LP-12 owners: What's your favorite cartridge?

Bso said:

For fun, I'd like to see a 'family tree' of who 'built' which cartridges. I recall Supex and Lyra are in there somewhere....

Click to expand...

Lyra were involved in some of the high end Linn cartridges. That’s why I went to them after disappointing customer support dealing directly with Linn. The lack of Linn support in the case of the Krystal early cantilever failures was the precipitating event that pushed me out.

DasguteOhr said:

I found the art models art 1 and 9 a bit too dry and unemotional sound, the best audio technica for me AT -ml 180cc MM. If find it in good condition buy it.modern things not every time better.

Click to expand...

Interesting! That's the direction I feel the OC9 tends to be, certainly compared to the Black. Maybe the ART9 would not be for me. Haven't come across an ML180 to date. It sounds interesting though. Danke!
I agree, just because something is new it doesn't always make it better. Different in some areas perhaps, but not necessarily always better.

Another Johnson said:

Lyra were involved in some of the high end Linn cartridges. That’s why I went to them after disappointing customer support dealing directly with Linn. The lack of Linn support in the case of the Krystal early cantilever failures was the precipitating event that pushed me out.

Click to expand...

That's not good to hear!
I have only had two Linn cartridges, a K9 and the Klyde. Neither had issues, sounded ok, but neither excited me like some other carts I have owned. I was going to take a look at the Krystal, and may still do so. Lyra (the less expensive ones) are on the list too.

When I had a Linn LP12/ Ittok, I used a Fidelity Research FR1-mk3F. Decades later I changed it for an Ortofon Kontrapunkt B that I still have today. The Ortofon is a wonderful cartridge. Unfortunately I sold the LP 12 to a friend. Happenstance never allowed me to purchase a Linn MC whilst I had the LP12.

Is the Krystal 'mk. 2 ' still available?

new2Krell said:

That's not good to hear!
I have only had two Linn cartridges, a K9 and the Klyde. Neither had issues, sounded ok, but neither excited me like some other carts I have owned. I was going to take a look at the Krystal, and may still do so. Lyra (the less expensive ones) are on the list too.

Click to expand...

You must go to old linn carts they made by supex sugano san asak,troika, karma or supex 900 super(simlar koetsu rosewood maybe) family sound.
My favorite the karma, look at his youtube chanel linnspecialist

At ml 180cc cart detail, warmth really good deep bass with 47kohm/150pf . The holy grail of mm carts.

Keep in mind that cartridges often include elastomer damping and suspension elements. These age out. A 10 year old cartridge may have a perfect stylus, but it will not sound like it did when it was new because the suspension has changed its damping characteristics over time.

Regarding the Krystal, having owned both, I’d choose the Delos based on its smoother, more musical presentation mounted on either the late model Ittok or the Ekos SE.

Thanks guys, all your comments are noted and appreciated. While it is important to make ones own decision based on experience, it is equally important to listen to others who have also made theirs based on their own. It doesn't follow that opinions will be the same (too many variables in systems for that, not to mention ears), but I do believe that individual traits will manifest themselves in a similar manner in all systems (unless there is an obvious mis-match). Between you, you are certainly giving me food for thought.

Thinking, at the moment, I should invest in a new cart, for longevity, and also consider maybe a couple of older recommendations. It will be easier to audition new prior to purchase, which is good - quality carts clearly represent a fair investment these days, but there also appears to be some very good cartridges that I have "missed" over the years, and will likely come at greatly reduced cost, albeit with some potential risk. Thanks!

I sadly miss the old Linn/Supex range of LOMC cartridges. The original Asak wasn't much to write home about but the metal-bodied Asaka, Karma and Troika were simply amazing.

Just saw this thread. Linn Akurate LP12 with Akito 3b packaged with the Linn Krystal arrived brand new 4 years ago. The cartridge was too low a rider so asked for a replacement. Was still playing it while waiting and found the sound quite open, detailed and had good spacing. I ordered a Koetsu Urushi Tsugaru and when it came I sold the new Krystal back to the dealer for some cables. Used the Tsugaru for 4 years till last May when a Koetsu Blue Lace replaced it. Musical bliss. I love the combination.

Well, having had LOMC cartridges for almost 50 years, I finally went back to a MM. Replaced my Lyra Argo i with a RigB AT VM760SLC. Haven’t lost much at all and the tracking is much better. The exposed nude stylus/cantilever of the Lyra finally did it for me as my manual dexterity (and hearing) aren’t what they used to be!

DaveyF said:

Bringing this thread back to life. I happened to have the opportunity to do an 'AB' today against the Palmer 2.5. This is the TT that I had thought earlier would be a nice upgrade to my Linn. Today, a fellow a'phile obliged me, by bringing his Palmer equipped with the Origami PU7 arm over to listen to against my just modded LP12 with Radikal D and Kore/Cirkus.
We played a number of LP's...from Sheffield Labs well known Track LP, to the M&K LP For Duke and the under-rated (IMO) Sheffield Lab Michael Newman classical guitar LP and lastly to the Music Matters re-issue of Hank Mobley's Soul station..on 45rpm.
Well, the results were very interesting...the Palmer was, in both of our opinions, a little outclassed! While the Palmer was slightly more capable in producing the bottom end ( only really noticeable on the Track LP) it was far less able to float images, seemed to lose information on the more dense sections of the For Duke LP and was far less resolving on all the LP's. The Linn was much more capable and seemed more accurate ...particularly evident on the Michael Newman LP. My friend commented that the Linn was able to resolve the string sound of Michael's guitar with what he called a better "nylon sound".
On the 45rpm Hank Mobley, it was quite evident that the Palmer was not able to portray Hank's saxophone air as well as the LP12. Could this have been attributed to the cartridge that was on the Palmer? It is possible as the Origami was fitted with a Lyra Delos....while my WTA is fitted with a Benz Ruby 2...BUT this does seem unlikely.
Moral of this one, is that while I had pined for the Palmer before, after this experience, it is no longer on my radar. I guess the good old Linn still has the moves!

Click to expand...

This was a great read!

I wanted to add, that for anyone who feels that they have reached the end of the road with their LP12 - and is ready to invest in a whole new table - I would strongly encourage them to try one more (cheap) LP12 tweak...

The "Springless"LP12!

Imagine an LP12 with a barely suspended sub-chassis and plinth, supported only by fairly firm, clear silicone grommets under gravitational pressure. The LINN springs and grommets are totally gone!



They are called AUDIOSILENTE SILICONE MUSHROOMS and are made in Japan - originally intended for this exact purpose - for THORENS turntables.



Turns out they fit the LINN sub-chassis perfectly and have finally shown what our highly tweaked LP12 is really capable of.

It wasn't my idea, but the Kiwi and Aussie Linnies that put me on to it swore by it - and none of them have ever returned. We're a rebellious bunch, down in the colonies...

It's cheap and easy to try - and reverse - and makes perfect sense from an engineering standpoint, because it goes a long way towards solving the decades old problem of the Linn motor trying to rotate the sub-chassis - wreaking havoc on speed and flutter in the process,

We all purchased the mushrooms from the friendly and helpful Lennart from LinnArts in Sweden. He sells all manner of LP12 treasures - including genuine LINN parts and third-party items - and again, swears by the mushrooms as being the highest form of LP12 in his box of tricks.

I'm REALLY not missing the bounce at all - and there are no footfall issues with our toddler jumping around the listening room and robot vacuum-cleaner bumping the rack while spinning (never were previously, actually) - and the sound has moved-up into an entirely different league.

I'd be very happy to bat the idea around some - as this upgrade made more difference than any we have applied to our LP12 hot-rod.

For reference, our LP12 uses the STACK AUDIO ALTO sub-chassis which the AUDIO SILENTE SILICONE MUSHROOMs fitted like they were made for each other. We have the new KAROUSEL bearing and sub-platter and a highly modified ORIGIN LIVE DC motor speed control unit fed by a 160W ultra-low-noise Linear Power Supply. The original LINN ITTOK gave way to our new WAND PLUS 9.5" tonearm. Our LP12 plinth is rigidly threaded and spiked to our support, using rock-solid BLACK DIAMOND RACING CONES and we run a jointless, silicone BLUE BELT.

As for my favourite cartridge, I have to admit that after more than a decade of enjoying our SHELTER 501/2, we are really enjoying our new DENON DL-103R! It delivers a big-boned performance that gets straight to the heart of the music. The bass is deep and tight and the treble extended. A great match for the (fully weighted) WAND PLUS tonearm and there seems to be no reason to spend more.

A bonus of the DENON DL-103R is that the conical tip does not require life and death alignment. This was not the case with our SHELTER, which only came on song with absolutely perfect alignment. With the big DENON, close enough is good enough. I have tried various minute changes and they are inaudible, so I believe this to be true.

Bso said:

For fun, I'd like to see a 'family tree' of who 'built' which cartridges. I recall Supex and Lyra are in there somewhere....

Click to expand...

Here is a list of the Linn cartridge and the OEM’s that made them and the cartridge generators they were derived from. The latter part is conjecture as Linn have always claimed that these OEMs made the carts to their own design which may or may not be true depending on which ones we are talking about but its clear if you inspect them carefully where the major parts came from. Most of the time the significant difference is in the cartridge body.

Audio Technica
Basik, K5, K9, K18, K18 II were all derived from the AT95 generator
Koil, which is quite a recent cartridge, appears to be an AT OC9 XML

Supex
Asak, Asaka, Karma and Troika were all variations of the SDX-1000 generator

ScanTech (Lyra)
Arkiv, Arkiv B and Akiva were derived from the early Scantech Tsurugi
Kandid, appears to be largely related to the Kleos

Armor (Goldring)
Adikt is a rebodied 1012GX
Klyde and Krystal are variants of the Ethos and siblings

EMT
Kendo and Ekstatic appear to be derived from JSD series

SONDEKNZ said:

we are really enjoying our new DENON DL-103R! It delivers a big-boned performance that gets straight to the heart of the music. The bass is deep and tight and the treble extended.

Click to expand...

My first LOMC cartridge back in 1978 was a Denon DL103D - loosely based on the 103 but with a higher compliance and elliptical stylus. I've graduated through Linn (Supex) and Lyra MCs since then but I don't think either were substantially better than the 103D. Pity they discontinued it so long ago. My current RigB AT VM760SLC is adapting nicely to its new environment with it Lejonklou Slipsik phono stage.