MSB Diamond DAC IV Reviewed By Stereophile
- Thread starter catastrofe
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DSD is handled natively. Listened to a few SACD rips, which sounds pretty good to my ears. Have high-rez PCM and DSD channel classic tracks downloaded for an apples to apples comparison of the formats on this DAC, but not gotten around to listening yet. I will say though a well recorded/mastered PCM track sounds totally satifying and if would not miss native DSD for one minute if it was not supported by the DAC.
Native.
I even compared an actual SACD played through MSB's Universal Transport, and the corresponding SACD rip, from my Mac mini going to the DACIV's USB.
The results? Indistinguishable. Both appear as "DSD 64" on the DAC, and sound identical.
alexandre
It would be interesting to compare the SACD rip played from the server with the actual SACD disc played in my modded Oppo that does proprietary DSD to PCM conversion at 176/24 and outputs this over S/PDIF. I may do this just for kicks at some point.
Oppo just released beta firmware that'll play DSD natively. And since the DACIV accepts native DSD from all the inputs, it'll work with your Oppo.
Converting DSD to PCM brings a significant loss, no matter where the conversion is done (software in the server, DAC, etc.)
alexandre
Converting DSD to PCM brings a significant loss, no matter where the conversion is done (software in the server, DAC, etc.)
alexandre
I think the firmware will allow the Oppo to play native DSD input sources. Outputting native DSD from a SACD is a different cattle of fish, since this can only be done legally over HDMI with copyright protection. I'm pretty sure the new firmware won't let you do this.
True. I read the Stereophile report again, and it doesn't mention output. Anyway, there are transports out there that'll output unencrypted SACD via regular digital outputs, the MSB UMT being one of them
That's why I thought the Oppo would feature that...
alexandre
My understanding is the MSB is a ladder DAC. It's been beaten into my skull over and over that ladder DACs can not play DSD natively - at some point in the chain there must be conversion to PCM. Can anyone explain how MSB is able to handle DSD natively?
True. I read the Stereophile report again, and it doesn't mention output. Anyway, there are transports out there that'll output unencrypted SACD via regular digital outputs, the MSB UMT being one of them
That's why I thought the Oppo would feature that...
alexandre
Correct me if I'm wrong, but the MSB transport will only output DSD using the proprietary DSD link. Sending it out any other way (short of HDMI) would be illlegal.....
It is my understanding that if this is unencrypted DSD that works with any DSD capable DAC (not just MSB), this would be in violation of the SACD licensing agreement.
Native DSD signal can be sent out via an Asus Xonar soundcard's coaxial digital output and accepted by coaxial digital iutput of my MSB IV Plus.
I tried both HQPlayer (Linux) and JPlay & Foobar (Win7) successfully.
Here is the photo:
My understanding is that playback & transmission/transfer of DSD format digital files are legal.
However if a SACD player manufacturer wants to output DSD signal from a SACD disc, permission from SACD patent holder Sony has to be sought. Sony usually only allows transmission of this DSD stream (from SACD discs) encoded and through HDMI or proprietary connections (such as Accuphase, dCS...etc).
Native DSD signal can be sent out via an Asus Xonar soundcard's coaxial digital output and accepted by coaxial digital iutput of my MSB IV Plus.
I tried both HQPlayer (Linux) and JPlay & Foobar (Win7) successfully.
That is a different issue. You are not spinning a SACD disc so there is no licensing restiction. A SACD player cannot output unencrypted high rez. Soundcards are not a problem.
This is consistent with my understanding. So for MSB to send unencrypted DSD over S/PDIF they would need Sony permission. I am not aware of any other manufacturer being granted this permission, and if such a player existed the sale of used PS3's for ripping SACDs would take a big hit....
True. I read the Stereophile report again, and it doesn't mention output. Anyway, there are transports out there that'll output unencrypted SACD via regular digital outputs, the MSB UMT being one of them
That's why I thought the Oppo would feature that...
alexandre
---- http://www.oppodigital.com/blu-ray-bdp-103/BDP103-firmware-50-0323B.aspx
http://www.stereophile.com/content/news-flash-oppo-now-plays-dsd-files
I'm actually not surprised no one has clarified this. Its like a taboo subject. Anytime the question comes up as to how MSB (a ladder DAC) is able to handle native DSD without some form of conversion, it goes unanswered.
I personally don't loose much sleep over it. It sounds pretty good to me, and DSD content is MIA anyway. Bruce B. says his playback designs DAC sounds better on DSD than the MSB for half the price, so if DSD floats your boat MSB may not be your DAC. If money is no object get two DACs.
The same situation/taboo applies to dCS. I am curious about how its 5-bit Ring DAC directly decodes native DSD files.
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