My next Phonostage ? Boulder 2008 or CH Precision P1 or?

shakti

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@Shakti

X1 bring to P1 more weight,body,dynamic,scene more deep,less noise and more space between instrument
I tested also last week in my friend home that has P1 and i borrow him X1 for a week
Its a pity you cannot try


this would be exactly my expectations, because you describe the areas of the biggest difference between P1 and 2008.

The Boulder 2008 is since 10 years out of the market, so looking into new and available phono stages, the P1 & X1 combination is one of the new stars .

From that point of view, this comparison makes no real sense, but from the pure "fun" , this comparison is very enjoyable, just looked for some new records out of my collection to continue :)
 
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gian60

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And you can do in the next 2/3 years a big improvement buying a second P1 and a second X1 to do P1 mono with 2 X1
This will be really a very big step

In Italy P1 cost 28.500 euro and the second P1 without board cost around 21.000 euro
They will delivery to you a P1 without the 3 input for left and right channel.You take out the left input,for example,and put in the second P1 and with one cable you connect the 2 P1
Then you can buy a second board for X1 so you will have 2 P1 mono and one X1 with 2 board.
Another step you can buy a second X1 without board because you already have 2 board
A board for X1 cost 3.750 euro in Italy

This is what i would like to do in future
And later same for L1

You can ask Arnies that has L1 and P1 mono with 4 X1 and read the trial in Monoandstereo of P1 mono with 2 X1
 

CKKeung

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I think at high level with top brand you need a synergy
I have L1 P1 X1 M1 and i listen a synergy with a sound very natural and musical
Tang with all Ayon top has a perfect tube synergy and could be P1 is not perfect in his system

Agree totally!

1. System synergy.
2. Taste of the owner.
 

Tango

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That is very interesting. Is there something about the P1 you don't like or it's topology..solid state the when compared to tube phono stages ?

My system is all tube. It’s just like what Gian said and also my preferences in sound. I have never heard one single person who took out a CH from his system. I am a black sheep Christian.

Btw, don’t be suspecting ddk has something to do with this. When he was at my place the CH was already sitting on the floor and he hasn’t listened to them.

Tang :)
 

rockitman

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My system is all tube. It’s just like what Gian said and also my preferences in sound. I have never heard one single person who took out a CH from his system. I am a black sheep Christian.

Btw, don’t be suspecting ddk has something to do with this. When he was at my place the CH was already sitting on the floor and he hasn’t listened to them.

Tang :)

Thanks Tang !
 

JackD201

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My system is all tube. It’s just like what Gian said and also my preferences in sound. I have never heard one single person who took out a CH from his system. I am a black sheep Christian.

Btw, don’t be suspecting ddk has something to do with this. When he was at my place the CH was already sitting on the floor and he hasn’t listened to them.

Tang :)

How many hours have you logged on yours Tang?
 

Tango

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JackD201

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Long way from prime time Kuhn Tang.
 

Tango

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Long way from prime time Kuhn Tang.

Good for the next owner Khun Jack :).

Btw my P1 comes fully equipped with all EQ curve cards.

Tang
 

JackD201

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I guess it would :) Mine started to get really good at around the 50 hour mark. More fleshed out and even handed with the subtleties. Much needed when attack can be really quick and impactful.
 

PeterA

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Good for the next owner Khun Jack :).

Btw my P1 comes fully equipped with all EQ curve cards.

Tang

Fortunately, the former owner of my MSL Sig. Gold and AirTight Supreme cartridges listened to each for about 10 hours and decided to stay with his 8 top of the line Lyra cartridges. I benefited from his decision to sell them and bought them from him at a huge discount. I could not be happier. Some lucky guy will find Tang's P1. It all works out in the end.
 

shakti

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the former owner of my Boulder 2008 did the final Kondo step to G10 and G1000, lucky me getting the Boulder 2008.

Now I can compare further without a hassle, if I find a better alternative to the Boulder, someone else will enjoy the Boulder,
thanx to the online market places.
 

bazelio

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The Boulder 2008 has always been on my list to try. They never come available. I've been able to find a nice price on a used P1, but would have to buy it unheard. That is starting to look like a potentially risky move based on descriptions of warmth and possible veil compared to other phonos. It's a much bigger buy and sell-if-needed proposition. Now the Boulder is nagging me again. But I found a dealer with whom the VDH Grail might be available as a 45-day demo, and I've wanted hear it as well ... but it's not the XLR version, which is probably OK since my chain is unbalanced. Do you know if the balanced version of the Grail is the same as the unbalanced version when using both in unbalanced mode? A current mode phono (like P1) without the added P1 harmonics might be very good. I wish Herve' would make this easy and just release a standalone Dartzeel phono. ;-P
 

MadFloyd

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bazelio

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'added P1 harmonics' ???

A bit of an extrapolation, but: Shakti has said the P1 is warm compared to the Vdh Grail in another thread. One owner told me privately that the P1 is a bit veiled compared to even his tube phonos. And yet another told me something similar. It sounds a lot like "pleasing" harmonic distortion. What are your thoughts?
 

MadFloyd

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A bit of an extrapolation, but: Shakti has said the P1 is warm compared to the Vdh Grail in another thread. One owner told me privately that the P1 is a bit veiled compared to even his tube phonos. And yet another told me something similar. It sounds a lot like "pleasing" harmonic distortion. What are your thoughts?

I don't think there is anything about the P1 that tries to be 'pleasing' (if by pleasing you mean forgiving or warm). IMO it's a 'just the facts' type of product. It's very different from, say, the Ypsilon which has a much warmer, rounded presentation (and of course this is one of the reasons Fremer owns both - ying vs yang). I bought mine (after auditioning it) because it had incredible frequency extension on both ends and seemed very neutral in the midrange (and of course was extremely detailed). Not that long ago I compared it to the improved phono in the dartzeel NHB-18NS (series 2) and the P1 was much less warm (if that tells you anything).
 

Kcin

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......Sometimes may be the "glow" of a tube phonostage, but my Tube Amps shine enough, so with the Kondo KSL M7 it was "too much" and the resolution and control in the frequency ends was missing.

The P1 can make a very clear window into the music , the dynamic , specially with the Stradivarius is great! But some of my visiting friends were saying, that they do not get fully connected to the music. That the P1 makes too much information, too less music , not "natural" DDK would say?

Fortunately I have the option to listen to the P1 another 2 month, so I am able to find out, if I am blended by the pure amount of resolution / information.

From the tonal point of view, the P1 is same than my Thoeress, not darker not brighter.

Some listeners recommend the CHP X1 power supply, which might be the best solution, but even having a good offer for the P1, the X1 would boost my budget ( I like to spent currently) easily. But as a later purchase of the X1 is possible, I would give the X1 a try, but in my region is currently a X1 not available for a home test .

Switching over to the Boulder 2008 was interesting (100ohm for FR, 200 ohm for the SPU and the Stradivarius), as my first spontaneous reaction was "this is right"
but going into the details of describing, why I have this reaction is much harder.

........

I might agree with this from my impressions of the CH- but I have not lived long term only heard on very familiar systems consistently over the past year or so. For me the Kondo m7 or the Aesthetix Io with their own versions of the truth are more to my taste. They are much more work & have their own opportunities .

I would argue though that the CH is one of the most if not the most competent phono stages on the market today . The Thoress is very accomplished but not in the same company IMO.

The only phono which I would trade all for might be the Tenor -- it is quite special.

I really look forward to your longer term insights.
 

PeterA

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A bit of an extrapolation, but: Shakti has said the P1 is warm compared to the Vdh Grail in another thread. One owner told me privately that the P1 is a bit veiled compared to even his tube phonos. And yet another told me something similar. It sounds a lot like "pleasing" harmonic distortion. What are your thoughts?

I don't quite understand. You seem to be saying that the CH P1 is adding harmonics but it is not clear to me that you have heard it in a system in which you can isolate the contribution of this phono stage. Have you heard the CH P1 and can you be more specific about your experience with it?
 

JackD201

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A bit of an extrapolation, but: Shakti has said the P1 is warm compared to the Vdh Grail in another thread. One owner told me privately that the P1 is a bit veiled compared to even his tube phonos. And yet another told me something similar. It sounds a lot like "pleasing" harmonic distortion. What are your thoughts?

This is most curious. My other phono, like Tang, is tubed the EMT, the P1 is more detailed and when past the 50 hour mark was also richer and fuller (I use Tele 803s not the stock JJ 803s) from the midrange down. The EMT does win on adjustability though it loses on noise. That is a big deal for me and my very quiet room. Being quieter than any phono stage I have ever owned, it is also sounds more dynamic. I wonder if the veiling has to do with the internal impedance of his carts. I don't own any carts with high internal impedances so they all work very well with the current drive. I suppose that for those that have multiple high impedance carts on multiple arms, having two current drive inputs and one voltage input wouldn't make sense. I also wonder about phonocables. I use Odin on my graham and the captured cables on my 4-Point and my SAT. Lastly I wonder about the voltage input limits of his preamp. The P1's output is similar to top end digital at 6 as opposed to the usual 1 or 2. Over driving an input does indeed cause what can be described as veiling but is actually signal compression.
 
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