Cable burn-in: Is it real or imagined?

GaryProtein · Nov 15, 2014

The break-in period of a cable is the time it takes for you to get used to what your system sounds like--real or imagined.

If you have two identical cables, one "broken in" and one not, you would not reliably tell the difference.

Mosin · Nov 15, 2014

GaryProtein said:
The break-in period of a cable is the time it takes for you to get used to what your system sounds like--real or imagined.

If you have two identical cables, one "broken in" and one not, you would not reliably tell the difference.

Don't most makers of quality cables use a cable burner to precondition their cables before delivery? I know that my friend who makes cables for a living is extremely OCD about that. After that, minimal differences may occur, but only minor ones. At least, that's what I have noticed here.

BlueFox · Nov 16, 2014

I received a Shunyata Sigma Digital cable Thursday night, placed it on my Oppo 103, and turned the Oppo on to start burn in. Friday night I watched my two Blueray reference movies (Avatar, Terminator 3) to check for any difference between the new Sigma and the Alpha Digital it replaced. Initial impression after 24 hours of burn in is that blue is over emphasized. This was especially apparent on Avatar, since the Navi are blue. Soon I will check again to see if another 24 hours has improved the color balance.

FrantzM · Nov 16, 2014

GaryProtein said:
The break-in period of a cable is the time it takes for you to get used to what your system sounds like--real or imagined.

If you have two identical cables, one "broken in" and one not, you would not reliably tell the difference.

Amen,

Mike Lavigne · Nov 16, 2014

GaryProtein said:
The break-in period of a cable is the time it takes for you to get used to what your system sounds like--real or imagined.

If you have two identical cables, one "broken in" and one not, you would not reliably tell the difference.

and you know this because.......????

now if you wrote "if I have two identical cables"......then it's possible for you to know that. but you have no clue what difference I could reliably tell as far as one 'broken in' and one not.

maybe you have a Cable Cooker too, and you've done many dozens of cable break-in processes over a number of years? if so, tell us about how that went and how you never could reliably tell the difference.

audioarcher · Nov 16, 2014

Hi Mike, For those of us that have not used or heard what a cable cooker does, can you try to explain the difference you hear before and after? I wonder what type of signal they send through the cable, and at what intensity as well?

es347 · Nov 16, 2014

GaryProtein said:
The break-in period of a cable is the time it takes for you to get used to what your system sounds like--real or imagined.

If you have two identical cables, one "broken in" and one not, you would not reliably tell the difference.

Yep agree 100%...

Mike Lavigne · Nov 16, 2014

audioarcher said:
Hi Mike, For those of us that have not used or heard what a cable cooker does, can you try to explain the difference you hear before and after? I wonder what type of signal they send through the cable, and at what intensity as well?

you can read what is explained on the Cable Cooker website regarding the technical details. it basically runs an ultrasonic signal up to 1 watt thru interconnects, and an ultrasonic signal up to 22 watts thru speaker and power cables.

as far as what is heard, my first point would be what Jack said about knowing your own system and sensitivity to changes and experience recognizing them;

JackD201 said:
IMO you hear smaller and smaller difference if YOU are IN TUNE with your system Place me in an unfamiliar room and system and I will have nothing but guesses as to what is doing what. In my own system I can immediately tell new vs burned in. Then again it's easy when you have your own cables and routinely check new cables for pre-delivery inspection.

as far as specific things to listen for I'd say a few different things which are subtle individually but jump out collectively; noise floor, micro dynamics, refinement, airiness on top, body, and liveliness. basically the overall ease and feel of the music. the degree it breathes.

maybe the easier read is when the cables stop constipating and closing in the sound. it's the transition to greater degrees of openness and ease and agility that is the primary change and that is made up of a bunch of individual things. obviously the higher the capabilities of these areas of your system the more restrictions are perceived. new cables can have higher information but stifle the flow to begin with.

as far as people perceiving extended times for break in it mostly has to do with the agility and degree of harmonious flow. the jump and snap factor so to speak. is there a human component to that? everyone has a right to their own opinion about it.

I have my 20-30 go-to reference cuts I always use to check out system performance. I've used them for 10+ years many hundreds of times with any changes.

Johnny Vinyl · Nov 16, 2014

I'm not trying to be a smartass here, but isn't having a Cable Cooker the ultimate sign of impatience. After all, with time on the system the cables will accomplish that on their own.

Mike Lavigne · Nov 16, 2014

Johnny Vinyl said:
I'm not trying to be a smartass here, but isn't having a Cable Cooker the ultimate sign of impatience. After all, with time on the system the cables will accomplish that on their own.

my opinion based on my experience is that the Cable Cooker will take the cables to a higher point ultimately than music break in alone. how much higher? likely not very much.....but at least some ways.

and when you consider running your system for a week or two continuously for cable break-in there is a downside to that too.

Steve Williams · Nov 16, 2014

BlueFox said:
I received a Shunyata Sigma Digital cable Thursday night, placed it on my Oppo 103, and turned the Oppo on to start burn in. Friday night I watched my two Blueray reference movies (Avatar, Terminator 3) to check for any difference between the new Sigma and the Alpha Digital it replaced. Initial impression after 24 hours of burn in is that blue is over emphasized. This was especially apparent on Avatar, since the Navi are blue. Soon I will check again to see if another 24 hours has improved the color balance.

There is an immediate audible difference between the Alpha Digital and the newer Sigma Digital IMO even before burn in

Johnny Vinyl · Nov 16, 2014

Mike Lavigne said:
my opinion based on my experience is that the Cable Cooker will take the cables to a higher point ultimately than music break in alone. how much higher? likely not very much.....but at least some ways.

and when you consider running your system for a week or two continuously for cable break-in there is a downside to that too.

Just to be clear...I value your opinion greatly Mike. I guess for me I'm not willing to spend the time or the resources to obtain that last bit of information I can out of my system. I'm also not convinced that my hearing is up to the task of differentiating those small degrees of improvement.

Mike Lavigne · Nov 16, 2014

Johnny Vinyl said:
Just to be clear...I value your opinion greatly Mike. I guess for me I'm not willing to spend the time or the resources to obtain that last bit of information I can out of my system. I'm also not convinced that my hearing is up to the task of differentiating those small degrees of improvement.

there is no doubt that pursuing the last bit of anything involves considerable commitment. and motivation to even care about it. at this point I'm all in.

if it's fun to do it, and important enough, then do it. or not. there is no right or wrong to it.

Johnny Vinyl · Nov 16, 2014

Mike Lavigne said:
there is no doubt that pursuing the last bit of anything involves considerable commitment. and motivation to even care about it. at this point I'm all in.

if it's fun to do it, and important enough, then do it. or not. there is no right or wrong to it.

+1. ............................time to play some music now!

Steve Williams · Nov 16, 2014

well hear is a question that has bothered me for quite a while

Does a "burned in cable have a memory such that after the manufacturer burns in a 100 hours before sending it to the end user that little if any further burn in is required. Does the cable not change somehow when the cable is wound in a box as compared to being straight during the burn in . It does seem to take a few days in my system whenever a cable is removed and then reinserted that there are several days required for it to anneal before it sounds right again

JackD201 · Nov 16, 2014

Mike Lavigne said:
you can read what is explained on the Cable Cooker website regarding the technical details. it basically runs an ultrasonic signal up to 1 watt thru interconnects, and an ultrasonic signal up to 22 watts thru speaker and power cables.

as far as what is heard, my first point would be what Jack said about knowing your own system and sensitivity to changes and experience recognizing them;

as far as specific things to listen for I'd say a few different things which are subtle individually but jump out collectively; noise floor, micro dynamics, refinement, airiness on top, body, and liveliness. basically the overall ease and feel of the music. the degree it breathes.

maybe the easier read is when the cables stop constipating and closing in the sound. it's the transition to greater degrees of openness and ease and agility that is the primary change and that is made up of a bunch of individual things. obviously the higher the capabilities of these areas of your system the more restrictions are perceived. new cables can have higher information but stifle the flow to begin with.

as far as people perceiving extended times for break in it mostly has to do with the agility and degree of harmonious flow. the jump and snap factor so to speak. is there a human component to that? everyone has a right to their own opinion about it.

I have my 20-30 go-to reference cuts I always use to check out system performance. I've used them for 10+ years many hundreds of times with any changes.

The word I use in place of constipation is constriction. I guess it applies for "both" scenarios. LOL.

jeromelang · Nov 16, 2014

Have a couple of conductor cables wrapped with a dielectric material and you have what is basically a capacitor.

Run some current through these conductor cables - and the dielectric material surrounding the conductors gets "charged"

Leave these conductors alone for a week, and the surrounding dielectric materials will lose some of its charge.

And you still dunno what physical parameter to measure?

Speedskater · Nov 17, 2014

jeromelang said:
Have a couple of conductor cables wrapped with a dielectric material and you have what is basically a capacitor.
Run some current through these conductor cables - and the dielectric material surrounding the conductors gets "charged"
Leave these conductors alone for a week, and the surrounding dielectric materials will lose some of its charge.
And you still dunno what physical parameter to measure?

That only works with DC current.

And then only under open circuit conditions.

DaveC · Nov 17, 2014

GaryProtein said:
The break-in period of a cable is the time it takes for you to get used to what your system sounds like--real or imagined.

If you have two identical cables, one "broken in" and one not, you would not reliably tell the difference.

It varies with the cable, some have very defined and easily heard break-in others are much more subtle. Some cables and connectors (Furutech rhodium especially) go on a roller coaster ride during break in where they change from dark and closed-in to more normal sounding and back...

Break in happens between the conductor and dielectric, and possibly between conductor and plating as well, so the more surface area you have the more discernible break-in will be. It is also more audible in speaker cables vs ICs. The speaker cables I make with litz wire contains 2120 individually insulated 44g wires per cable, and I can say break-in is easily heard, the first couple hours sound like something is broken in your system... this is not subtle at all.

If you buy new cables they should be somewhat broken-in... I always give 3 days + on an Audiodharma Cable Cooker.

Break-in on components in usually very obvious too. New components sound pretty bad for at least the first few hours.

DaveC · Nov 17, 2014

Steve Williams said:
well hear is a question that has bothered me for quite a while

Does a "burned in cable have a memory such that after the manufacturer burns in a 100 hours before sending it to the end user that little if any further burn in is required. Does the cable not change somehow when the cable is wound in a box as compared to being straight during the burn in . It does seem to take a few days in my system whenever a cable is removed and then reinserted that there are several days required for it to anneal before it sounds right again

Yes, if you move a cable it can take from a few hours to a few days to settle down again. When shipping a fully burnt-in cable I have found it has a bit of harshness or edge to it for a few hours that is very obvious. However, it doesn't take nearly as long to re-break-in as it did when new, usually not longer than a couple days.

Cable burn-in: Is it real or imagined?

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