Look up at your ceiling
You think the beam is making the difference?
Look up at your ceiling
Madfloyd said, "Here's measurements of the individual speakers at the listening position (without the subs you see"
Can we see the measured response with the subs? I am sure it must look much better as a complete system.
Wendell
Floyd: just saw this thread. When you had the system set up in front of the fireplace, you didn't have all the gear in between the speakers. Now you do. Wonder what that's doing.....
But Bill the results looked virtually the same at the top end in either location.
Really? I've always thought the Sashas were quite extended compared to other systems I've heard.
Frankly, there’s only so much trust I’d only put in a mic that doesn’t have a custom calibration file. That said...I'm using REW software, ...with an Earthworks M30 microphone (calibrated for measuring).
What I see is that your reference track doesn’t really jibe with the audible deficiency you describe – reduced upper-mids and highs.... but there's also a difference in the high frequencies.
The presentation from this perspective is very pleasing, but the upper mids/highs sound a little rolled off. For example, the title track on Shelby Lynne's 'Just A Little Loving' that starts out with drums and very little instrumentation has a snare rimshot that sounds more like wood blocks - doesn't have that 'snap' to it. On other systems - or on my own system in the other orientation... the rimshot sounds great - as there is more upper frequency energy.
Are your Transparent Audio cables specifically tuned for your tube amplifiers? Although I like a lot these cables, with some amplifiers they rob air and make them lifeless - IMHO, no cable is perfect for all systems.
From my experience with the brand, the worst condition of operation is using a cable tuned for a very high damping amplifier with a tube amplifier.
Hi Floyd,
Frankly, there’s only so much trust I’d only put in a mic that doesn’t have a custom calibration file. That said...
What I see is that your reference track doesn’t really jibe with the audible deficiency you describe – reduced upper-mids and highs.
The reason the rim shot sounds great in your fireplace speaker placement can be easily explained. For starters, the primary frequency content of a rim shot is more correctly in the 1-2 kHz range, if that high. Much lower than the “upper frequency energy” you believe it resides in. And look at your fireplace graph: Response is hot in the 1-2 kHz range, and is reduced overall both above and below that point!! So the reason that rim shot that sounds so good with the fireplace location is actually the result of poor overall balance that’s exaggerating the frequency range the rim shot “lives in.” You’re actually getting a better representation of how that rim shot sounds in relation to the rest of the recording with your window speaker placement, which (if we can trust the measurements made with an uncalibrated mic) exhibits flatter overall response.
The open wall would have little effect on the left speaker's response from the midrange up. However, you’d probably see less comb filtering from that speaker in the upper frequencies, as would be visible with an unsmoothed graph. I do find it curious that the open wall seems to have no adverse affect on the left speaker’s bass response. Without the reinforcement from a nearby boundary, I’d expect to see measured response below 200 Hz or so reduced overall compared to the right speaker.
Again, your window-placement graph is much better than the fireplace, IMO, as it’s more linear across the board. There are a couple of problem areas with those graphs that jump out at me however, starting with the broad dip between 2-4 kHz. It’s evident with both graphs (window and fireplace), indicating that it’s either a characteristic of the speakers, or of the speaker/room combination.
Other problems I see with the window graph is the significant hole between 200-40 Hz, and the hole in response between ~ 125-160 Hz in the speaker that owns the blue trace.
I expect you’d realize an audible improvement fixing these problems with parametric equalization.
Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt
There are quite a few speakers that have a slightly rolled of top end , avalon indra inroom response fig 7.
http://www.stereophile.com/content/avalon-acoustics-indra-loudspeaker-measurements
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