The Ugly American

jazdoc

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It is a sad example of how rapidly our culture how moved. McEnroe's antics were, for the most part, condemned. I am amazed how the crowd and commentariat are almost uniform in their emotional investment in Serena. It felt like they wanted to be a part of her Chase advertising campaign..

.

Serena Williams has been a great champion but this weekend she got her ass kicked wasn't mature enough to acknowledge that on this day, her opponent was the better player.

BTW, the song was used to much better effect in Deadpool II :D
 

Folsom

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don't be shocked. it's like watching CNN or MSNBC. once an event crosses over into the 'news' category then the rules change and protecting the network comes into play. especially after the social media spin creates a narrative. any other direction by ESPN would create an uproar. and any other position by those people would expose them to lots of heat.

I hear it on my local sports radio too. people I know personally temper their personal views to protect themselves and their stations on social issues.

don't be shocked.

i'm not even saying this particular event is without shades of grey on both sides. I am not involved enough in watching tennis to even really know about that. only that the facts are secondary to being safe for the networks.

There is nothing shocking about it, but just because we are steeped in this BS doesn't mean we should be "ok" with it. Even if there is a legit problem, acting like a 4 year old with a witchhuntesque entitled DEMAND is not how adults, much less professional icons, should behave.
 

jeff1225

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Jan 29, 2012
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It is a sad example of how rapidly our culture how moved. McEnroe's antics were, for the most part, condemned. I am amazed how the crowd and commentariat are almost uniform in their emotional investment in Serena. It felt like they wanted to be a part of her Chase advertising campaign..

.

Serena Williams has been a great champion but this weekend she got her ass kicked wasn't mature enough to acknowledge that on this day, her opponent was the better player.

BTW, the song was used to much better effect in Deadpool II :D

Serena as always been a great champion, but a very poor loser. She should retire as she's going to lose more and things are only going to get worse for her.
 

DaveyF

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I agree that Serena was getting beaten by a better player on that particular day. I also think that people forget how much of a competitor she is...and how the scenario playing out must have really been eating at her. The ref...clearly didn’t care about that, or about her feelings, imo. All I am saying is that he could have given her a little bit of leeway, which a lot of other players usually get on the tour...instead he chose not to do that and instead fuel her anger.
 

jeff1225

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I agree that Serena was getting beaten by a better player on that particular day. I also think that people forget how much of a competitor she is...and how the scenario playing out must have really been eating at her. The ref...clearly didn’t care about that, or about her feelings, imo. All I am saying is that he could have given her a little bit of leeway, which a lot of other players usually get on the tour...instead he chose not to do that and instead fuel her anger.

the WTA followed up with a $17K fine, so it was the opinion of the organize and not just the ref that she was out of line. Not as big of fine as when Nick Kyrgios said that another players was sleeping with Stan Wawrinka's girlfriend ($25K.)
 

PeterA

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I agree that Serena was getting beaten by a better player on that particular day. I also think that people forget how much of a competitor she is...and how the scenario playing out must have really been eating at her. The ref...clearly didn’t care about that, or about her feelings, imo. All I am saying is that he could have given her a little bit of leeway, which a lot of other players usually get on the tour...instead he chose not to do that and instead fuel her anger.

Davey, why should an umpire care about an athlete's "feelings"? It is a sport, and she should be competing fairly on a level playing field to the best of her ability on a given day. She should let her ability to play the sport of tennis speak for itself.
 

DaveyF

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Davey, why should an umpire care about an athlete's "feelings"? It is a sport, and she should be competing fairly on a level playing field to the best of her ability on a given day. She should let her ability to play the sport of tennis speak for itself.

Sure, but remember that the ref has an ability to intercede into the proceedings. This ref has done that on a couple of occasions..rightly so or not. It was Serena's understanding that this ref wouldn't be doing that if she was a man...and while we won't know that for sure, she seemed to believe it. How many times have we seen players smash their rackets on the court and not get called for that behavior? I'm not saying that is the right thing to do, but one has to be in the players shoes to understand the circumstance. This ref is apparently known for giving no leeway, question is- is he consistent in that?
 

jeff1225

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Sure, but remember that the ref has an ability to intercede into the proceedings. This ref has done that on a couple of occasions..rightly so or not. It was Serena's understanding that this ref wouldn't be doing that if she was a man...and while we won't know that for sure, she seemed to believe it. How many times have we seen players smash their rackets on the court and not get called for that behavior? I'm not saying that is the right thing to do, but one has to be in the players shoes to understand the circumstance. This ref is apparently known for giving no leeway, question is- is he consistent in that?

Carlos Ramos is a stickler for the rules. Here's a great recap of sighting top 10 players:

http://larrybrownsports.com/tennis/...istory-code-violations-serena-williams/463180

Let's be clear, after the warnings these players stop complaining and played out the game. Serena did not.
 

Al M.

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ack

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PeterA

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I watched the video - totally unprofessional conduct by Williams. You cannot settle political issues on the court.

Completely agree Ack. I watched the entire match in real time. She was out of line. We are constantly told that we should not deflect and excuse our own poor behavior, or that of others (politicians), by referencing others who do the same thing or worse. If she and the tennis elites feel there is unequal treatment based on gender, they should bring it up to the USTA and Tennis Federation and change it. If men have been treated differently for years, address it. A player should not bring up the issue during a losing match she is losing. That is not the time. She could have lost gracefully like the champion she is, admitted defeat, and made the gender inequity an issue for discussion after the tournament. That would have been fair to Osaka and the decent thing to do. Instead, she smashed her racquet for another violation, and continued to demand apologies long after the "stolen" point for yet another violation.

Ramos could have tried to diffuse the situation and treated the greatest female player of all time differently, with deference to her greatness, power, celebrity, and star status. He did not. She should have moved on, focused on her playing, finished the match with grace, perhaps made a comeback and let the match play out. But, her latest Nike ad is not about "comebacks", it is about rolling over her opponents. And the officials, I guess. She lives the message of her sponsor.

I don't know if this behavior is a stark reminder of the times in which we live, and the attitudes of people toward victimhood, personal responsibility, celebrities, and culture differences. That is a much deeper conversation, and it might be best to not go there.
 

NorthStar

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I watched a pre men's final discussion yesterday on ESPN about the women's final. Chris Everett, and John and Patrick McEnroe were being interviewed. They all seemed to support Serena's behavior and mistreatment by the umpire. Patrick McEnroe even said that the umpire should use his discretion to control the match and apply warnings according to the moment and who was playing. He suggested that the umpire should actually take into account Serena's past and the challenges she faced coming up in the sport. He said that she was called names etc as a young player, and basically faced different issues growing up. He was arguing that she should be treated differently because of where she came from and that the rules should not be applied equally in all circumstances. At least that is how I interpreted what he was saying.

I though professional sports was the last remaining place were true meritocracy was celebrated and that one should be judged solely on his or her athletic ability and sportsmanship. Period. I was shocked at the discussion I was watching on ESPN.

don't be shocked. it's like watching CNN or MSNBC. once an event crosses over into the 'news' category then the rules change and protecting the network comes into play. especially after the social media spin creates a narrative. any other direction by ESPN would create an uproar. and any other position by those people would expose them to lots of heat.

I hear it on my local sports radio too. people I know personally temper their personal views to protect themselves and their stations on social issues.

don't be shocked.

i'm not even saying this particular event is without shades of grey on both sides. I am not involved enough in watching tennis to even really know about that. only that the facts are secondary to being safe for the networks.

After I've read your reply to Peter it made me pause for a serious moment.
By the way Mike, you did not include FOX news media? Just curious that's all.

I can understand the problems it would create if they were to say the real truth, and it's a shame. IMHO
It's a shame because they put their own interest first and foremost, going against the current of the real true news of actuality. Why bother doing a job that is not what the real job is?
We have the answer; protection of their own interests, not in the public's interest.

Thanks Mike for that answer, it makes total sense, and it's unfortunate but it's a reality of the world we live in, in the world of news sport media in many similar situations like this one right here.
The smart public they know that, but it's a disservice for the rest and it creates even more conflicts and more serious questions on integrity and professionalism with dire consequences in the overall grand scheme of it all, in my sincere opinion.

Also, that's one more good reason for everyone to have access to a good education, everywhere.
Still, in my book of common sense the medias have an obligation to inform truthfully and thoroughly.
We all know that it's not the case, so we have to look elsewhere, a more neutral news media...Reuters, BBC, The Telegraph, Washington Post, The New York Times, The Guardian.

Am I right?

P.S. Smooth sailing today, everything works great @ WBF, zero issues. :cool:
 
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Al M.

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I don't know if this behavior is a stark reminder of the times in which we live, and the attitudes of people toward victimhood, personal responsibility, celebrities, and culture differences. That is a much deeper conversation, and it might be best to not go there.

Indeed, best not to go there.
 

XV-1

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Novak got pinged for going over the time clock when serving in the final yesterday. Acknowledged the warning and continued playing without issue.
 

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