Stellavox Introduces a New State of the Art Amplifier IDEM Monoblocks

[Iamrael]

I did a search too before I posted, nada.
I agree it is somewhat a moot point if you end up liking the vox better as things are, but if you still prefer the Darts or you’re not sure after some time spent with the two sets, are you willing to throw in the towel and completely negate the possibility that further leveling the playing field might change your decision?
I think that the adapter can potentially skew the performance; heck, you might even prefer the dart more with an adapter than without.
Ps
I have a drawer full of Voodoo adapters acquired over the years and would be happy to send you a couple.

 

[jbrrp1]

I should note that my experience was with the basic VooDoo Cables adapters, not their more expensive "premium silver" ones.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

I did a search too before I posted, nada.
I agree it is somewhat a moot point if you end up liking the vox better as things are, but if you still prefer the Darts or you’re not sure after some time spent with the two sets, are you willing to throw in the towel and completely negate the possibility that further leveling the playing field might change your decision?
I think that the adapter can potentially skew the performance; heck, you might even prefer the dart more with an adapter than without.
Ps
I have a drawer full of Voodoo adapters acquired over the years and would be happy to send you a couple.

thank you for the kind offer. i will keep it in mind. and yes; if the Stella is preferred then not an issue, and then i will have the power cord IEC's changed to 15 amp IEC's. i know the EA System power cables use proprietary plugs, so might have to go back to them for the update.

but right now the cart before the horse.

 

[microstrip]

I am not part of the "everything makes a difference, and you can hear every difference" group. Respectfully, I am skeptical at the delta you are describing. (Although CH on Lyra is an extremely highly resolving combination, so we all might hear the differences you are describing.)

This delta would be possible if one of the adapters was of very poor electrical quality, introducing significant noise in the line. It is possible to make connectors that introduce noise - you just need the proper chemicals to modify the surfaces. In environments where mains carries a lot of RF noise such small things can generate significant sound differences. Systems with ground loops - the great majority of audiophile systems have them - are extremely susceptible to RF noise.

Anyway I believe Mike used quality adapters!

With the very easily perceivable and dramatic differences you are reporting I will apologize profusely for being skeptical after you identify correctly which is which on a blind A/B.

 

[cjfrbw]

 

[Mike Lavigne]

i really appreciated my 3 local friends taking their time to join me yesterday morning. as i said yesterday morning prior to our session, that session was just to see how the darts compared, and insights into what aspects to investigate, that the Stellavox was not yet where it needs to be. and i think mission accomplished.

thanks to @2fastdriving for commenting. i won't try to speak for the other two, but they did not disagree with his perspective. all three have different sonic compasses than myself.....so i was not surprised about that.

if you are auditioning something new and special, and you really get into it, you can get excited on the new things being offered that jump out, and maybe some of the oldie but goodie things left behind slip your mind. you drink the cool aid. and yet maybe those new things are closer to your target sound, and some of the old things are maybe familiar but not preferred in the end. not everyone is up to taking risks, considering new different things. that's personal.

listening to 7 or 8 tracks on each set of amps is a different kind of thing than hours and hours letting the music come to you on it's own terms. and where that takes you. you need both types of answers. the clear objective differences, and the inner musical meanings.....where the music takes you. ultimately my desire is for optimal enjoyment from my system.

adding the darTZeel 468's back into the system did make it clear just how awesome they are, but also expose the darts to me as maybe slightly colored, maybe more than i might have realized objectively after 20 years of it. as a person with a tube OTL amp reference sound, i have always appreciated their contributions. and i loved and still love that color. but is it for me? OTOH the Stellavox is not a solid state sound so far to my ears. it's much more about purity, liquidity, speed, nuance, musical flow, ease and eliminating any sort of processed sound. that is the road it seems i'm going down with them. and i will continue to enjoy this process with them. thanks again to Gideon for this opportunity.

i need to explore in depth the lower gain settings on the IDEM's to see if more purity and nuance is there. that is maybe the next thing for me. they now have enough hours on them for that.

if the Stellavox happens to be just good solid state, and not those other things, then maybe the darts are the better longer term partner. the 468's are formidable amplifiers, and not easily replaced.

 

[LL21]

Fascinating reading, and it appears they are both design titans as one would have hoped. Enjoy! A rare opportunity to be sure...look forward to reading more!

 

[pk_LA]

i really appreciated my 3 local friends taking their time to join me yesterday morning. as i said yesterday morning prior to our session, that session was just to see how the darts compared, and insights into what aspects to investigate, that the Stellavox was not yet where it needs to be. and i think mission accomplished.

thanks to @2fastdriving for commenting. i won't try to speak for the other two, but they did not disagree with his perspective. all three have different sonic compasses than myself.....so i was not surprised about that.

if you are auditioning something new and special, and you really get into it, you can get excited on the new things being offered that jump out, and maybe some of the oldie but goodie things left behind slip your mind. you drink the cool aid. and yet maybe those new things are closer to your target sound, and some of the old things are maybe familiar but not preferred in the end. not everyone is up to taking risks, considering new different things. that's personal.

listening to 7 or 8 tracks on each set of amps is a different kind of thing than hours and hours letting the music come to you on it's own terms. and where that takes you. you need both types of answers. the clear objective differences, and the inner musical meanings.....where the music takes you. ultimately my desire is for optimal enjoyment from my system.

adding the darTZeel 468's back into the system did make it clear just how awesome they are, but also expose the darts to me as maybe slightly colored, maybe more than i might have realized objectively after 20 years of it. as a person with a tube OTL amp reference sound, i have always appreciated their contributions. and i loved and still love that color. but is it for me? OTOH the Stellavox is not a solid state sound so far to my ears. it's much more about purity, liquidity, speed, nuance, musical flow, ease and eliminating any sort of processed sound. that is the road it seems i'm going down with them. and i will continue to enjoy this process with them. thanks again to Gideon for this opportunity.

i need to explore in depth the lower gain settings on the IDEM's to see if more purity and nuance is there. that is maybe the next thing for me. they now have enough hours on them for that.

if the Stellavox happens to be just good solid state, and not those other things, then maybe the darts are the better longer term partner. the 468's are formidable amplifiers, and not easily replaced.

If you are in the market for new amplifiers, would it not make most sense to audition a wider array of options in your system? Especially since the Stellavie opened your ears to how colored your Dartzeels are?

 

[Mike Lavigne]

If you are in the market for new amplifiers, would it not make most sense to audition a wider array of options in your system? Especially since the Stellavox opened your ears to how colored your Dartzeels are?

i was not/am not in the market for new amplifiers. i was just minding my own business, delighted with my darts, when i was offered the opportunity to a home demo of new mono blocks. an audiophile i've known a long time had these same model amps, also had Tenors, and owned a darTZeel amplifier. he had sampled some other current amplifiers, chosen this one, and thought i would like it. there was some level of realization these could be something special and up my alley of sonic fit. so you could say that these amplifiers found me. and i'm intrigued by their sound so far.

as far as the darts having a slight tube coloration i'm happy to ride into the sunset with them, unless these demo mono blocks take me to a higher musical place. but i'm not actively thinking of other alternatives. objectively the tube coloration of the darTZeel 468's, along with it's other attributes, still make it to me the most desirable amplifiers for me i know about up to this time. it's part of their magic.

i guess in theory someone else could offer me a free home demo on other amplifiers, and then i would have to decide whether it was worth my time based on the whole picture. how likely would it fit my system expectations? could i afford it? it could happen. but i have no plans to pursue it.

 

[Ron Resnick]

as far as the darts having a slight tube coloration

Hi Mike,

You explained to me years ago that your philosophy of system-building is neutrality from every component. You have always described the darTZeels as neutral.

When did the darTZeels contract an unappealing "slight tube coloration"?

 

[Kvali1]

Hi Mike,

You explained to me years ago that your philosophy of system-building is neutrality from every component. You have always described the darTZeels as neutral.

When did the darTZeels contract a "slight tube coloration"?

When he heard the stellavox ?

 

[vinyl_mike]

i really appreciated my 3 local friends taking their time to join me yesterday morning. as i said yesterday morning prior to our session, that session was just to see how the darts compared, and insights into what aspects to investigate, that the Stellavox was not yet where it needs to be. and i think mission accomplished.

thanks to @2fastdriving for commenting. i won't try to speak for the other two, but they did not disagree with his perspective. all three have different sonic compasses than myself.....so i was not surprised about that.

if you are auditioning something new and special, and you really get into it, you can get excited on the new things being offered that jump out, and maybe some of the oldie but goodie things left behind slip your mind. you drink the cool aid. and yet maybe those new things are closer to your target sound, and some of the old things are maybe familiar but not preferred in the end. not everyone is up to taking risks, considering new different things. that's personal.

listening to 7 or 8 tracks on each set of amps is a different kind of thing than hours and hours letting the music come to you on it's own terms. and where that takes you. you need both types of answers. the clear objective differences, and the inner musical meanings.....where the music takes you. ultimately my desire is for optimal enjoyment from my system.

adding the darTZeel 468's back into the system did make it clear just how awesome they are, but also expose the darts to me as maybe slightly colored, maybe more than i might have realized objectively after 20 years of it. as a person with a tube OTL amp reference sound, i have always appreciated their contributions. and i loved and still love that color. but is it for me? OTOH the Stellavox is not a solid state sound so far to my ears. it's much more about purity, liquidity, speed, nuance, musical flow, ease and eliminating any sort of processed sound. that is the road it seems i'm going down with them. and i will continue to enjoy this process with them. thanks again to Gideon for this opportunity.

i need to explore in depth the lower gain settings on the IDEM's to see if more purity and nuance is there. that is maybe the next thing for me. they now have enough hours on them for that.

if the Stellavox happens to be just good solid state, and not those other things, then maybe the darts are the better longer term partner. the 468's are formidable amplifiers, and not easily replaced.

I found it somewhat counterintuitive, but lowering the Stellavox input gain produced a dramatic improvement in the sound. For my ears, the lowest gain of 14dB is absolute heaven.

 

[microstrip]

(...) The dartzeel is a solid state amplifier that tube lovers can really appreciate. It's an ideal marriage of what solid state does best and what tubes do best. It has more body, tonal density, and big soundstage, but it's not giving up much ground (if any) on the details and dynamics. (...)

Ok, solid points we can easily understand.

(...) adding the darTZeel 468's back into the system did make it clear just how awesome they are, but also expose the darts to me as maybe slightly colored, maybe more than i might have realized objectively after 20 years of it. as a person with a tube OTL amp reference sound, i have always appreciated their contributions. and i loved and still love that color. but is it for me? OTOH the Stellavox is not a solid state sound so far to my ears. it's much more about purity, liquidity, speed, nuance, musical flow, ease and eliminating any sort of processed sound. that is the road it seems i'm going down with them. and i will continue to enjoy this process with them. thanks again to Gideon for this opportunity.

i need to explore in depth the lower gain settings on the IDEM's to see if more purity and nuance is there. that is maybe the next thing for me. they now have enough hours on them for that. (...)

Aren't you afraid that your search for purity and musical flow, referenced to an old OTL experience, can block the analysis of aspects such as sound stage layering, dynamics, bass definition, rhythm, transparency, musicality and control?

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Hi Mike,

You explained to me years ago that your philosophy of system-building is neutrality from every component. You have always described the darTZeels as neutral.

When did the darTZeels contract a "slight tube coloration"?

well....er.....there is the very first post i wrote about the 468's in 2019. i'm pretty decisive about it. tubes. and i've wrote it many times since in one way or another.

and from the bigger picture of darTZeel feedback over the years they are pretty much recognized as the solid state amp for tube lovers. enough of that tube liquidity and nuance to hold onto. without the tube hassle and with lower noise and more linear powerful bass. can scale without losing cohesion or getting more tubey and excess coloration. music has color and that is not inherently bad. but it can be.

as far neutrality; the classic solid state sound might be sonic neutrality, but not musical neutrality. or as Peter might say, not classically natural sound. natural sound to me is a touch of tubes. but staying in the neutral zone. the Tenor OTL's were there too. my system is balanced for my darTZeel's to disappear and not be prominent.....but bringing in another more neutral amp does highlight the differences.

as far as the Stellavox and it's neutrality, the amplifier i have had in my system it most reminds of "so far" is the Berning 211/845.....but with balls, and that can scale and control my speakers. read my posts on this thread for my comments. a very very neutral OTL topology (to the degree that i understand it).

so between the Tenor OTL's and the Bering 211/845 OTL's to me both the darts and the Stella fit into that reference sound for me and also into the natural neutrality thing too. provisionally at least so far regarding the Stella's. it has to play out.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Aren't you afraid that your search for purity and musical flow, referenced to an old OTL experience, can block the analysis of aspects such as sound stage layering, dynamics, bass definition, rhythm, transparency, musicality and control?

in the short term yes, those ARE concerns. i'm getting enough of those things so far that i'm comfortable and not feeling missing elements. but until they are more broken in not being too critical. i don't expect the bass is all the way in yet.

on Saturday morning session with my friends, for instance, i was seated in row 2, left side, not in the sweet spot. so @2fastdriving comments about soundstage were mostly not confirmed by me. i will need to do a darTZeel session for myself seated in the holodeck spot. Saturday was more for my friends.

 

[Kingsrule]

Another consideration not mentioned yet:

Lavigne Darts are 6 years old. Parts ageing, especially the caps and a company that is suspect. Where does one get Darts refurbished/repaired/?
Vs. Stellavox..new design and a company that knows service is paramount...with a US distributor....

 

[Mike Lavigne]

Another consideration not mentioned yet:

Lavigne Darts are 6 years old. Parts ageing, especially the caps and a company that is suspect. Where does one get Darts refurbished/repaired/?
Vs. Stellavox..new design and a company that knows service is paramount...with a US distributor....

fair comments.

Herve is alive and kicking in Switzerland. things are happening. he is doing repairs, and more. my local friend Andrey Kosobutsky can repair darTZeel's. i don't personally have one whit of concern. but i would not try to convince anyone about it. too early.

 

[microstrip]

fair comments.

Herve is alive and kicking in Switzerland. things are happening. he is doing repairs, and more. my local friend Andrey Kosobutsky can repair darTZeel's. i don't personally have one whit of concern. but i would not try to convince anyone about it. too early.

My main concern about long time service of such expensive units is the availability of programmable microprocessors, custom displays or similar custom digital devices. All else is serviceable, unless the boards set on fire!

 

[Dierkx1]

fair comments.

Herve is alive and kicking in Switzerland. things are happening. he is doing repairs, and more. my local friend Andrey Kosobutsky can repair darTZeel's. i don't personally have one whit of concern. but i would not try to convince anyone about it. too early.

thanks for sharing Andrey's name.good to know if my darTZeel needs service.

 

[Mike Lavigne]

thanks for sharing Andrey's name.good to know if my darTZeel needs service.

factory would be choice #1 for sure.