Rock and Drum videos thread
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Very nice. Here Carl Palmer seems to be in a larger recording hall playing the snare drum. The sonic characteristics seem rather similar to my own in-room recording below. Since I've been told my in-room recording is sterile and lifeless, I must presume Palmer's is too?
Maybe the recording industry should do away with recording halls and just use recording booths for better intimacy and warmth? Just askin.....
Seriously, though that was a very nice piece by Palmer.
Stehno, you seem to invite comments by posting so many of your videos. Here is my observation of these two through my headphones: The Carl Palmer video has the advantage of not going through an audio system and probably is not recorded by an iPhone. It is more direct. It sounds good. Lots of nuance, ambience and complete notes. These are markers for resolution, IMO. Your videos in general sound flatter than this and lack the nuance and ambience of the better videos in this thread. That is why I refer to them as sterile. I am not alone in this assessment. I do not hear the Palmer video as flat and sterile. Your videos are certainly clean and dynamic for sure, and I'm sure the sound is very impressive in room, but the videos are missing some magic, at least for me. It is only my opinion. I'm sure many will disagree.
Edit: I’m looking forward to your additional comments about the second issue with the two videos I commented on earlier.
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If you want to show that your stereo captures the nuance and low level info correctly, simply play the Palmer track through your stereo and record that for comparison... then we will hear what imprint your system and room overlay(or not) on the recording....
Peter, whether posting a comment or a video it’s all essentially soliciting comments as that’s what forums are about. Ain’t nothin’ wrong with that and of course anybody’s welcome to comment anything they desire within reason of course. In my case, or unless I open a new thread, I usually try to let my videos speak for me though I may include a note or 2 about the recording. Likewise, when somebody comments on another’s recording and says it’s level of musicality far surpasses all others, ain’t nothing wrong there either, but of course feedback is also a solicitation for input.
I did not reply directly to your feedback regarding your take on my videos as it probably would create yet another bottomless rabbit hole that high-end audio seems so famous for. But I was surprised (not really) at the beauty you claimed to hear when those recordings’ performance shortcomings were pretty clear to me. So I just bit my lip and walked away. But I guess not for long as I came back in the next few posts and made a couple of indirect snarky comments because frankly I was a bit shocked at what you interpreted as musical. Don’t get me wrong, those recordings that you loved weren’t that bad at all and in fact were interestingly musical in some ways but just not believable. I’ve heard far far worse videos in this forum including a few that almost drum up a little nausea but I’ve also heard fabulous videos every so often.
I was not offended by your feedback. Surprised yes, offended no. With regard to my videos, I have a pretty good idea what I’m sharing. Though perhaps like some others who make similar videos, I’m wrestling with a handful of audio demons at the system and at the smartphone while attempting to put my best foot forward but even compromised I’m pretty confident with what I share.
Like I’ve said before, there are numerous educational perspectives to all published in-room videos good or and I’ll restate them here:
- They can or could help substantiate one’s position or claims about certain topics.
- They can help determine the author’s audio integrity.
- They will most always tell us far more than anybody’s words could ever tell us.
- Based on the comments received, they educate us on the audio integrity of the one providing feedback. IMO, high-end audio has many paper tigers and in-room recordings are an excellent means of helping to sift thru some of that. In fact, I suspect that’s why many give no credence whatsoever to in-room recordings. Because for some, if they gave videos any credence or submitted their own it could be gave over for them.
- Even the lack of comments receives, that too can sometimes educate us on the audio integrity of those not providing feedback.
Hmmmm. I always thought seasoned listeners could discern / interpret what they were hearing without depending on A/B comparisons.
We have no idea what the Carl Palmer drum video would sound like through your stereo. How could we? We cannot discern this from listening to different recordings of your system playing different recordings.
I won't comment too much on your system sound...it does sound quite dynamic and the low level resolution seems quite good; however, you are playing very loud so ambient cues will of course be more obvious...as long as the system can play this loud cleanly...probably many can't. What are the SPL levels that you are using when recording? Do those ambient cues hold up when you reduce the volume by 10-15db?
Well, we are not talking about an A/B comparison here are we? I am saying play the recording straight and then record the same recording but playing through your system. The straight recording (to headphones I presume) is the control reference and what we hear from you recording your system playing that recording is the test recording. Whatever editorializing your system, room and/or recording device imposes on the proceedings should be audible compared to the control reference. If your system does no editorializing then the two would sound identical, otherwise we can analyze what your system/room/recorder add or subtract from the control.
And being a larger than life showman with his kit in front of the band doesn’t make you a great drummer either. Rich is on few top ten lists of actual drummers, and few say they were influenced by him. Gene Krupa however usually garners the accolades of professionals in terms of big band drummers of the time.
Jeffrey, I think there are a few reasons why Buddy isn't on most lists for top drummer. One is the serious ego and the infamous "Buddy Rich tapes", and the fact he had very little time for many other drummers. A similar reason why Ginger Baker is admired but not loved in any way.
Another is the cosmic level technique that is both unlearnable and unfathomable, Buddy being someone who developed his skills at such an early age (playing from 1.5 years of age, professionally when he was still a kid, a lifestyle that would be deemed child abuse and breaking all sorts of employment and child endangerment laws today Lol).
Another was his inability in any way to break out of his tightly defined big band genre, his forays into funk and rock were truly awful, and thus for all his other worldly technique and mastery, it was in one facet only.
So, superhuman prodigiousness, big and equally bad personality, beyond comparable in one aspect of drumming only, the reasons why he is talked about in hushed tones, but very little love.
Neil Peart, who has always been close to my heart when I was a budding drummer in my teens/early 20s, and in some ways my personal favourite musician, like Buddy struggles to impress outside his genre (no Dennis Chambers is he, Peart comfortable on rock, not so much on jazz and funk)...but other than that shortfall, he matches Buddy for pure spectacle as a drummer in what he's brought to the drum solo as a rock drummer, is imho unmatched in terms of rock composition (I know a couple of professional orchestral percussionists who aren't the biggest fans of Rush, but feel Peart's talent on how he forms and combines his pieces is more special than most), and like the best drummers of all time has a unique sound and feel. The other main difference being his legendary humility, not sharing anything with Buddy here lol.
Another is the cosmic level technique that is both unlearnable and unfathomable, Buddy being someone who developed his skills at such an early age (playing from 1.5 years of age, professionally when he was still a kid, a lifestyle that would be deemed child abuse and breaking all sorts of employment and child endangerment laws today Lol).
Another was his inability in any way to break out of his tightly defined big band genre, his forays into funk and rock were truly awful, and thus for all his other worldly technique and mastery, it was in one facet only.
So, superhuman prodigiousness, big and equally bad personality, beyond comparable in one aspect of drumming only, the reasons why he is talked about in hushed tones, but very little love.
Neil Peart, who has always been close to my heart when I was a budding drummer in my teens/early 20s, and in some ways my personal favourite musician, like Buddy struggles to impress outside his genre (no Dennis Chambers is he, Peart comfortable on rock, not so much on jazz and funk)...but other than that shortfall, he matches Buddy for pure spectacle as a drummer in what he's brought to the drum solo as a rock drummer, is imho unmatched in terms of rock composition (I know a couple of professional orchestral percussionists who aren't the biggest fans of Rush, but feel Peart's talent on how he forms and combines his pieces is more special than most), and like the best drummers of all time has a unique sound and feel. The other main difference being his legendary humility, not sharing anything with Buddy here lol.
yes they were and got one play only and shelved for life. that being said he was good at what he did and is enjoyable to watch and listen to. truth is he had no real interest in other formats and you can tell his commitment level was a phone in
Keep in mind when he is doing his electronic drum bit, its all him, no click tracks. He triggers effects here and there but everything you here is him, no help. There is some footage out there of him that is just raw studio footage (no band members or recorded music) of the electronic part and is shows you so clearly how he does it and it boggles the mind.Yeah, sure, but..... Now I've no dog in this fight but how many of these other no-doubt great drummers were also genuine 1-man-bands? I listened to the entire 16:55 and as nice as it was, I was kinda' ready to wrap things up after about 7 minutes. But I have a feelin' I could probably completely engage the entire evening if Peart performed solo for hours. That's called entertainment and many ain't got that.
Actually he thinks way outside the box and I suspect that's what makes him great. Again, I know next to nothing about any of these guys, but that's entertainment. And ultimately, no matter how much some might dig deep into the weeds, ultimately entertainment reigns superior. I think.Anyway, if there was a survey my vote goes to Neil as the GOAT. Not only was he a 1-man-band but he was also all-in-one. He could be everything if he wanted. And he just demonstrated that in the video I provided earlier. That's pretty awesome stuff actually.
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Dammit, I just watched the Neil solo video again. Gotta' remember he not just played an 8-minute song he wrote. From this piece it seems to me that Neil wrote a small book with 5 very impressive chapters with one leading quite nicely to the next before venturing off in another direction and concluded in an almost 1812 Overture sort of way. Who else can do THAT?
If there's any other videos of Neil Peart solos especially in concert I'd love to know about them.
I'm starting to think Neil might be tribal.
It blew me away and I have not been able to find it again.
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