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Thread: Top Wing Seiryu arrives at Believe High Fidelity

  1. #51
    Addicted to Best! DaveyF's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by byrdparis View Post
    i have actually,
    in a nut shell; the red sparrow is the better one no doubt.
    although the blue is very quiet and smooth like a R2R player especially on its own headshell that TOP WING deliver,
    i think the red sparrow have more finesse to its presentation overall. something about its ability to integrate with more arms keeps it way high above a lot of cart's i have and listened.
    the red sparrow is indeed one of the TOP cart's i heard in my system.
    after that said, i will choose between them carefully on base of your arm of use.

    if you have an "Old school" arm, with a detachable headshell etc, i might consider to save some $$ and get the blue! its a very BIG cart (physically!) and its integration with its own headshell is crucial! and its sound Superb!
    if you have some the more "modern" kind of arms, i will choose the Red Sparrow no doubt. its our there with the best!

    hope it helped a bit,
    see you in Munich?
    Interesting that you bring up the point about an "old school" arm with a detachable headshell, etc., In the old days...and I believe currently too, the fact that an arm had a detachable headshell meant that it was loosing information at the junction between the headshell and the arm. Simply due to the fact that there was another connection at that point. IME, that is exactly what one hears when you compare a modern arm with a fixed headshell and the "old school" arm with the detachable.
    I would therefore agree with you, if you truly want the very best reproduction from analog, then choosing an arm that is not "old school" is going to be the way to go. Many on this forum won't agree with this stance, but that's IMHO.

  2. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by byrdparis View Post
    i have actually,
    in a nut shell; the red sparrow is the better one no doubt.
    although the blue is very quiet and smooth like a R2R player especially on its own headshell that TOP WING deliver,
    i think the red sparrow have more finesse to its presentation overall. something about its ability to integrate with more arms keeps it way high above a lot of cart's i have and listened.
    the red sparrow is indeed one of the TOP cart's i heard in my system.
    after that said, i will choose between them carefully on base of your arm of use.

    if you have an "Old school" arm, with a detachable headshell etc, i might consider to save some $$ and get the blue! its a very BIG cart (physically!) and its integration with its own headshell is crucial! and its sound Superb!
    if you have some the more "modern" kind of arms, i will choose the Red Sparrow no doubt. its our there with the best!

    hope it helped a bit,
    see you in Munich?
    Hi,
    Thanks a lot for sharing your insights. My first idea was to purchase the Blue Dragon and use a Ikeda 407 for it.
    But I think, also taking in account what you have written, the Red Sperrow will deliver more, although being more expensive.
    I have several modern tonearms, so I will use my Kuzma 4Point maybe in this case.
    And yes, I am planing to be in Munich, but only on Thursday by my current schedule.
    Maybe we can meet (?) :-)

  3. #53
    Addicted to Best! byrdparis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr-particle View Post
    Hi,
    Thanks a lot for sharing your insights. My first idea was to purchase the Blue Dragon and use a Ikeda 407 for it.
    But I think, also taking in account what you have written, the Red Sperrow will deliver more, although being more expensive.
    I have several modern tonearms, so I will use my Kuzma 4Point maybe in this case.
    And yes, I am planing to be in Munich, but only on Thursday by my current schedule.
    Maybe we can meet (?) :-)
    Hi.
    i will be there all day on Thursday, will love to meet anyone who fancy about it.

    i am using the blue dragon on my IKEDA 407 as of right now!
    its a very good combo, and i think it might be the best pairing with the Blue and its own headshell.
    although, my Thales simplicity II was getting it more focus in overall, but the IKEDA getting it to sing differently with more body in to it (i guess its just a bit of inter-modulation distortion adding there v/s the Thales - so... YMMV )
    Speakers:Magico Q3 Preamp:E.A.R 912 Amp:Luxman m900
    Cables:Siltech Double Crown Power:Nordost Odin1,Argento master flow
    Digital: Metronome C8/Aurender N10
    TT1TechDAS AF3P/Thales Simplicity II/Ortofon RS212D/DV507MK2
    TT2:Torqueo T34 Exclusive Zebrano/ikeda 407
    Carts': Ortofon Anna,Zyx R1000 airy3,VDH Colibri Stradivarius,EMT XSD15,Murasakino Sumile,Koetsu blue lace,Top Wing Suzaku,DS W2
    Phono: CH Precision P1 Racks: TAOC Power treatmentPs Audio P10

  4. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by byrdparis View Post
    Hi.
    i will be there all day on Thursday, will love to meet anyone who fancy about it.

    i am using the blue dragon on my IKEDA 407 as of right now!
    its a very good combo, and i think it might be the best pairing with the Blue and its own headshell.
    although, my Thales simplicity II was getting it more focus in overall, but the IKEDA getting it to sing differently with more body in to it (i guess its just a bit of inter-modulation distortion adding there v/s the Thales - so... YMMV )
    I am happy to look forward meeting you in Munich.
    Regarding the tonearm selection for the Blue Dragon my guess is, that the Ikeda 407 is a better match by its mass coming with, so better in dissipting the energy generated by the cartridge, especially a cartridges with a metal body.
    The Thales is better in respect to the tracking error for sure, which explains also the better focus overall.

  5. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by DaveyF View Post
    Interesting that you bring up the point about an "old school" arm with a detachable headshell, etc., In the old days...and I believe currently too, the fact that an arm had a detachable headshell meant that it was loosing information at the junction between the headshell and the arm. Simply due to the fact that there was another connection at that point. IME, that is exactly what one hears when you compare a modern arm with a fixed headshell and the "old school" arm with the detachable.
    I would therefore agree with you, if you truly want the very best reproduction from analog, then choosing an arm that is not "old school" is going to be the way to go. Many on this forum won't agree with this stance, but that's IMHO.
    The additional connection joint was allways somthing that concerned me in the case of the “old school” tonearms with detachable headshells.
    I remember there was a post here at WBF (?) by Jonathan Carr showing the tonearm with the wires outside the tonearm wand.
    This maybe not everybody’s cup of tea and also critical regarding the shielding of the weak signals, but will give an answer which differences are due to the additional connection joint.
    Of course having the wires outside will also require careful looking, so that there is impact to the movement of the tonearm!
    There was also the Kondo IO-J cartridge with magnets energized by an external PSU, coming with a set of wires (signal & power) to be placed outside to the tonearm wand.
    AN UK still has such a cartridge in their portfolio as far as I know.

  6. #56
    Addicted to Best! DaveyF's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr-particle View Post
    The additional connection joint was allways somthing that concerned me in the case of the “old school” tonearms with detachable headshells.
    I remember there was a post here at WBF (?) by Jonathan Carr showing the tonearm with the wires outside the tonearm wand.
    This maybe not everybody’s cup of tea and also critical regarding the shielding of the weak signals, but will give an answer which differences are due to the additional connection joint.
    Of course having the wires outside will also require careful looking, so that there is impact to the movement of the tonearm!
    There was also the Kondo IO-J cartridge with magnets energized by an external PSU, coming with a set of wires (signal & power) to be placed outside to the tonearm wand.
    AN UK still has such a cartridge in their portfolio as far as I know.
    Actually there are a number of different solutions to the problem. However, the least accurate would be the "old school" detachable headshell. The fixed headshell...which is what many of us are using, still has the problem of the cartridge to headshell connections at the pins of the cartridge and the headshell. One solution, like you brought up, is to hardwire the wire from the cartridge all the way to the phono section...which is kind of what JCarr was suggesting. This can bring its own set of issues, like you also touched upon. Another, less complete solution, is what the upper line Linn cartridges do, they have a flying lead off the cartridge that attaches to pins at the Linn arm headshell....thereby relieving one connection point ( at the cartridge).
    My point though, in my prior post, was that the "old fashioned" removable headshell arm type is actually the worst offender here...and the losses are clearly audible when compared with a top level modern arm with a fixed headshell...

  7. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by DaveyF View Post
    Actually there are a number of different solutions to the problem. However, the least accurate would be the "old school" detachable headshell. The fixed headshell...which is what many of us are using, still has the problem of the cartridge to headshell connections at the pins of the cartridge and the headshell. One solution, like you brought up, is to hardwire the wire from the cartridge all the way to the phono section...which is kind of what JCarr was suggesting. This can bring its own set of issues, like you also touched upon. Another, less complete solution, is what the upper line Linn cartridges do, they have a flying lead off the cartridge that attaches to pins at the Linn arm headshell....thereby relieving one connection point ( at the cartridge).
    My point though, in my prior post, was that the "old fashioned" removable headshell arm type is actually the worst offender here...and the losses are clearly audible when compared with a top level modern arm with a fixed headshell...
    I agree, unfortunately there is always “one death we have to die“
    Also soldering the wires directly to the pins of the cartridge will have also his own downsides and not only in respect to the handling of such a thing.

  8. #58
    Addicted to Best! DaveyF's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr-particle View Post
    I agree, unfortunately there is always “one death we have to die“
    Also soldering the wires directly to the pins of the cartridge will have also his own downsides and not only in respect to the handling of such a thing.
    Funny, I have not heard that quote before...
    How about this one...
    “ there is no perfect solution, you just have to pick your poison”.

  9. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by DaveyF View Post
    Funny, I have not heard that quote before...
    How about this one...
    “ there is no perfect solution, you just have to pick your poison”.
    👍🏻
    BTW, my quote was a translated phrase we are using in Germany.

  10. #60
    VIP/Donor [VIP/Donor] Tango's Avatar
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    Will mount this on the second arm of my EMT this Friday.

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    Tang

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