New injection moulding process for making LP's.

PeterA

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Dec 6, 2011
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Thought it may be of interest to members here, especially like they say that sound quality of the LP can be improved.

https://www.engadget.com/2016/11/08/symcon-injection-molded-vinyl-records/

Enjoy.

Thanks for posting this. It is very interesting. However, I found the following sentence in the article most curious: "The company will also need to develop a new way to test audio quality as the system for existing vinyl records won't work with the new material." Can't they just play their newly pressed record in a conventional turntable/tonearm/cartridge system and listen to the results to test for audio quality? If not, how is the consumer supposed to listen to the results?
 

Sencha

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Nov 11, 2013
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Thanks for posting this. It is very interesting. However, I found the following sentence in the article most curious: "The company will also need to develop a new way to test audio quality as the system for existing vinyl records won't work with the new material." Can't they just play their newly pressed record in a conventional turntable/tonearm/cartridge system and listen to the results to test for audio quality? If not, how is the consumer supposed to listen to the results?

Hi Peter, I took that to meant that they have to develop a new testing method, presuming for stability and longevity, rather than for pure playability. It did say that they have to use new materials to produce their PL's hence maybe the requirement for a new testing method.

Did anyone else read that differently?
 

NorthStar

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Feb 8, 2011
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No, I've read the same.

"Symcon is still working on perfecting the sound and durability of the records by searching for the optimal mixture of ingredients. According to Discogs, sound engineers who have been privy to the testing process have confirmed this method does exhibit a bump in audio quality over traditional vinyl records. How? Well, during the injection-molding process plastic is injected directly on the grooves of a record stamper which copies the information more accurately. With current methods, plastic is pushed into the grooves at an angle. What's more, there's no pressure on the stampers with injection molding so they can be used longer before sound quality is affected."

They also want a "green" product, with the best combination of materials. ...And colored records. :cool:
Maybe they'll also find a better way for centered holes? That would be swell too. And no more warping?

Interesting, CDs are slowly de-advancing, and LPs are advancing. It's like a retro audio world...the full circle, forth and back.
 

PeterA

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What is curious is that "sound engineers who have been privy to the testing process have confirmed this method does exhibit a bump in audio quality over traditional vinyl records." How can they know this if they have not listened to a recording on the new material? The information implies that listening is not possible because the "new material" can not be played on existing record playing equipment. So, if not listening, then measurements must be used to test "audio quality" of the new material versus the standard vinyl. What measurements could these be? There must be some method if the sound engineers have confirmed it is better. Or are they just assuming it is better because of the way it flows over the stamper?

I find the press release to be very confusing as it makes some assertions while leaving out pertinent details. Pardon the pun, but it lacks clarity, imo.
 

Folsom

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I don't think it's hard to imagine that one could tell that it's better.

The question is, where's the market? Audiophiles only, and not all of them, if you must buy new gear. If it's JUST a different cartridge then people with several arms may enjoy it. But what about the huge part of the market that is young people who just like vinyl? They typically have barely have working turntables, and spend $ on records is all.
 

Don Hills

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Jun 20, 2013
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Wellington, New Zealand
"... during the injection-molding process plastic is injected directly on the grooves of a record stamper which copies the information more accurately. With current methods, plastic is pushed into the grooves at an angle. What's more, there's no pressure on the stampers with injection molding so they can be used longer before sound quality is affected."

Something doesn't add up here. If you're going to inject plastic "directly on the grooves", it implies a thick, one-sided record. If you're doing standard injection moulding, the plastic still has to flow across the grooves (from the centre to the edge or vice versa). Perhaps the only advantage is the plastic will be at a more uniform temperature as it is injected.
 

Folsom

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Cool! But compatability will ruin them unless they take that decision back.
 

Folsom

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I thought that it isn't backwards compatible based on first article, but video says it is?
 

Don Hills

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Jun 20, 2013
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Thanks for the pointers to the article and video. It cleared up a couple of things for me.
The moulding process is apparently 2-step: First inject the plastic between the two mould surfaces to fill the space, then apply pressure to ensure full contact. I can see how this can lead to lower stamper wear and less likelihood of warping compared to traditional pressing.

... and I don't see any reason for such discs to be incompatible in any way with tradiional discs. They're going to be reproduced on the same equipment, surely their quality will be judged by the same yardsticks?
 

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