Shunyata vs other types of grounding devices

jfrech

VIP/Donor
Sep 3, 2012
2,152
749
1,160
Austin
Hi, I want to be careful how I word this thread. I am not looking to bash other companies...however we have a few lively threads going on elsewhere on WBF around 2 companies and their grounding devices. I am sure what the others are hearing is real...some pretty classy guys commenting on these grounding products.

As a Shunyata Triton/Typhon owner, are my Triton/Typhon doing something similar? So in my case would adding one of these grounding devices not help like the other systems?

Where I live I have sandy/slightly rocky soil, that dries out frequently, and after about a 12-18" down I hit rock. So instead of a grounding rod, I have 2 grounding plates that I try and keep watered during drying spells. That said...every time we get a good rain..system sounds better...

I've also been curious if a grounding solution like this might help me out also http://www.erico.com/products/ChemRod.asp

Sincerely curious here.

(PS, I love my Shunyata conditioners & cords...so changing those is NOT a option for me...just wondering what other improvements I can wring out from my home's AC)
 

LL21

Well-Known Member
Dec 26, 2010
14,411
2,509
1,448
Hey JFrech,

I can only share with you my observations about owners I know...all of them already had 'fully tricked out' systems, a few with dedicated AC lines, etc. And ALL of them have found benefit with the Tripoint Troy. This includes serious setup with Audio Exotics in HK where they had fully dedicated lines coming into the demo room...a full Tidal Sunray 4-tower setup 3 sets of Tidal Ref monos, a huge Tripoint Power Conditioner...and they disconnected 1 grounding wire from the Tripoint Troy...and I heard what I could best describe as a haze around notes.

That was in 2012 I think...and I still remember that 'display'. And their system is pretty tricked out. I have spoken with 3 private owners and read from 3 others as well...all of whom have tricked out systems and said similar things about its benefits. Good luck and speak with Miguel if you wish...he is very very responsive.
 

Speedskater

Well-Known Member
Sep 30, 2010
941
15
368
Cleveland Ohio
'Ground' and 'Earth' are words that have several meanings.

In this situation are we speaking of?

a] the 'Safety Ground' / 'Protective Earth' inside a building.

or

b] the connection to the dirt/soil outside a building.
 

Steve Williams

Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
Hi, I want to be careful how I word this thread. I am not looking to bash other companies...however we have a few lively threads going on elsewhere on WBF around 2 companies and their grounding devices. I am sure what the others are hearing is real...some pretty classy guys commenting on these grounding products.

As a Shunyata Triton/Typhon owner, are my Triton/Typhon doing something similar? So in my case would adding one of these grounding devices not help like the other systems?

Where I live I have sandy/slightly rocky soil, that dries out frequently, and after about a 12-18" down I hit rock. So instead of a grounding rod, I have 2 grounding plates that I try and keep watered during drying spells. That said...every time we get a good rain..system sounds better...

I've also been curious if a grounding solution like this might help me out also http://www.erico.com/products/ChemRod.asp

Sincerely curious here.

(PS, I love my Shunyata conditioners & cords...so changing those is NOT a option for me...just wondering what other improvements I can wring out from my home's AC)

I have always thought that if you use a grounding rod at the street that it always functions best when using electrolytic salts
 

jfrech

VIP/Donor
Sep 3, 2012
2,152
749
1,160
Austin
'Ground' and 'Earth' are words that have several meanings.

In this situation are we speaking of?

a] the 'Safety Ground' / 'Protective Earth' inside a building.

or

b] the connection to the dirt/soil outside a building.

Hi B in the case of the grounding rod link I gave above...
 

LL21

Well-Known Member
Dec 26, 2010
14,411
2,509
1,448
'Ground' and 'Earth' are words that have several meanings.

In this situation are we speaking of?

a] the 'Safety Ground' / 'Protective Earth' inside a building.

or

b] the connection to the dirt/soil outside a building.

I am no techie, but since the Entreq does not even plug in, I think its acting as its own earthing ground (as in soil outside??)...I believe Troy may also be creating its own source of earthing ground...hence why these units are so heavy and contain (I believe) heavy slabs of copper, silver, etc. I think both designers feel like their products does something better in terms of what they've got in the box and how it all works. I am told, for example, the length of the cable matters...shorter better...so presumably running wire all the way out the house to the soil may not work as well in this one aspect as having the grounding box right there with the rest of the system? my (less than) 2 cents.
 

Speedskater

Well-Known Member
Sep 30, 2010
941
15
368
Cleveland Ohio
'LL21' well I hope not. It's dangerous and against code to have separate connections to the soil. But I'm sure that it's not used that way, after all it's not buried in the outside soil.
 

Speedskater

Well-Known Member
Sep 30, 2010
941
15
368
Cleveland Ohio
Another meaning of the word 'ground' is common reference point. We think of an automobile's frame as the car's 'ground' even though it's insulated from the soil by the tires.

These 'grounding devices' work the same way as common reference point. Not as part of the 'Safety Ground' / 'Protective Earth' system.
 

LL21

Well-Known Member
Dec 26, 2010
14,411
2,509
1,448
'LL21' well I hope not. It's dangerous and against code to have separate connections to the soil. But I'm sure that it's not used that way, after all it's not buried in the outside soil.

Given that with Entreq, I am connecting an RCA inlet to a box that is not even connected to an outlet...i don't suspect that's dangerous. I think Tripoint is similar in this regard?
 

jfrech

VIP/Donor
Sep 3, 2012
2,152
749
1,160
Austin
Well yes, but what does that have to do with in the house grounding devices?

Well isn't power delivery a system? So any weak link like a grounding rod outside or less than optimal grounding of the components ... doesn't this all have the potential to sub optimize sound ?!?
 

Speedskater

Well-Known Member
Sep 30, 2010
941
15
368
Cleveland Ohio
Well isn't power delivery a system? So any weak link like a grounding rod outside or less than optimal grounding of the components ... doesn't this all have the potential to sub optimize sound ?!?

a] Not that simple
b] No - or if it does, you or one of your nearby neighbors has a big problem.
 

amirm

Banned
Apr 2, 2010
15,813
37
0
Seattle, WA
I wonder if the equi-tech model Q balanced power units take care of grounding issues ?
They (balanced power) are against code in US to install them in residential situations. Here is the Article 647 of US NEC quoted by equi-tech itself: http://www.equitech.com/support/647.html

"647.3 General. Use of a separately derived 120-volt single-phase 3-wire system with 60 volts on each of two ungrounded conductors to a grounded neutral conductor shall be permitted for the purpose of reducing objectionable noise in sensitive electronic equipment locations provided that the following conditions apply.

(1) The system is installed only in commercial or industrial occupancies.
(2) The system's use is restricted to areas under close supervision by qualified personnel.
(3) All of the requirements in 647.4 through 647.8 are met."


I have bolded #1 which applies here.
 

rockitman

Member Sponsor
Sep 20, 2011
7,097
412
1,210
Northern NY
They (balanced power) are against code in US to install them in residential situations. Here is the Article 647 of US NEC quoted by equi-tech itself: http://www.equitech.com/support/647.html

"647.3 General. Use of a separately derived 120-volt single-phase 3-wire system with 60 volts on each of two ungrounded conductors to a grounded neutral conductor shall be permitted for the purpose of reducing objectionable noise in sensitive electronic equipment locations provided that the following conditions apply.

(1) The system is installed only in commercial or industrial occupancies.
(2) The system's use is restricted to areas under close supervision by qualified personnel.
(3) All of the requirements in 647.4 through 647.8 are met."


I have bolded #1 which applies here.

I am inquiring about the rack unit, model 1.5Q. I am aware of the code issue for the bigger wall mounted variety.
 

Mike Lavigne

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 25, 2010
12,471
11,367
4,410
I wonder if the equi-tech model Q balanced power units take care of grounding issues ?

I doubt that Equi=tech has any special design advantages in grounding per se. OTOH the quality of the whole 10WQ (or other model Equi=tech) panels as far as the solidity and engineered comprehensive solution likely results in a more certain covering of bases than other approaches. combine the Equi=tech with quality installation, a good ground rod, good in wall wire and quality duplex outlets you have eliminated lots of variables.

the very low noise floor in my system owes much to these things. i think that the Tripoint or Entreq approach would be complimentary to power grid issues......not a substitute for them.

since the noise floor starts out lower in a system with a whole system isolation transformer any enhancement will be more evident and valuable. that is normal for almost any tweak i try.
 
Last edited:

Mike Lavigne

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 25, 2010
12,471
11,367
4,410
They (balanced power) are against code in US to install them in residential situations. Here is the Article 647 of US NEC quoted by equi-tech itself: http://www.equitech.com/support/647.html

"647.3 General. Use of a separately derived 120-volt single-phase 3-wire system with 60 volts on each of two ungrounded conductors to a grounded neutral conductor shall be permitted for the purpose of reducing objectionable noise in sensitive electronic equipment locations provided that the following conditions apply.

(1) The system is installed only in commercial or industrial occupancies.
(2) The system's use is restricted to areas under close supervision by qualified personnel.
(3) All of the requirements in 647.4 through 647.8 are met."


I have bolded #1 which applies here.

Amir, since involved dedicated high end audio systems/home theatres resemble commercial studios it's not difficult to get approval to use an Equi=tech with the help of a qualified commercial electrician. the issue is whether the room is a mixed use room/installation or a dedicated space. my panel only serves one dedicated room.
 

rockitman

Member Sponsor
Sep 20, 2011
7,097
412
1,210
Northern NY
I doubt that Equi=tech has any special design advantages in grounding per se. OTOH the quality of the whole 10WQ (or other model Equi=tech) panels as far as the solidity and engineered comprehensive solution likely results in a more certain covering of bases than other approaches. combine the Equi=tech with quality installation, a good ground rod, good in wall wire and quality duplex outlets you have eliminated lots of variables.

the very low noise floor in my system owes much to these things. i think that the Tripoint or Entreq approach would be complimentary to power grid issues.

since the noise floor starts out lower in a system with a whole system isolation transformer any enhancement will be more evident and valuable. that is normal for almost any tweak i try.

I am thinking a sub-panel from the main's in with dedicated lines and running Q standalone box units. One for each amp and another for source components.
 

LL21

Well-Known Member
Dec 26, 2010
14,411
2,509
1,448
I doubt that Equi=tech has any special design advantages in grounding per se. OTOH the quality of the whole 10WQ (or other model Equi=tech) panels as far as the solidity and engineered comprehensive solution likely results in a more certain covering of bases than other approaches. combine the Equi=tech with quality installation, a good ground rod, good in wall wire and quality duplex outlets you have eliminated lots of variables.

the very low noise floor in my system owes much to these things. i think that the Tripoint or Entreq approach would be complimentary to power grid issues......not a substitute for them.

since the noise floor starts out lower in a system with a whole system isolation transformer any enhancement will be more evident and valuable. that is normal for almost any tweak i try.

very interesting...thanks for that
 

Geardaddy

Well-Known Member
Oct 1, 2012
522
1
930
Charlotte, NC
Hi, I want to be careful how I word this thread. I am not looking to bash other companies...however we have a few lively threads going on elsewhere on WBF around 2 companies and their grounding devices. I am sure what the others are hearing is real...some pretty classy guys commenting on these grounding products.

As a Shunyata Triton/Typhon owner, are my Triton/Typhon doing something similar? So in my case would adding one of these grounding devices not help like the other systems?

Where I live I have sandy/slightly rocky soil, that dries out frequently, and after about a 12-18" down I hit rock. So instead of a grounding rod, I have 2 grounding plates that I try and keep watered during drying spells. That said...every time we get a good rain..system sounds better...

I've also been curious if a grounding solution like this might help me out also http://www.erico.com/products/ChemRod.asp

Sincerely curious here.

(PS, I love my Shunyata conditioners & cords...so changing those is NOT a option for me...just wondering what other improvements I can wring out from my home's AC)

It would help IMO. You could always chat with Shunyata. The founder of that company is extremely sharp. I used an isolated, ionic grounding rod from Lyncole (similar to Erico) in my dedicated room to good effect. I am also interested in fiddling with Tripoint. Lowering the "noise floor" does impact the music.
 

About us

  • What’s Best Forum is THE forum for high end audio, product reviews, advice and sharing experiences on the best of everything else. This is THE place where audiophiles and audio companies discuss vintage, contemporary and new audio products, music servers, music streamers, computer audio, digital-to-analog converters, turntables, phono stages, cartridges, reel-to-reel tape machines, speakers, headphones and tube and solid-state amplification. Founded in 2010 What’s Best Forum invites intelligent and courteous people of all interests and backgrounds to describe and discuss the best of everything. From beginners to life-long hobbyists to industry professionals, we enjoy learning about new things and meeting new people, and participating in spirited debates.

Quick Navigation

User Menu

Steve Williams
Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator
Ron Resnick
Site Co-Owner | Administrator
Julian (The Fixer)
Website Build | Marketing Managersing