Set you are given a 24/48 download code. or you can separately purchase ($49) a 24/192 download. the question becomes how much better the 24/192 file is than the Quboz 24/96 streaming file? $49 better? enough better to not buy the $199 plus shipping Lp Box set?
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rsorren1

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Mike, hope you are well. I bought the SACD set several months ago. I love it. They sound great but I'm sure the LPs are a treat. The Berlin Philharmonic label is EXCELLENT!! Quality and performances!
 
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dcc

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when you buy the Lp Set you are given a 24/48 download code. or you can separately purchase ($49) a 24/192 download. the question becomes how much better the 24/192 file is than the Quboz 24/96 streaming file? $49 better? enough better to not buy the $199 plus shipping Lp Box set?
That’s strange. When I purchased the boxset a while ago, I was able to download the 24/192 file with the download code.
 
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Mike Lavigne

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That’s strange. When I purchased the boxset a while ago, I was able to download the 24/192 file with the download code.
that is good news.

i have not yet done the download, and was simply going by what the website says. the download card does not specify resolution choices. this weekend i'll do the download and report what i'm seeing.....and hearing.
 

Mike Lavigne

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ok, i did download the 24/192 wav. file from the free download code provided in the Sibelius/Rattle Lp Box Set. it took me a while to remember my download process for my PCIe local files on my Taiko Extreme server that Emile (from Taiko) had set up for me so it went there instead of my external NAS. but banging on it i did get it figured out. with all the streaming i've been doing it's been awhile since i downloaded any files.

first on Roon, i played the 24/192 download compared to the 24/96 Quboz streaming files, sampled a number tracks back and forth, and the 24/192 is slightly but noticeably better......more vivid and lively in small degrees; both as it's a file, and the higher rez. through Roon the 24/192 still is not in the realm of the vinyl. the longer you listen to the vinyl the more you are sucked all the way into the musical experience on another level. but the 24/192 is a wonderful.......on it's own. worth owning. Sibelius is music i do keep coming back to that i escape into. it has stood the test of time for me. always seems natural, fresh and alive.

i did also play the 24/192 file with TAS (Taiko Audio System---proprietary Roon alternative unique to the Extreme server) and that was a worthwhile step closer to the vinyl compared to Roon. took me a minute to find where it was hiding.....the TAS interface is not ROON). i will play this file this way often. start it on the 1st Symphony and just let 3 hours and 47 minutes play. :cool:

so the vinyl does take things to a higher level, but the 24/192 file gets you to a wonderful spot.

if i had Quboz. but not vinyl, would i download the 24/192 file for the step up over the 24/96 streaming? likely not. but it is better......so maybe if i really loved the music. if i had the Extreme and TAS the pull of the download would be a little stronger.

lastly; i now have played all 7 Symphony's on the vinyl and it's very consistently well done and the sonics are really great. highly recommended. i have not yet done any compares to other Sibelius Symphony pressings.......that is next.
 
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microstrip

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ok, i did download the 24/192 wav. file from the free download code provided in the Sibelius/Rattle Lp Box Set. it took me a while to remember my download process for my PCIe local files on my Taiko Extreme server that Emile (from Taiko) had set up for me so it went there instead of my external NAS. but banging on it i did get it figured out. with all the streaming i've been doing it's been awhile since i downloaded any files.

first on Roon, i played the 24/192 download compared to the 24/96 Quboz streaming files, sampled a number tracks back and forth, and the 24/192 is slightly but noticeably better......more vivid and lively in small degrees; both as it's a file, and the higher rez. through Roon the 24/192 still is not in the realm of the vinyl. the longer you listen to the vinyl the more you are sucked all the way into the musical experience on another level. but the 24/192 is a wonderful.......on it's own. worth owning. Sibelius is music i do keep coming back to that i escape into. it has stood the test of time for me. always seems natural, fresh and alive.

i did also play the 24/192 file with TAS (Taiko Audio System---proprietary Roon alternative unique to the Extreme server) and that was a worthwhile step closer to the vinyl compared to Roon. took me a minute to find where it was hiding.....the TAS interface is not ROON). i will play this file this way often. start it on the 1st Symphony and just let 3 hours and 47 minutes play. :cool:

so the vinyl does take things to a higher level, but the 24/192 file gets you to a wonderful spot.

if i had Quboz. but not vinyl, would i download the 24/192 file for the step up over the 24/96 streaming? likely not. but it is better......so maybe if i really loved the music. if i had the Extreme and TAS the pull of the download would be a little stronger.

lastly; i now have played all 7 Symphony's on the vinyl and it's very consistently well done and the sonics are really great. highly recommended. i have not yet done any compares to other Sibelius Symphony pressings.......that is next.

The only unknown variable is knowing if the vinyl recordings were pressed from the same 24/192 files we get from DG - I have now downloaded and listened just to the 3rd Symphony. Great recording, thanks for remembering about it. Sounds really great in the DCS/XLF.

If the files are the same and you prefer the vinyl, this just means that in your particular system the extra processing carried by the vinyl recording and playback by your analog ancillaries bring you the "much more alive, energetic and real sounding. more detailed and layered" reproduction. (quoting your original post) . Great for you, but IMHO no way this means that the vinyls are better than the digital 192/24.
 

Mike Lavigne

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The only unknown variable is knowing if the vinyl recordings were pressed from the same 24/192 files we get from DG - I have now downloaded and listened just to the 3rd Symphony. Great recording, thanks for remembering about it. Sounds really great in the DCS/XLF.

If the files are the same and you prefer the vinyl, this just means that in your particular system the extra processing carried by the vinyl recording and playback by your analog ancillaries bring you the "much more alive, energetic and real sounding. more detailed and layered" reproduction. (quoting your original post) . Great for you, but IMHO no way this means that the vinyls are better than the digital 192/24.
i suppose it's possible that the 24/192 recording source files are different than those used to cut the vinyl or those offered for downloads. we won't ever know for sure, but logically hard to see why they might be different.

and.....agree that my preference for the vinyl is objectively anecdotal and only a data point.........and a reflection of my front end source signal paths. the digital being 30-40% more expensive. each reader will assign weight to my feedback as they might. have my opinions previously been helpful?

when we get a few more compares of the 24/192 and vinyl in other systems we can then judge accordingly as to the implications. in my experience; vinyl pressings from quality digital files do mostly sound better than the source files; but not always. i have plenty of opposite results. so many variables in the mastering process i think. there are many poor vinyl mastering efforts......especially in pop records. so we have to examine particular cases for what we hear. DG seems to really execute well to my ears. can't think of one recent DG stinker. i will buy any DG's i see.

at the end of the day all we will have, all we ever have, is some subjective opinions. better than not having any data points. at least it's something.
 
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tima

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If the files are the same and you prefer the vinyl, this just means that in your particular system the extra processing carried by the vinyl recording and playback by your analog ancillaries bring you the "much more alive, energetic and real sounding. more detailed and layered" reproduction. (quoting your original post) .
Great for you, but IMHO no way this means that the vinyls are better than the digital 192/24.

Are there any conditions under which this (or the reverse, digital 192/24 better than vinyl) can be true for you?
 

Mike Lavigne

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this morning i did a compare of the Rattle/Berliner Sibelius Symphony #5 Lp to the LSC-2405 (now 25 year old) Grundman mastered (Classic Records 33 rpm) Gibson/London Symphony #5 pressing.


the Gibson/London pressing is far superior to the Rattle/Berliner pressing. it's why we go to so much trouble to play records......to hear music reproduction this good. objectively it's only degrees better, but subjectively it crosses into many 'suspension of disbelief' moments, and sustains them. in degrees more real life liquid and grain-less, more a sense of venue, more air, more delicacy, more life and action, bass more tuneful and propulsive. greater sweep and tension. way more emotion and wonder. how much does the 'all analog' have to do with my perceptions? maybe plenty, maybe not so much.

likely artistically it's better, but i don't have the knowledge to get too much into that.

the Rattle/Berliner is still very enjoyable with very fine sonics, but it does not reach the heights where vinyl can get. i have a number of 2nd Symphony pressings. will try one of those next when i have time.
 
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microstrip

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this morning i did a compare of the Rattle/Berliner Sibelius Symphony #5 Lp to the LSC-2405 (now 25 year old) Grundman mastered (Classic Records 33 rpm) Gibson/London Symphony #5 pressing.


the Gibson/London pressing is far superior to the Rattle/Berliner pressing. it's why we go to so much trouble to play records......to hear music reproduction this good. objectively it's only degrees better, but subjectively it crosses into many 'suspension of disbelief' moments, and sustains them. in degrees more real life liquid and grain-less, more a sense of venue, more air, more delicacy, more life and action, bass more tuneful and propulsive. greater sweep and tension. way more emotion and wonder. how much does the 'all analog' have to do with my perceptions? maybe plenty, maybe not so much.

likely artistically it's better, but i don't have the knowledge to get too much into that.

the Rattle/Berliner is still very enjoyable with very fine sonics, but it does not reach the heights where vinyl can get. i have a number of 2nd Symphony pressings. will try one of those next when i have time.

Then we would have to compare it with the DXD transfer, although it is a different mastering - our WBF friends with remastering phobia will surely prefer the original!

https://www.highdeftapetransfers.co...gibson-conducts-the-london-symphony-orchestra

Unfortunately I could not find details about the tape that was used for the transfer, the equipment and people carrying it.
 

Mike Lavigne

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Then we would have to compare it with the DXD transfer, although it is a different mastering - our WBF friends with remastering phobia will surely prefer the original!

https://www.highdeftapetransfers.co...gibson-conducts-the-london-symphony-orchestra

Unfortunately I could not find details about the tape that was used for the transfer, the equipment and people carrying it.
going fishing for a few days so won't be able to comment until i get back. it would be fun to track down a low gen master dub of the Gibson, my pressing, and the 352/24 transfer.

maybe you can get right to that in the meantime? ;)
 

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