Audiogon or Audiogarbage?

MCLSOUND

New Member
Mar 26, 2011
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#1
I have been hunting for a few choice items over the last couple of months,well 6 or 7 to be exact and found Agon to be full of overpriced garbage and what seems like Ebay leftovers joined up .I used to think that it had a fair amount of class over junk but now it seems like more junk than class.In 6mths,I still see the same adds repeating themselves over n over.And the Dealers are all onboard now,so the used prices seem to be ramped up.
Why buy used Bryston 7bsst for $4500 that are 8yrs old when newer 7bsst2 are $5300 used.Cmon guys get with the program,dropp those prices to $38 or $3900 and you ""MAY"" sell it.
Krell FPB 300 that are due for caps on the auction block starting at $3000 with busted up knobs and no box.
and the list is long.

Just my ranting I suppose.
 

Elberoth

Member Sponsor
Dec 16, 2012
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Poland
#2
I always use 'make an offer' option when I think that the price is too high.
 

edorr

WBF Founding Member
May 11, 2010
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#4
So there is this guy on Audiogon listing 12 year old Transparent audio reference cables that sold for $6K a pair over a decade ago. He lists them at $12,000 for three, new price $36,000. I send him a message, pointing out he is misleading buyers with the stated new price of $36K. Below is the dialogue than ensued. I wonder if audiogon will step in....


edorrMarch 16, 2013 12:33pm
You got to be kiddin'. These sold for $6000 a pair brand new over a decade ago. I bought a pair of the exact same model used two years ago for $1,200. Good luck selling!

spacecowboy123dallasMarch 17, 2013 4:43pm
Really not sure what there worth but I sold a set of 15 foot cables for 10,,000 last month. They sold in 1 week. Why the F^*&K does it mater to you ? **** off you nosy dork.

edorrMarch 17, 2013 5:35pm
It matters to me because this is a community based on trust, and I hate some piece of **** scam artists abuse this trust, taking advantage of buyers igonance.

If you can find a sucker to overpay for a 12 year old cable fine, but deliberately mistating the new price of a piece of equipment, in my book is deceipt. I reported you to audiogon and hope they'll take your ad down and ban you from the forum.

spacecowboy123dallasMarch 17, 2013 6:14pm
Oh no, The Audiogon police. I literally falling out of my chair laughing out loud. What a dork.

edorrMarch 17, 2013 6:23pm
I would be laughing too if I just swindled someone out of $10K. Come to think of it, I wouldn't. Unlike losers like you, I would feel precisely like the piece of **** I was.

spacecowboy123dallasMarch 17, 2013 6:56pm
:) I am soooooo hurt. Lol. You have to be one of the biggest dorks. Go play hall monitor some more. I could care lees what a little bitch like you thinks.

edorrMarch 17, 2013 7:04pm
That is a common characteristic of sociopaths like yourself. They don't give a **** about what anyone thinks. If they did they would not be able to swindle people out of their money and live with themselves. Bloodsucking scumbags they are.
 

edorr

WBF Founding Member
May 11, 2010
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#8
$100K+ for new YG speakers retail but on the 'Gon for $30K. Do you ream the manufacturers for asking crazy $$$?
You are missing the point. He is not selling cables that actually ever cost $36,000 for $12,000. These cables cost $9,000 brand new over a decade ago and he is offering them for $12,000. He is taking advantage of confusion about Transparent Audio's extremely confusing models naming and pricing.
 

treitz3

Super Moderator
#9
Caveat emptor.

Tom
 

edorr

WBF Founding Member
May 11, 2010
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#10
It appears Audiogon acted on my "fraud alert" and has taken down both the ad for $12,000 speaker cables (worth $3,000), and $10,000 ICs (worth $2000). Kudo's to audiogon. They also suspendd the scammer. For once they got it right. Way to go.
 
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MCLSOUND

New Member
Mar 26, 2011
105
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#11
$100K+ for new YG speakers retail but on the 'Gon for $30K. Do you ream the manufacturers for asking crazy $$$?
Yup,I do
It sickens me how these retailers put out these prices and a week later they are 40% cheaper because some poor smuck dealership is going broke.I have no remorse for him...and thats also why I dont buy my car new.

Back on track......Edorr,CONGRATS my friend at getting rid of one MF.If we all could do a good deed this would help clean up the Agon BS.I see many guys on here that probably just look and laugh/do f**k all to help except through out baby remarks about sandboxes.
Agon was a good spot for many years but it is turning into a bit of a joke with scammers and dealers alike.I love our Canuck audio mart and they are spreading their wings now,but they have a ways to go.
I have policed a bit on there now n then when I can.
 

caesar

Active Member
May 31, 2010
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#12
Yup,I do
It sickens me how these retailers put out these prices and a week later they are 40% cheaper because some poor smuck dealership is going broke.I have no remorse for him...and thats also why I dont buy my car new.

Back on track......Edorr,CONGRATS my friend at getting rid of one MF.If we all could do a good deed this would help clean up the Agon BS.I see many guys on here that probably just look and laugh/do f**k all to help except through out baby remarks about sandboxes.
Agon was a good spot for many years but it is turning into a bit of a joke with scammers and dealers alike.I love our Canuck audio mart and they are spreading their wings now,but they have a ways to go.
I have policed a bit on there now n then when I can.
Gentlemen, finding people you trust has been difficult since time immemorial. An honest broker/ individual with a great reputation to do business with is probably the third oldest profession on earth (spying is the second oldest profession).

Despite Audiogon's difficulties, I think the upstarts have a herculean task of unseating Audiogon because of a lot of guys with great reputations that have done business there for years. Anyone trying to take on facebook or ebay these days? If people don't trust audiogon, why trust any of the newer sites? No one has an established reputation on the new sites. Why wouldn't the scammers flock to these new sites?

The solution is simple: do your due diligence and use your paypal/ credit card as tender.
 

edorr

WBF Founding Member
May 11, 2010
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#13
Gentlemen, finding people you trust has been difficult since time immemorial. An honest broker/ individual with a great reputation to do business with is probably the third oldest profession on earth (spying is the second oldest profession).
I beg to differ. In my experience, the vast majority people can be trusted, including buyers/sellers on audiogon. I have been buying and selling on a handshake in cyberspace, and never had a problem. Including a number of intercontinental transactions. I have the same experience in business. The issue is identifying the odd rotten apple. Having said that, it is probably true (and a sign of the time) that the percentage of rotten apples on audiogon is increasing, so vigilance is of the essence.
 

mep

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 21, 2010
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#14
Thankfully, I think most scammers are easy to spot. Prices too good to be true, foreign countries, and no feedback are all dead giveaways.
 
Aug 26, 2012
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#15
Thankfully, I think most scammers are easy to spot. Prices too good to be true, foreign countries, and no feedback are all dead giveaways.
Yes easy to spot .. but some high feedback accounts have been hacked . A sometimes good x-check is to go thru the discussion posts and see if products discussed are in line with that being sold . Just a rough bench mark . Came across a seller whose discussion posts were mainly anlog ,TT and vintage equipment selling an Esoteric P-01 transport ... turned out as expected .... scammer !!
 

caesar

Active Member
May 31, 2010
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#16
I beg to differ. In my experience, the vast majority people can be trusted, including buyers/sellers on audiogon. I have been buying and selling on a handshake in cyberspace, and never had a problem. Including a number of intercontinental transactions. I have the same experience in business. The issue is identifying the odd rotten apple. Having said that, it is probably true (and a sign of the time) that the percentage of rotten apples on audiogon is increasing, so vigilance is of the essence.
Edorr, you obviously have a great soul. What can I say? But not everyone is like you. When some folks hear the words, "trust me", they automatically reply "UCKF YOU", at least under their breath. This usually comes about from experience. You hear stories of guys in this hobby mailing their 5-figure checks to others and never receiving their gear. Now fortunately, not everyone is like that. I'm actually in the middle of the spectrum on this. My motto is trust but verify, and you screw me once, I will never deal with you again. But I had my baseball glove borrowed and never returned at camp and I remember my brother losing his bike to "new friends" who just rode away.

I think we all wish that you could simply "undo" transactions as simply as you could undo wrong keyboard or mouse strokes using Word or Excel. Looking at business/ social network history, back in the 11th century, the Maghribi Traders created a social business network based on reputation and trust. The Maghribis only employed other Maghribis that they trusted. If anyone violated the trust, all commercial activities ceased with those individuals. Using these same principles, companies like eBay and Paypall today are so successful, because they not only let people "undo" bad transactions, but they also incentivize individuals to protect their reputations. And because of existing members' reputations, it will be so difficult for these upstart web sites to overtake the incumbent audiogon.
 
Feb 11, 2012
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Hangzhou, China
#17
Edorr, you obviously have a great soul. What can I say? But not everyone is like you. When some folks hear the words, "trust me", they automatically reply "UCKF YOU", at least under their breath.
I agree with edorr on this but I'd still run a mile from anyone who says 'trust me'. Honest brokers don't tend to do this in my experience, they realize that uttering the words 'trust me' will have the opposite effect, and for very good reason. 'The one who knows does not speak, he who speaks does not know.'
 

edorr

WBF Founding Member
May 11, 2010
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#18
Edorr, you obviously have a great soul. What can I say? But not everyone is like you. When some folks hear the words, "trust me", they automatically reply "UCKF YOU", at least under their breath. This usually comes about from experience. You hear stories of guys in this hobby mailing their 5-figure checks to others and never receiving their gear. Now fortunately, not everyone is like that. I'm actually in the middle of the spectrum on this. My motto is trust but verify, and you screw me once, I will never deal with you again. But I had my baseball glove borrowed and never returned at camp and I remember my brother losing his bike to "new friends" who just rode away.

I think we all wish that you could simply "undo" transactions as simply as you could undo wrong keyboard or mouse strokes using Word or Excel. Looking at business/ social network history, back in the 11th century, the Maghribi Traders created a social business network based on reputation and trust. The Maghribis only employed other Maghribis that they trusted. If anyone violated the trust, all commercial activities ceased with those individuals. Using these same principles, companies like eBay and Paypall today are so successful, because they not only let people "undo" bad transactions, but they also incentivize individuals to protect their reputations. And because of existing members' reputations, it will be so difficult for these upstart web sites to overtake the incumbent audiogon.
Not a great soul, just a sixth sense for knowing who can be trusted. Five seconds on the phone, a few lines in an email and I know if I deal with a scam artist or not. It goes back to childhood. My father was a BS artist and swindler, so I became highly sensitized to their cues. I maintain they are the 1%.
 

edorr

WBF Founding Member
May 11, 2010
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#19
I agree with edorr on this but I'd still run a mile from anyone who says 'trust me'. Honest brokers don't tend to do this in my experience, they realize that uttering the words 'trust me' will have the opposite effect, and for very good reason. 'The one who knows does not speak, he who speaks does not know.'
How long does it take to recognize someone cold calling trying to sell you something? 3 seconds. Never fails. Opening line trying to instill trust. Same thing.