dCS Paganini DAC upgrade with master clock or Puccini U-Clock?

RubenV.

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Feb 23, 2015
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Hi fellows,

Last year I replaced my previous dac with the dCS Paganini DAC which I really like. Now, after saving some money it is that time again. Time for a upgrade.

2 used clocks came on my path (I don't have the cash to buy a new one unfortunately). In the left corner we have the Puccini U-Clock with USB input and capable of accepting 24/192 audio. In the right corner there is the Paganini Master Clock. This is the "old" model without the USB input. The Paganini is a little bit more expensive, around 20% more then the U-Clock.

dCS states both units are grade-1 clocks. This makes me wonder if there is a real/big difference between the two clocks. Maybe the Paganini Master Clock matches better with the Paganini DAC?

To be honest, when I saw a picture of the inside of the U-clock I was not that impressed.
3007d1355066423-best-usb-spdif-converter-dcs2.jpg

It is a shame I can not find any pictures of the inside of the Paganini Master Clock to compare with the above.

I currently use a Digital-to-Digital-Converter for the USB to AES converter. Someone else I know uses the same DDC and prefers it above the USB input in the Debussy, which is the same as in the U-Clock if I am not mistaken.

Any recommendations about the above units? Any experiences with adding a dCS clock? Please let me know!
 

thedudeabides

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Jan 16, 2011
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I also saw that picture (Puccini clock) and questioned why this unit has a retail cost of $5K.

I think you are paying more for the casing than you are for the actual hardware inside the case. But I must admit it is a very pretty box.

This picture influenced my recent purchase of the Esoteric K01. I was considering the Puccini.

Unimpressive indeed and frankly embarrassing. It certainly does make one wonder.

Gives a new meaning to the term "audio jewelery". :eek:

To your question, I have not auditioned but based on anecdotal information, the clock seems to have an impact of performance. How much remains to be seen.

Best advice, buy with money back option if at all possible.
 

Elberoth

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Dec 15, 2012
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I'm not sure you can gain much by adding just a clock to the dCS Paganini DAC. External clock makes most sense when you want to use at least two boxes and eliminate interface jitter.

I anything, I would go the Scarlatti DAC instead (selling the Paganini DAC) or go with the U-clcok and use both as a clock and USB to SPDIF converter, with its clock link feature.

Long time Scarlatti and Puccini user here.
 

Elberoth

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I also saw that picture (Puccini clock) and questioned why this unit has a retail cost of $5K.

I think you are paying more for the casing than you are for the actual hardware inside the case. But I must admit it is a very pretty box.

This picture influenced my recent purchase of the Esoteric K01. I was considering the Puccini.

Unimpressive indeed and frankly embarrassing. It certainly does make one wonder.

Gives a new meaning to the term "audio jewelery". :eek:

What would you expect ? The clock itself is not an overly complicated piece of gear. The most expensive part was surely the case, but dCS clearly wanted to make it match the rest of their range.

The second most expensive part is the OCXO (the silver part with orange stripes), which is probably a few hundred bucks in OEM. The one you will find in the Esoteric K01, cost proably 1/100th of that.
 

Barry2013

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Oct 12, 2013
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I have the Puccini and U clock and the latter does improve the Puccini quite significantly as well as adding the very good usb capability.
I have been advised that the new Paganini clock with usb works very well with the Puccini and I hope to try it in a few weeks time
I realise that is probably not an option for you at the moment but I think it is generally accepted that adding the u clock to a Puccini is a good cost effective upgrade and they are available used at sensibles prices.
 

jfrech

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Sep 3, 2012
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I have the Puccini and U clock and the latter does improve the Puccini quite significantly as well as adding the very good usb capability.
I have been advised that the new Paganini clock with usb works very well with the Puccini and I hope to try it in a few weeks time
I realise that is probably not an option for you at the moment but I think it is generally accepted that adding the u clock to a Puccini is a good cost effective upgrade and they are available used at sensibles prices.

I used to own a Puccini and added the U clock at a later date...fully agree with you..it's a nice upgrade. I wouldn't worry about the pic...it's the sound that counts.

I do agree with Adam however...try stepping up to a Scarlatti vs adding a clock. Then add a clock later...especially if you're synching with a transport or upsampler
 

thedudeabides

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Jan 16, 2011
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What would you expect ?

For $5K list, alot more than what I see.

PS: So you are saying the comparable part in the K01 costs 3 dollars?
 
Last edited:

Elberoth

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For $5K list, alot more than what I see. Anymore K01 digs you wish to make?

U-clock parts may look limited, but that does not mean they are cheap. OCXO module alone can cost as much as $4000 per part in OEM pricing (case in point: the Trinity DAC). If we use the most common BOM to retail price formula in audio industry (which is ~20%), this single part could drive up the retail price to $20.000.

Of course, the OCXO used by dCS doesn't cost $4000 in OEM. It is much less, but still several hundred bucks. This is one of the reasons, U-Clock cost as much as it does.

Accuton Diamond 50mm midrange drive unit also doesn't look to cost $20.000 per piece ... but it does.
 

RubenV.

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Feb 23, 2015
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@thedudeabies: you are right about trying it in my own system. I can understand the fact that the chassis is mostly empty because of the small size of the components. What I would like to know is if this is the same with the Paganini Masterclock. The last one should have atleast an extra pcb for the lcd-screen. But dCS stated that both are grade 1 components so I wonder if it is the same hardware. However, I do like the looks of both clocks. I think it was the right decision to keep the same chassis-width.

@Elberoth: Thanks for the advice. What you say makes sense. But adding a clock like the U-clock will make the DDC superfluous. The Paganini Master Clock would be a different story. But I have not seen them in the used market equipped with the USB input.
Have you ever compared the Paganini with the Scarletti? If so, I would like to know your opinion.

@Barry2013: Please keep us updated about your listening session with the Paganini Master Clock in the near future. I am very interested in your findings. Have you ever used another DDC then the USB inputs of the U-Clock?
In the review of computeraudiophile.com Chris got a Paganini DAC with a U-clock and was also impressed by it. Maybe I should just give it a try when I am not able to audition it in my own set.
 

RubenV.

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Feb 23, 2015
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I used to own a Puccini and added the U clock at a later date...fully agree with you..it's a nice upgrade. I wouldn't worry about the pic...it's the sound that counts.

I do agree with Adam however...try stepping up to a Scarlatti vs adding a clock. Then add a clock later...especially if you're synching with a transport or upsampler

Thanks for your input (actually that counts for all of you:)
Did you ever had a chance to compare the Paganini with the Scarlatti side-by-side?
 

thedudeabides

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Adam,

Thanks for the additional perspective. There are certainly things I don't know but I assume you would agree that to the untrained eye, there's alot of open real estate in that box.
 

RubenV.

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Feb 23, 2015
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Adam,

Thanks for the additional perspective. There are certainly things I don't know but I assume you would agree that to the untrained eye, there's alot of open real estate in that box.

+1

That is also the reason why I am looking for a picture of the inside of the Paganini Master Clock. I wonder if this unit contains the same hardware as the Puccini U-Clock. But keep in mind that it does not have to tell the whole story, since a lot can be done with different software too (like they do with the ring dac pcb's).
 

Barry2013

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@thedudeabies: you are right about trying it in my own system. I can understand the fact that the chassis is mostly empty because of the small size of the components. What I would like to know is if this is the same with the Paganini Masterclock. The last one should have atleast an extra pcb for the lcd-screen. But dCS stated that both are grade 1 components so I wonder if it is the same hardware. However, I do like the looks of both clocks. I think it was the right decision to keep the same chassis-width.

@Elberoth: Thanks for the advice. What you say makes sense. But adding a clock like the U-clock will make the DDC superfluous. The Paganini Master Clock would be a different story. But I have not seen them in the used market equipped with the USB input.
Have you ever compared the Paganini with the Scarletti? If so, I would like to know your opinion.

@Barry2013: Please keep us updated about your listening session with the Paganini Master Clock in the near future. I am very interested in your findings. Have you ever used another DDC then the USB inputs of the U-Clock?
In the review of computeraudiophile.com Chris got a Paganini DAC with a U-clock and was also impressed by it. Maybe I should just give it a try when I am not able to audition it in my own set.

Thanks Ruben.
Will let you know how it goes
 

patriot

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May 5, 2015
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+1

That is also the reason why I am looking for a picture of the inside of the Paganini Master Clock. I wonder if this unit contains the same hardware as the Puccini U-Clock. But keep in mind that it does not have to tell the whole story, since a lot can be done with different software too (like they do with the ring dac pcb's).

This is an review of dcs paganini from russian hi-fi magazine. Pictures of the inside of the paganini transport, dac, upsampler and clock:

http://qvinta-audio.ru/media/ProductPressReview/file/Audiomag_2_91_2010_Paganini_1.pdf

For those who interested:

Internals of dcs scarlatti transport, dac and clock:

http://qvinta-audio.ru/media/ProductPressReview/file/Audiomag_3_74_2007_Scarlatti_1.pdf

dcs debussy:

http://qvinta-audio.ru/media/ProductPressReview/file/Audiomag_6_(101)_2011_Debussy.pdf
 

RubenV.

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Feb 23, 2015
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Thank you patriot! So far I only found (internal) pictures of the Debussy and Uclock.
 

jfrech

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Sep 3, 2012
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Thanks for your input (actually that counts for all of you:)
Did you ever had a chance to compare the Paganini with the Scarlatti side-by-side?

No, but I did compare the Puccini and U-Clock vs the Scarlatti Dac/trans and clock. It's a BIG diff. I also compared the Scarlatti clock to the Vivaldi clock...it's significant as well.
 

RubenV.

Well-Known Member
Feb 23, 2015
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No, but I did compare the Puccini and U-Clock vs the Scarlatti Dac/trans and clock. It's a BIG diff. I also compared the Scarlatti clock to the Vivaldi clock...it's significant as well.

Are you talking about the stacks? (Puccini+U-Clock vs Scarlatti dac/trans+clock) Or are you comparing clocks?
BTW, just noticed your preamp in your sig, awesome piece of equipment.
 

jfrech

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Are you talking about the stacks? (Puccini+U-Clock vs Scarlatti dac/trans+clock) Or are you comparing clocks?
BTW, just noticed your preamp in your sig, awesome piece of equipment.

I did both. Puccini/u clock vs Scarlati trans/clock/dac and the compared Scarlatti Dac vs Vivaldi Dac, then Scarlatti Trans vs Vivaldi Trans, then Scarlatti vs Vivaldi Clock...

Thank you on the preamp...the Koda K10 is a special piece for sure
 

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