Kondo Overture

jep123

VIP/Donor
Dec 23, 2012
251
42
268
Norway
I am considering a version1 of this integrated amplifier. Does anybody have any experiences with this amp? Problems of any kind?
Should be a very high quality device, any feedback is welcome.

I have the Tobian Acoustics 12 FH horn speakers so power is not an issue of course.

JP
 

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
16,937
6,580
1,215
London
I am considering a version1 of this integrated amplifier. Does anybody have any experiences with this amp? Problems of any kind?
Should be a very high quality device, any feedback is welcome.

I have the Tobian Acoustics 12 FH horn speakers so power is not an issue of course.

JP

This is the EL34 push pull, 30w. I heard it on devore orangutans and didn't like it. Didn't try other amps in the same room, but I heard many amps on the devores and most were better, especially the NAF 2a3 integrated and the airtight integrated 300b, in comparison. But then most electronics are usually better than Kondo, just priced less. I don't know your horns and how much power they need, but there will be many more better sounding cheaper SETs, pentodes, or push pulls around. You first need to find out if you need below 10w, below 20w, or 40w. Not all horns are high sensitive and efficient across drivers
 

hogen

Well-Known Member
May 15, 2018
85
43
83
Oslo, Norway
I am considering a version1 of this integrated amplifier. Does anybody have any experiences with this amp? Problems of any kind?
Should be a very high quality device, any feedback is welcome.

I have the Tobian Acoustics 12 FH horn speakers so power is not an issue of course.

JP
I am using Kondo Overture with Avantgarde Uno XD in my second system, and I am very happy with it. I also have friends using it with Mezzo Duo with very good result. It is in my opinion a very high quality amplifier. I have nor heard of any problems with it.
 

jep123

VIP/Donor
Dec 23, 2012
251
42
268
Norway
Opinions will of course differ when asking these kind of questions, thank you all. My speakers are Swiss made and of very high quality, 99 dB sens. I need only 5-7 watts and will try the Overture over the weekend. I am also thinking about the new Audio Note UK Meishu Tonmeister with 300B tubes.

My « in between amp» is the Polish Fezz with 4 Psvane 300 WE tubes and it is surprisingly good. The Tobians are my first horn speakers and I am enjoying them immensly after 30 years + with normal high end speakers. So next up is high quality integrated,
 

Klonk

Well-Known Member
Mar 4, 2012
31
14
313
Hi jep123, have you tried Tobians amp, they must be a good match for the speakers?
 

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
16,937
6,580
1,215
London
Opinions will of course differ when asking these kind of questions, thank you all. My speakers are Swiss made and of very high quality, 99 dB sens. I need only 5-7 watts and will try the Overture over the weekend. I am also thinking about the new Audio Note UK Meishu Tonmeister with 300B tubes.

My « in between amp» is the Polish Fezz with 4 Psvane 300 WE tubes and it is surprisingly good. The Tobians are my first horn speakers and I am enjoying them immensly after 30 years + with normal high end speakers. So next up is high quality integrated,

If it's your first amp speaker experiment with a few amps before spending so much. If you think 5 - 7 watts is sufficient, stick to low watt amps. On the used market, NAF 2a3, airtight 300b will be around 10w, the audio note empress silver (used price around 7 to 8k euro) is excellent 2a3 at 6w. Same wattage audionote neiro, which is a model up. If the push pull 2a3 works, you can always try Kondo souga if you want Kondo.

When you try amps, roll good tubes.

If you can, find local friends or small manufacturers who will usually have a variety of low watt amps. They are easily transportable so you can get to demo many.
 

jep123

VIP/Donor
Dec 23, 2012
251
42
268
Norway
If it's your first amp speaker experiment with a few amps before spending so much. If you think 5 - 7 watts is sufficient, stick to low watt amps. On the used market, NAF 2a3, airtight 300b will be around 10w, the audio note empress silver (used price around 7 to 8k euro) is excellent 2a3 at 6w. Same wattage audionote neiro, which is a model up. If the push pull 2a3 works, you can always try Kondo souga if you want Kondo.

When you try amps, roll good tubes.

If you can, find local friends or small manufacturers who will usually have a variety of low watt amps. They are easily transportable so you can get to demo many.
Thanks. Like I said, a horn/SET based system is a complete new direction for me. And I regret that I haven`t done it before! The Kondo Overture is in my neighbourhood and I am trying it to hear what a Kondo can sound like with my speakers. This amp is equipped with very good tubes, I have never listened to a Kondo in my own system before.

Yes, there are many good alternatives like Wavac, Audio Note UK +++ Thanks.

JP
 

morricab

Well-Known Member
Apr 25, 2014
5,923
2,194
453
Switzerland
Thanks. Like I said, a horn/SET based system is a complete new direction for me. And I regret that I haven`t done it before! The Kondo Overture is in my neighbourhood and I am trying it to hear what a Kondo can sound like with my speakers. This amp is equipped with very good tubes, I have never listened to a Kondo in my own system before.

Yes, there are many good alternatives like Wavac, Audio Note UK +++ Thanks.

JP
You should give an Aries Cerat Genus a try.
 

Surge1

Active Member
Feb 12, 2021
81
114
35
46
I was sold on Kondo Japan (Not AN UK!!) as the ultimate solution for very high efficient speakers, so I built my system around the Souga, M77, and Sfz SUT. The tonearm is the SME V12 with Kondo wiring, the same as what Kondo used in their Ginga turntable (neither of which you can buy anymore).
I’ve heard many systems, often more expensive, that just sounded “flat” - the sense of realism, the emotion, was just missing from the music.
You can’t really beat a low watt amp built to a cost-no-object spec, with very efficient speakers and a first-order crossover.
 

LL21

Well-Known Member
Dec 26, 2010
12,745
1,253
588
Thanks. Like I said, a horn/SET based system is a complete new direction for me. And I regret that I haven`t done it before! The Kondo Overture is in my neighbourhood and I am trying it to hear what a Kondo can sound like with my speakers. This amp is equipped with very good tubes, I have never listened to a Kondo in my own system before.

Yes, there are many good alternatives like Wavac, Audio Note UK +++ Thanks.

JP
Hi...congrats and fascinating. As an adjunct to your discussion around fantastic, pure, SET amps, what made you go in this direction after, as you say, traditional (presumably purely cone) speaker designs? I was just saying to someone that while I am a huge fan of panels (Alsyvox is certainly interesting)...i feel like if I moved away from the XLF someday (highly unlikely for many years to come)...I would wish to thoroughly explore horns first.
 

Surge1

Active Member
Feb 12, 2021
81
114
35
46
Hi, thanks. If done right, nothing beats horns. I’m talking about conical horns (not exponential which often color the sound) like Living Voice or some of the Oswald’s Mill OMA horns. When I listened to OMA’s flagship, I was blown away.
I then realized that OMA just basically borrowed/stole ideas from the community, hired a designer, and called it their own products. And I also realized that OMA’s founder is a complete *sshole. So rather than buying a set from him (BTW, his base amp is woefully underpowered for the Mini horns he sells, and he won’t admit it... just do the math on Watts required to reach 105 dB peaks), I did some research and used the same ideas he copied to design my own 3-way horn system. I then hired an excellent speaker designer and builder to build them.
I’m using the vaunted RCA 1443 midrange field coil, which cover something like 200 - 8000 hz, which I don’t think is matched by any driver today — not clean and flat anyway. Anyway, I’m digressing...

After hearing the OMA horn system, it just made sense to me that you want as few watts as possible for the most realistic sound. Realism is all we are after, ultimately.
I have not heard flat panels. Again, it just made intuitive sense that you want as few watts as possible in as efficient a speaker as possible - and horns add incredible efficiency, speed, etc.
 
  • Like
Reactions: morricab

morricab

Well-Known Member
Apr 25, 2014
5,923
2,194
453
Switzerland
Hi...congrats and fascinating. As an adjunct to your discussion around fantastic, pure, SET amps, what made you go in this direction after, as you say, traditional (presumably purely cone) speaker designs? I was just saying to someone that while I am a huge fan of panels (Alsyvox is certainly interesting)...i feel like if I moved away from the XLF someday (highly unlikely for many years to come)...I would wish to thoroughly explore horns first.
Should’ve done that before getting more of the same...;)
 

LL21

Well-Known Member
Dec 26, 2010
12,745
1,253
588
Should’ve done that before getting more of the same...;)
its perfectly fine...I know that in order to get all out assault scale, horns need to be HUGE in comparison to cones like the XLFs. The footprint is 27 inches by 20 inches, and the height 6 feet which, with 11 feet in ceiling height, is perfectly manageable. I could not however, spare much more floor area.

Every major cones ends up 1m in width or length or both...plus to get deep propulsive bass properly to match, it takes up further space.

And I have to say, as I bed the XLFs in...they are really starting to come into their own.
 

Surge1

Active Member
Feb 12, 2021
81
114
35
46
Usually, but not always. Mine are about 6 feet tall but only about 2 feet wide and 3 feet deep. The trick is a folded horn for the upper bass (think Klipsch La Scala) and a separate sub or two. Note that the sub has to fast to keep up with the horns. I use a custom made transmission line - it’s also 6 feet tall but only about 1 ft x 0.5 ft wide and deep. My room is small, so I couldn’t fit massive horns.
 
  • Like
Reactions: morricab

morricab

Well-Known Member
Apr 25, 2014
5,923
2,194
453
Switzerland
its perfectly fine...I know that in order to get all out assault scale, horns need to be HUGE in comparison to cones like the XLFs. The footprint is 27 inches by 20 inches, and the height 6 feet which, with 11 feet in ceiling height, is perfectly manageable. I could not however, spare much more floor area.

Every major cones ends up 1m in width or length or both...plus to get deep propulsive bass properly to match, it takes up further space.

And I have to say, as I bed the XLFs in...they are really starting to come into their own.
They don’t have to be that big. They can be augmented with dipole bass subs (I have found it hard to match them with normal subs). They dynamics will be there because of the horn loading and use of high sensitivity drivers.

IMO, deep propulsive bass is not a prerequisite for realistic sound for most music. I have had systems with that kind of bass (Infinity IRS Beta, Genesis VI, Acoustat Spectra 4400) and while it helped with big orchestra or electronica, it didn’t help at all with jazz or smaller classical ensembles or most rock, which seems to need midbass punch more.
 

morricab

Well-Known Member
Apr 25, 2014
5,923
2,194
453
Switzerland
Usually, but not always. Mine are about 6 feet tall but only about 2 feet wide and 3 feet deep. The trick is a folded horn for the upper bass (think Klipsch La Scala) and a separate sub or two. Note that the sub has to fast to keep up with the horns. I use a custom made transmission line - it’s also 6 feet tall but only about 1 ft x 0.5 ft wide and deep. My room is small, so I couldn’t fit massive horns.
Yes, once you fold the horn it no longer becomes an outrageous proposition to put in a horn system. There are some pro subs that are a mix of horn and reflex...I wonder how those might work...
 

LL21

Well-Known Member
Dec 26, 2010
12,745
1,253
588
They don’t have to be that big. They can be augmented with dipole bass subs (I have found it hard to match them with normal subs). They dynamics will be there because of the horn loading and use of high sensitivity drivers.

IMO, deep propulsive bass is not a prerequisite for realistic sound for most music. I have had systems with that kind of bass (Infinity IRS Beta, Genesis VI, Acoustat Spectra 4400) and while it helped with big orchestra or electronica, it didn’t help at all with jazz or smaller classical ensembles or most rock, which seems to need midbass punch more.
Thanks Morricab...for me the sub even on the big XLFs delivers a sense of the venue and spacial cues which are now a 'must have' having lived with it for years. The jazz club suddenly collapses to just between and behind the speakers...whereas with the sub on...completely cut off above 40hz and nearly completely cut off above 37hz...the venue space really creates the sense of all around you. Not sure how/why, but as soon as you mute the sub...the entire club collapses and it feels like when you move or hear a piece of paper rustle, it 'kills' the atmosphere of the club because the sound in the room is the actual sound of the room...whereas with the sub, it is able to combat some of that sense and immerse you more into the venue.
 

LL21

Well-Known Member
Dec 26, 2010
12,745
1,253
588
Usually, but not always. Mine are about 6 feet tall but only about 2 feet wide and 3 feet deep. The trick is a folded horn for the upper bass (think Klipsch La Scala) and a separate sub or two. Note that the sub has to fast to keep up with the horns. I use a custom made transmission line - it’s also 6 feet tall but only about 1 ft x 0.5 ft wide and deep. My room is small, so I couldn’t fit massive horns.
Interesting and thanks...let me go back to read more about your speakers.
 

About us

  • What’s Best Forum is THE forum for high end audio, product reviews, advice and sharing experiences on the best of everything else. This is THE place where audiophiles and audio companies discuss vintage, contemporary and new audio products, music servers, music streamers, computer audio, digital-to-analog converters, turntables, phono stages, cartridges, reel-to-reel tape machines, speakers, headphones and tube and solid-state amplification. Founded in 2010 What’s Best Forum invites intelligent and courteous people of all interests and backgrounds to describe and discuss the best of everything. From beginners to life-long hobbyists to industry professionals, we enjoy learning about new things and meeting new people, and participating in spirited debates.

Quick Navigation

User Menu

Steve Williams
Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator
Ron Resnick
Site Co-Owner | Administrator
Julian (The Fixer)
Website Build | Marketing Managersing