Reflections on cable pricing insanity

microstrip

VIP/Donor
May 30, 2010
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Portugal
So I just inserted my newly acquired Transparent Reference cable in the cooker and the "active" light does not come on for one cable. When I insert it in my system it produces sound, but about 10dB lower volume than the other cable, so it is playing single ended and one of the two conductors in the balanced signal paths is not working. I find it pretty unbelievable quality control at TA lets a defective $5K cable slip through....... Huge disappointment. I'll probably lose at least a week getting this resolved, which is eternatity on the "audiophile full of anticipation" timescale.

Edorr,

When this happens you dealer, who earned the sales of the cables, is responsible to find a way to make this eternity pass faster - he should lend you some other product to keep you entertained, even offering tickets for a short cruise if you are buying Opus ;) - it is known that times goes faster if you are in a enjoyable mood!

Unfortunately posting in a forum is of little help - you even risk that some non-believers will immediately take the occasion to report that they never had problems with zip cord. :cool:
 

still-one

VIP/Donor
Aug 6, 2012
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Milford, Michigan
So I just inserted my newly acquired Transparent Reference cable in the cooker and the "active" light does not come on for one cable. When I insert it in my system it produces sound, but about 10dB lower volume than the other cable, so it is playing single ended and one of the two conductors in the balanced signal paths is not working. I find it pretty unbelievable quality control at TA lets a defective $5K cable slip through....... Huge disappointment. I'll probably lose at least a week getting this resolved, which is eternatity on the "audiophile full of anticipation" timescale.

I have no idea what a "cooker" does or how it functions and since I do not know what is inside the network boxes on my Transparent cables, I would have at least asked Transparent ahead of time whether they suggest you use one.

Now that may not have anything to do with your issue, but you never know.
 

MylesBAstor

Well-Known Member
Apr 20, 2010
11,236
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New York City
I have no idea what a "cooker" does or how it functions and since I do not know what is inside the network boxes on my Transparent cables, I would have at least asked Transparent ahead of time whether they suggest you use one.

Now that may not have anything to do with your issue, but you never know.

I asked TA (since MIT doesn't recommend the use of a burn-in device) and they said there was no problem using a cable cooker with their cables.
 

MylesBAstor

Well-Known Member
Apr 20, 2010
11,236
81
1,725
New York City
I inserted a pair of MIT MA-X SHD Interconnects between my preamp and amplifiers yesterday. They're not even on the MIT website yet. They replaced the previous generation MA-X Rev. 2 which had the same position in my system. Almost zero break in but initial opinion is WOW! Rest of the system has MA-X Rev2 ICs and SHD speaker cables so I'm accustomed to the MIT sound. Just incredible what one pair of these new ICs are doing for the bass, clarity and overall presentation. After 1 day! In keeping with the theme of the thread, insane pricing? yes, but the results are glorious.

Interesting, heard good things about these cables :)
 

Elliot G.

Industry Expert
Jul 22, 2010
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www.bendingwaveusa.com
A cooker? what is that? Are you using a Nordost cable burn in device?
 

edorr

WBF Founding Member
May 10, 2010
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Smyrna, GA
Edorr,

When this happens you dealer, who earned the sales of the cables, is responsible to find a way to make this eternity pass faster - he should lend you some other product to keep you entertained, even offering tickets for a short cruise if you are buying Opus ;) - it is known that times goes faster if you are in a enjoyable mood!

Unfortunately posting in a forum is of little help - you even risk that some non-believers will immediately take the occasion to report that they never had problems with zip cord. :cool:

Well, at least TA and my dealer are taking good care of me. They were notified on thurday morning, immediately get a technician to work on calibrating a cable and shipped out a replacement thursday afternoon, overnight air. This should be on my doorstep when I get home this evening. So overall I loose just two days. Pretty impressive customer service overall.
 

PeterA

Well-Known Member
Dec 6, 2011
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USA
Well, at least TA and my dealer are taking good care of me. They were notified on thurday morning, immediately get a technician to work on calibrating a cable and shipped out a replacement thursday afternoon, overnight air. This should be on my doorstep when I get home this evening. So overall I loose just two days. Pretty impressive customer service overall.

edorr, did you contact your dealer or Transparent directly before posting your complaint in this forum?
 

PeterA

Well-Known Member
Dec 6, 2011
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Contacted the dealer. I never had any direct interactions with TA myself.

So, as I understand it, you noticed the problem and at some point contacted your dealer. You posted the complaint here on Wednesday (4/24/13). Transparent was notified on Thursday morning and they shipped out a replacement on Thursday afternoon using overnight air which you plan to receive today, Friday. I know it must be inconvenient, but that seems like pretty quick service and good customer support.
 

edorr

WBF Founding Member
May 10, 2010
3,139
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Smyrna, GA
So, as I understand it, you noticed the problem and at some point contacted your dealer. You posted the complaint here on Wednesday (4/24/13). Transparent was notified on Thursday morning and they shipped out a replacement on Thursday afternoon using overnight air which you plan to receive today, Friday. I know it must be inconvenient, but that seems like pretty quick service and good customer support.

Correct. In fact I received the cable Wednesday night and immediately noticed the problem (courtesy of led on my cable cooker! - without it I would have probably been using the cable and not noticed there was a problem until I did a MCH channel trim calibration. At this point I would have noticed one channel plays 10db lower, and not a clue where to start looking to troubleshoot the issue. A total nightmare scenario). I emailed the dealer in the evening and he responded the same evening using his iPhone. We had a new calibrated cable shipped to me within 24 hours. Kudo's to the dealer. Additional benefit. I bought the cable as a showroom demo at a discount. The replacement cable I am receiving in brand new.

Only snag is they shipped it without signature required and the cable has been left on my porch today which is making me a bit nervous. I have never had anything disappear so should be OK.
 

PeterA

Well-Known Member
Dec 6, 2011
12,523
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3,515
USA
Correct. In fact I received the cable Wednesday night and immediately noticed the problem (courtesy of led on my cable cooker! - without it I would have probably been using the cable and not noticed there was a problem until I did a MCH channel trim calibration. At this point I would have noticed one channel plays 10db lower, and not a clue where to start looking to troubleshoot the issue. A total nightmare scenario). I emailed the dealer in the evening and he responded the same evening using his iPhone. We had a new calibrated cable shipped to me within 24 hours. Kudo's to the dealer. Additional benefit. I bought the cable as a showroom demo at a discount. The replacement cable I am receiving in brand new.

Only snag is they shipped it without signature required and the cable has been left on my porch today which is making me a bit nervous. I have never had anything disappear so should be OK.

Wow, 48 hour turnaround and you got a new cable. Now that is service. Sounds like an excellent dealer. I once tried to get the DIN plug on my old phono cable rotated by the manufacturer (not Transparent) and called the manufacturer. I even offered to drive to his shop and hand deliver it because he was only one hour away. After a week, he emailed me back, writing me that he would try to fit me in. After a couple more emails with excuses, he stopped responding to my requests. I ended up doing the repair myself. I guess some companies treat their customers well and some others don't.
 

edorr

WBF Founding Member
May 10, 2010
3,139
14
36
Smyrna, GA
Wow, 48 hour turnaround and you got a new cable. Now that is service. Sounds like an excellent dealer. I once tried to get the DIN plug on my old phono cable rotated by the manufacturer (not Transparent) and called the manufacturer. I even offered to drive to his shop and hand deliver it because he was only one hour away. After a week, he emailed me back, writing me that he would try to fit me in. After a couple more emails with excuses, he stopped responding to my requests. I ended up doing the repair myself. I guess some companies treat their customers well and some others don't.

I was referred to these guys by forum member Priaptor. I was shopping for a Ref 5 or Ref 5 SE and he mentioned his dealer had one listed as a trade in. They ended up selling me a traded in 5Se for a very fair price. When I needed a TA cable they turned out to be a dealer, and found me a showroom demo with a hefty discount. Very happy with them.
 

MarinJim

New Member
Feb 2, 2011
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0
I have Purist Audio Design and Jena Labs cables. Not only are these the best I have so far had in my system, when I call, I get either Jim or Jena answering the phone to answer my questions! And they are extremely gracious.
 

LL21

Well-Known Member
Dec 26, 2010
14,411
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I have Purist Audio Design and Jena Labs cables. Not only are these the best I have so far had in my system, when I call, I get either Jim or Jena answering the phone to answer my questions! And they are extremely gracious.

I never thought about power cables a few years ago. Thought it was a waste. I now own PAD Dominus/Ann Contego across all my components...Sablon Audio PC for Velodyne and Oppo 95. Why? I walked into demo room on a Saturday just before closing...to say hi. heard a system with components i knew well but had never heard this particular system or combination before.

My first thought? Sounds far too good, too resolved, too 'high end' for this level of equipment...not close. Must be the CD. Took it out and went searched in the store for MTV Unplugged. Dropped it in...wow! Still far far cleaner, deeper depth of note than it should have been! This is about 3 minutes from walking into the room...popped my head outside and ask the guys what i was missing about this system...why so high end, resolving, quiet, incredibly beautiful rendering. They came in...hunh...nothing special really.

Whats that huge thing in the back there? Oh...that's the power cable.

Can we take it out put a normal one in?...blam!...soundstage shrank and the quality of the notes roughened up back to where i would have expected it to be. That's midfi sound.

Bought the cable the next day after sleeping on it and a home audition...and since bought for the rest of the system over time. The one component least influenced by PC was the CJ ACT 2. Still better but could have lived without it had the cables not been deeply discounted.

Great stuff. Have never looked back, and not searched for any other PCs since. And agree with MarinJim...i have called PAD and spoken with Jim Aud as well...great suff. Very very responsive on emails as well.
 

RichDavis

Well-Known Member
Feb 3, 2014
182
16
248
Here's my take. First, there is the cost of R&D, cost of mfg, and then overhead costs of just running the business. Obviously, no company is mass producing any of their cables once you get above $100 retail. The methods of construction can vary depending on everything involved. Yeah, some companies just have higher overhead costs, they look at the sales figures for each product line and then they determine what the market will bear for them to bring in so much profit to run the business and pay salaries, etc. etc. etc.

Originally, the first "EXPENSIVE" audio cables were first done by Monster since they used the MIT patented cable design which was VERY expensive to mfg, licensing costs, etc. That's when the whole concept of expensive audio cables first appeared. Then it's just gets more insane as time went on. Some companies are actually trying to lower the cost. Bertram pretty much went away with high markups and now goes either direct or through dealers that have lower markups. So, their prices have gone down by as much as 70% from what they used to be retail.

MIT has introduced their filter box cables where they went to surface mount technology and plastic cases for their "MORE AFFORADABLE" Style Series, but they STILL make their ultra high end models that cost in the $50K range, but they aren't selling these by the thousands, so they do have to at least break even in the end. And due to what's inside the boxes, the expense of the components (EXTREMELY tight tolerance), a LOT of hand labor (which isn't cheap), etc. they have to have enough profit to make it worthwhile keeping on the price list. Dealer markup is where a LOT of the price is at and dealers aren't swimming in money, since they have to pay for inventory, and they have to carry a decent amount, even if they only sell a couple of pairs a year.

Personally, there are way too many cable mfg on the market. Every time I turn around, a new one appears and some of these companies seem to just limp along. There are only a small handful that actually are doing well financially speaking.

I just wish there was a standard testing methodology where frequency response curves and impedance measurements were published to show us how different these cables are in terms of linearity and give us some indication on if the cable is going to match well, from an impedance perspective, to the equipment we are going to connect them with.

And in the audio industry, like many other, the retail prices go up on a log scale, but price doesn't necessarily mean better. So, one companies $100K cable doesn't mean it's going to sound better than another brand's $50K model, or another brand's $10K model. but within a brand, it probably will sound better because they are using the same type of technology, just on a level that just costs more. SO for instance, MIT's top end cables should theoretically sound better than their less expensive models because they are deploying more filters in those boxes, so the more filters, the more neutral the cable. But it doesn't necessarily mean that MIT's least expensive cable is going to sound worse than another brand's most expensive cable because another company isn't using the same technology.
 

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