Cartridge torque wrench

[scot]

Hi Everyone

Do you use a torque wrench to tighten the cartridge bolts or do you just use a regular screw driver or Allen key? If you use a torque wrench, which one did you buy and where did you get it from? Where do you find the torque specs for your cartridge? Thank you.

Best regards
Scot

 

[tima]

Hi Everyone

Do you use a torque wrench to tighten the cartridge bolts or do you just use a regular screw driver or Allen key? If you use a torque wrench, which one did you buy and where did you get it from? Where do you find the torque specs for your cartridge? Thank you.

Best regards
Scot

Richard Mak, who created Analog Magik, sells a torque wrench designed for cartridges.

AnalogMagik Torque Wrench for Cartridge Headshell Screws

Determing the proper torque for headshell screws. The AnalogMagik Torque Driver Kit provides drive bits, Teflon Washers, as well as a precision calibrated Torque Wrench, so you can accurately optimize the torque level for your headshell to deliver the best possible performance.

www.analogmagik.com

There's a thread on this here:

Adjustable Torque Screwdriver for cartridge screws

Hello, I have read that the precise amount of torque that is applied to the screws that fix the cartridge is very important, and that minute changes, as small as 0.01Nm, can make a diffence in the sound. One Linn dealer described his use of a Sturtevant Richmont CAL 36/4 adjustable torque...

www.whatsbestforum.com

 

[audioblazer]

Albert porter , audiogon used to sell such torque wrench

 

[ddk]

… a torque wrench designed for cartridges.

With so many headshell/screw/cartridge/washer/nut/ possible combinations and variations what does this even mean? How do you distinguish between setup sound and correct screw torque? What are you listening for and which reference track while torquing?


david

 

[scot]

Hi Guys

Thank you for your responses. I will check out the AnalogMagik torque wrench. I didn't even know they made one. Take care.

Best Scot

 

[Uk Paul]

This is what I use, I can look up the code numbers of the removeable tips if interested.. https://products.wera.de/en/torque_...riable_torque_adjustment_models_1430_esd.html

Rgds,
Paul

 

[tima]

With so many headshell/screw/cartridge/washer/nut/ possible combinations and variations what does this even mean? How do you distinguish between setup sound and correct screw torque? What are you listening for and which reference track while torquing?


david

If I understand him correctly, Richard Mak's torque wrench setting is fixed at a specific newton meter value that he believes is optimal. There is no correlation for the end user to make between sound and setup torque because Mak says he has already done that through his own listening tests.

Mak: "Through hundreds of hours of measurement, trial and error, and listening test, we have discovered the optimal torque level is between 0.60 inch lbs to 0.70 inch lbs, with a slight variation when using different materials (eg. Titanium vs Aluminum Screws). "

He strikes me as very much a measurement based results guy. If I remember right he advocates setting VTA using intermodulation distortion measurement (IMD) which his Analog Majik claims to measure.

Be that as it may, I find Mak one of the better reviewers out there. He is conscientious, reads well, has good taste in music and typically knows his subject.

 

[ddk]

If I understand him correctly, Richard Mak's torque wrench setting is fixed at a specific newton meter value that he believes is optimal. There is no correlation for the end user to make between sound and setup torque because Mak says he has already done that through his own listening tests.

Mak: "Through hundreds of hours of measurement, trial and error, and listening test, we have discovered the optimal torque level is between 0.60 inch lbs to 0.70 inch lbs, with a slight variation when using different materials (eg. Titanium vs Aluminum Screws). "

He strikes me as very much a measurement based results guy. If I remember right he advocates setting VTA using intermodulation distortion measurement (IMD) which his Analog Majik claims to measure.

Be that as it may, I find Mak one of the better reviewers out there. He is conscientious, reads well, has good taste in music and typically knows his subject.

So listening be damned? Measurements are fine and might or might not get you in the ballpark but Sound Is the ultimate gauge in this case.

david

 

[scot]

Hi ddk

I was skeptical at first and thought to myself, how do I figure out the torque specs for each cartridge?

I asked Dietrich Brakemeier, if you don’t know who Dietrich is, he is a brilliant German engineer who designed the SMARTractor protractor which is arguably the best and most accurate protractor you could buy. He also is the designer of the Axiom tonearm that many audiophiles feel is one of the best tonearms out there, not to mention his Apolyt turntable that sells for several hundred thousand dollars etc.

He explained it to me like this, the cartridge has nothing to do with it. It’s the bolt that secures the cartridge to the tonearm, specifically the bolt material.

There are many different types of cartridge bolts that can be used to secure the cartridge to the tonearm. They all have different weights and torque specs. Some examples are, aluminum, brass, stainless steel, nylon, titanium just to name a few. All of these materials have different torque specs that can be found in engineering journals. Dietrich has done extensive research on all of them. He feels that making sure the bolts are torqued to the correct spec and that they are evenly torqued is not only audible buy very important for the best energy transfer. He feels titanium is the best material for proper energy transfer.

So, it has nothing to do with all the variables you mentioned in your post, it’s all about the bolt material. Once that was explained to me, it made perfect sense. Take care.

Best regards
Scot

P.s. for those interested, Acoustical Systems (Dietrich’s website) sells titanium cartridge bolts. TECHDAS used to but they no longer do for whatever reason.

 

[ddk]

Hi ddk

I was skeptical at first and thought to myself, how do I figure out the torque specs for each cartridge?

I asked Dietrich Brakemeier, if you don’t know who Dietrich is, he is a brilliant German engineer who designed the SMARTractor protractor which is arguably the best and most accurate protractor you could buy. He also is the designer of the Axiom tonearm that many audiophiles feel is one of the best tonearms out there, not to mention his Apolyt turntable that sells for several hundred thousand dollars etc.

He explained it to me like this, the cartridge has nothing to do with it. It’s the bolt that secures the cartridge to the tonearm, specifically the bolt material.

There are many different types of cartridge bolts that can be used to secure the cartridge to the tonearm. They all have different weights and torque specs. Some examples are, aluminum, brass, stainless steel, nylon, titanium just to name a few. All of these materials have different torque specs that can be found in engineering journals. Dietrich has done extensive research on all of them. He feels that making sure the bolts are torqued to the correct spec and that they are evenly torqued is not only audible buy very important for the best energy transfer. He feels titanium is the best material for proper energy transfer.

So, it has nothing to do with all the variables you mentioned in your post, it’s all about the bolt material. Once that was explained to me, it made perfect sense. Take care.

Best regards
Scot

P.s. for those interested, Acoustical Systems (Dietrich’s website) sells titanium cartridge bolts. TECHDAS used to but they no longer do for whatever reason.

Hi Scot,

No one is arguing that torque, screw size, mass and materials don't have an affect on sound as does the cartridge body, headshell design, materials along with the tonearm, connection type, cabling, on and on an on. I know Dietrich and I'm curious to know how torque figures in an engineering journal translates to cartridges and without any defined parameters one claims best torque and best sound, also according to whom and which criteria? FYI the SMARtractor is based on a Dennesen SoundTractor that's been around for a few decades.

My suggestion to every audiophile is not to be overly impressed with any member of this industry including myself as not to question them and believe everything they claim. Fact is that anyone can be wrong or make a mistake!

david

 

[tima]

I was skeptical at first and thought to myself, how do I figure out the torque specs for each cartridge?

So, it has nothing to do with all the variables you mentioned in your post, it’s all about the bolt material. Once that was explained to me, it made perfect sense.

So... it's all about bolt material. How do you figure the torque specs to use for a particular cartridge?

 

[scot]

hi tima

The cartridge has nothing to do with properly tightening down the cartridge to the tonearm. The actual bolt is what’s securing the cartridge. You must lookup the torque spec for the TYPE of bolt you’re using. If you’re using a titanium bolt, then you would want to look up the spec for titanium. If you’re using stainless steel bolts, you would torque those bolts down to the specs provided for stainless steel. It’s also important that you tighten both of the bolts evenly. The goal is to tighten the cartridge (whichever one) down so it’s as tight as possible without tightening it too much. This is simply not possible to do without an accurate torque wrench. This will transfer the energy better from cartridge to tonearm which will improve dynamics. Take care.

Best regards
Scot

 

[djsina2]

This will transfer the energy better from cartridge to tonearm which will improve dynamics.

Can you please explain more about this and tell us how you measured the dynamics at the different torque specs? Would like to see your chart of torque to dynamics if possible.

 

[ddk]

hi tima

The cartridge has nothing to do with properly tightening down the cartridge to the tonearm. The actual bolt is what’s securing the cartridge. You must lookup the torque spec for the TYPE of bolt you’re using. If you’re using a titanium bolt, then you would want to look up the spec for titanium. If you’re using stainless steel bolts, you would torque those bolts down to the specs provided for stainless steel. It’s also important that you tighten both of the bolts evenly. The goal is to tighten the cartridge (whichever one) down so it’s as tight as possible without tightening it too much. This is simply not possible to do without an accurate torque wrench. This will transfer the energy better from cartridge to tonearm which will improve dynamics. Take care.

Best regards
Scot

So you torque a soft wood bodied cartridge in a thin wooden headshell as tight a titanium bodied cartridge in a heavy steel headshell and you'd end up with ideal sound in both cases because Brakemeier told you that he looked it up in some book?

david

 

[tima]

Here i

So you torque a soft wood bodied cartridge in a thin wooden headshell as tight a titanium bodied cartridge in a heavy steel headshell and you'd end up with ideal sound in both cases

David - similar to the question I was typing.

The cartridge has nothing to do with properly tightening down the cartridge to the tonearm

"So, you're saying it does not matter what the cartridge body is made of, eg. steel, plastic, wood?"

I dug around a bit. Calculating the torque for a particular metal screw requires information about the screw. Not quite a simple lookup by metal type.

Metric Bolts - Tightening Torques

Recommended thightening torque metric bolts.

www.engineeringtoolbox.com

Bolt Torque Calculator - Determining Proper Torque to Bolt | Bayou City Bolt & Supply

Bolts and screws are so ubiquitous that it’s impossible to fully articulate their importance or applications. Contact Bayou City Bolt for more info today!

www.bayoucitybolt.com

Shure cartridge mounting screws are spec'd as:

#3-48 UNC 2A
#3 = the screw diameter. Slightly less than 1/10 of an inch (2.5 mm).
48 = 48 threads per inch

UNC = Unified National Coarse (type of thread)
2 = thread precision (average)
A = external thread (B = internal thread like on a nut)

The length of the mounting screw varies based on the thickness of phono cartridge body. Typical lengths are 1/2 inch (13mm) to 7/8 inch (22 mm). The cartridge body has a slot through which the fastening screw passes: the diameter of this slot is typically 1/8".

Cartridge Screws

When you made everything right for getting a superior analog Playback experience (Divorce, 10k Phono Cable, spending 60h for cartridge adjustment with everything available, cross-check with a borrowed dog which is trained for detecting distortions...) and your are happy... but sometimes you get...

www.whatsbestforum.com

 

[howiebrou]

My technique is tried and tested and idiot proof. Tighten until you hear a crack. Then back up half a turn.

 

[tima]

My technique is tried and tested and idiot proof. Tighten until you hear a crack. Then back up half a turn.

I gather yout don't have a Master Sig.

 

[howiebrou]

I gather yout don't have a Master Sig.

Not sure if this post has a hidden meaning but yes I do

 

[tima]

Not sure if this post has a hidden meaning but yes I do

If it does have a hidden meaning, I canna remember where I put it.

Just thinking of torquing a wood body cartridge until you hear a crack.
It was painful to imagine.

 

[howiebrou]

If it does have a hidden meaning, I canna remember where I put it.

Just thinking of torquing a wood body cartridge until you hear a crack.
It was painful to imagine.

Ah yes, that would be rather tragic. I use the Analog Magik torque screwdriver.