A view shared (problem of spikes) by both Swenson and Stordiau, the first from having read his posts, the second from having had this kind of exchange with him over at CA.
Sonore's microrendu is out - the first audiophile microcomputer?
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A view shared (problem of spikes) by both Swenson and Stordiau, the first from having read his posts, the second from having had this kind of exchange with him over at CA.
I don't think Amir has any experience nor objective thoughts on the Microrendu.
Amir still hasn't replied to a few questions:
1. How his DAC treats PCM internally?
2. What he meant by "Their CAP server"
Can you see any ask for measurement in the thread title or post?
Do you see this in the measurement sub-forum?
Can't you do your own? Or your own thread in another sub-forum or in another forum altogether?
Can't you do your own search for the publishing of measurements?
And finally, why are you asking me?
Where are the measurements? And why do you think my knowledge is limited to general computing? You know anyone else who has the type of measurement equipment I have just for grins???
I have met John and have tested his products. John's background is in VLSI design unrelated to audio. He doesn't have proper audio measurement capability, nor in my opinion, understanding of what matters in audio fidelity+computing technology. That is why his Regen has not performed as stated.
No need to be so touchy. You mentioned a specific problem of spikes, your readings and discussions of it. I just thought you might have encountered some measurements along the way somewhere. I am just asking if you have seen any. I am not demanding or insisting on them.
John says a lot of these things. Problem is, he can't show any evidence that his fixes are effective relative to what finally comes out of the DAC. You know, the sound that we ultimately hear.
There is a lot of hero worshipping here with no substance.
Seems like he wants to claim technical improvements left and right, yet not have to demonstrate any of them being true. If he doesn't want to be questioned on them, he should not stomp his feet that these things exist. It would make a mockery of any forum discussion to want to say things but not hear an ask for why they are true.
Eh, the sound is the evidence - I and others don't need anything else. Something you obviously haven't or can't experience, it seems.
I & others have been doing these sort of tweaks/experiments on TirnaHiFi for some time now - powering individual parts of computer motherboard with separate & better PS - each of these provided some audible improvement - cumulatively they provided a very worthwhile audible improvement.
I'm more interested in audible improvements than trying to prove anything to you or others on a forum - anybody who hears this doesn't need measurements
A man obviously in love with his equipment - down boy, down
John S makes much more sense as he has experience in this domain - the design of VLSI requires an understanding of ground bounce, of self noise of the whole power distribution network involved in powering chips. Your trying to suggests that none of this is relevant to audio is far off the mark. His track record stands for itself in audio as people judge products by listening rather than by measuring & his products pass this test, admirably for most.
His Regen does perform when the PS is attended to & when the clock & USB hub chip are run directly from 3.3V battery, it is a stellar performer
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Please don't take this the wrong way... But you are so off base and out of line it is laughable. Do you actually have any idea about these devices? Wish there was a real moderator here.
Steve williams
Site Founder, Site Co-Owner, Administrator
careful his measuring equipment is bigger than yours
I see this piece of equipment as a valiant attempt by Jesus and his partner to make a computer desirable for music lovers.It is a computer at its core with differences from a common computer. Jesus has never once made bold claims and what do we see? Once again an attempt to cast shadows over yet another product. They utilize linear regulators on some of the unit's circuits and they don't include circuits they don't need. For better or worse that is the concept. They do not hide the fact that it's based on Linux at it's core. They make no claim that this makes a difference. They use it because it headless, simple, robust and has the features they need to meet the product goals.They can't respond to what people are saying, but their product website is pretty straight forward. At the end of the day they are just a couple of guys making a new product.
Look at the grief he has taken
Just my $0.02
I know. I tried to tell him this when he posted this & other comments but he continues to ignore the common sense in what others say.
Saw this sig recently which is applicable "Within the realm of audiophilia, there's the religion of believing in fairy tales, and there's the religion of believing in nothing without proof. Somewhere in the middle is something called common sense."
Of course. I have managed the development of full computer system including design of VLSIs that go in them. In addition, I have years of experience working on the operating system that goes into them and taught classes for 10+ years at University of California to others. I post a link to my book on the topic. Computer systems, architecture, hardware, software, performance, networking, etc. are all what my 35+ years of professional career was all about.
Do a bit of research for heaven's sake before making such comments. Or ask questions.
Now, what are your qualifications in this regard?
Nope. Somewhere in all of this back and forth needs to be data John. You have provided none. You read things online, then try to advocate them. You can waste someone else's time with incessant questioning but with me, you need to do your homework, have hands on experience and then we can talk. Just engaging in a debate based on what you have read and makes sense to your lay stomach, is not what I am interested.
No, my professional experience is far more than his. Just as your professional medical experience is far more than mine. Would love to see a bunch of patients telling that you don't know anything about medicine see your reaction Steve. What an unkind thing to say
.There is no grief here if the product performs. As to what it says it can do, this is what it says:
"What makes the microRendu different from a typical computer music server is that it's a purpose built audiophile device. The problem with computer music servers is that they all rely on mass produced motherboards designed for general purpose computing and are built to the lowest possible price point. The microRendu solves this problem by removing the consumer grade computer peripherals and optimizing power supplies where necessary. The microRendu has been specifically built for processing USB audio perfectly. "
All I am asking for is some evidence of underlined section above because that is why people are rushing to buy it. It may very well have achieved that. In which case, it should be trivial to demonstrate it. They can take some of these audiophile servers, hook them up to a DAC and measure the output. Then repeat with theirs and demonstrate the perfection it achieves.
You seem to advocate that manufactures should be given the benefit of the doubt that they have built the perfect USB device, and that us as consumers should accept that on face value. What is the purpose of this forum? To provide advertising for manufacturers?
Any engineer who has perfected the USB audio would be proud to demonstrate such. They would have measured it during development to demonstrate the same to themselves as they tested different designs. And once they achieved it, they would want to shout from mountaintop about it.
Folks who don't want to do that, talk about this and that technical theory that sounds plausible to audiophiles and let the imagination run wild from there.
How we have deviated from our original charter in this forum to today is just remarkable to me....
Yes, I expected you would be afraid of doing such a measurement as you are aware that the measurements won't show what differences are being heard. You're bluff & blister doesn't fool anyone no matter how often you repeat it.
I am making measurements these days that if any fellow engineer saw me doing, would campaign to get my EE degree rescinded.
No one is more willing to accept these theories to be correct from objectivity camp than me. Get me any tweak in the world and I will spend the time measuring it. Your last assertion is also completely wrong. I measure. Then use psychoacoustics to determine audibility. I don't stick my wet thumb in the air and declare every scheme out there as good yet be unmeasurable.
If you get personal one more time John, violating TOS, I will hand you a sanction. Stay on the topic of the thread.
Steve williams
Site Founder, Site Co-Owner, Administrator
No, my professional experience is far more than his. Just as your professional medical experience is far more than mine. Would love to see a bunch of patients telling that you don't know anything about medicine see your reaction Steve. What an unkind thing to say
There is no grief here if the product performs. As to what it says it can do, this is what it says:
"What makes the microRendu different from a typical computer music server is that it's a purpose built audiophile device. The problem with computer music servers is that they all rely on mass produced motherboards designed for general purpose computing and are built to the lowest possible price point. The microRendu solves this problem by removing the consumer grade computer peripherals and optimizing power supplies where necessary. The microRendu has been specifically built for processing USB audio perfectly. "
All I am asking for is some evidence of underlined section above because that is why people are rushing to buy it. It may very well have achieved that. In which case, it should be trivial to demonstrate it. They can take some of these audiophile servers, hook them up to a DAC and measure the output. Then repeat with theirs and demonstrate the perfection it achieves.
You seem to advocate that manufactures should be given the benefit of the doubt that they have built the perfect USB device, and that us as consumers should accept that on face value. What is the purpose of this forum? To provide advertising for manufacturers?
Any engineer who has perfected the USB audio would be proud to demonstrate such. They would have measured it during development to demonstrate the same to themselves as they tested different designs. And once they achieved it, they would want to shout from mountaintop about it.
Folks who don't want to do that, talk about this and that technical theory that sounds plausible to audiophiles and let the imagination run wild from there.
How we have deviated from our original charter in this forum to today is just remarkable to me....
strange but you are the only one who seems to have heartburn about this product. By all accounts at CA this is a terrific product and has none of the issues that you feel are paramount. Perhaps you might want to ask Jesus to loan you one so that you can work your wonders with your uber expensive measuring equipment. Let me count now how many manufacturers you have trashed here. The good thing as I see it is that no one really cares and remain heavily invested in the products that you say are crap..
As far as your analogy about me and medicine as compared to you and your expensive instruments, I can say that I had a gold scalpel, much more expensive than the others. Did it make me a better surgeon.....Not in the least
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