What is going on with TACT and Lyngdorf

FrantzM

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Apr 20, 2010
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Hi

I am slowly rebuilding a system. I have been interested in DRC but have been also doing the usual audiophile hand-wrangling. I liked what TACT did. I have heard some system based around TACT and liked what they did, being forced fo the next two years to use a normal Living room as listening room thus room treatments options are limited will of course use multi-sub. I was about to acquire a TACT preamp.
I went on the TACT user group and there seems to be problems on the support side with TACT apparently not even returning phone calls and e-mails. Not that I checked . I am interested and would like those more informed to let us know what is going on with TACT. Seems that Lyngdorf may have raised similar concerns about their support too.

In advance, thanks for your replies.
 

rblnr

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I was on the phone w/Boz of TacT a few months ago, he talked me thru software installation on an XP that had been bricked by a careless dealer. Could have been I just happened to call at the right time, but caught him and he was patient and thorough.

I've been using a TacT mini for years in my second system -- it's in a living room I cannot treat and speaker positioning is somewhat less than ideal -- these for WAF reasons. I put some really good preamps and DACs in front of my ATC 20-2 actives -- VTL 5.5, EMM Dac2, et al. Tried the TacT and its DRC and have never looked back. I think in a room you can't treat, full range RC is absolutely the way to go.
 

amirm

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I would completely stay away. Reliability is a major issue as is support for products in my opinion.
 

FrantzM

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TacT AUdio website no longer works ... Are they out of business?
 

microstrip

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TacT AUdio website no longer works ... Are they out of business?

Their site is working perfectly - just consulted it. The Tact shop is a https site, but Firefox warns it is not a safe site.

http://www.tactaudio.com/

However I can see some used units being advertised in Europe for very low prices and no takers - not a good sign.
 

amirm

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The site is infected. My virus checker warns that it is cleaning it. Others have reported the same. Please be careful.
 

FrantzM

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The site is infected. My virus checker warns that it is cleaning it. Others have reported the same. Please be careful.

Yep! Same here.. yesterday i could not go through but today my anti-virus refuse to let me get there ...

Looks worse and worse .. Guess I will have to go toward Lyngdorf or ust drop the idea of DRC .. I had some hope .. The present Listening room is a living room and there is no way I can put any semblance of Room Treatments in it :( Not pleased ..
 

audioguy

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Apr 20, 2010
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I would try to call Boz. I have 2 numbers: 201-440-9300 (cell) and 505-717-2217 (office). This is a bit confusing as they are building the room correction system for Emotiva. See http://shop.emotiva.com/collections/processors/products/xmc1

If you do get a hold of them and are comfortable with purchasing a used TacT, I am selling mine since I no longer listen to two speakers + subs. My unit has the Aberdeen Modded power supply. It is an awesome product and even in a treated room. And the only experiences I have had talking to Boz have been positive.
 

michael123

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Nov 17, 2011
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Lyngdorf are fine.
I mean - I had some email communication with them regarding RP-1 (my friend has it) just month ago.
It had some weird behavior - in my opinion, but after 5 or so emails we came to the agreement that this was sort of trade-off.

Although.. they did not release any software update during last two years (?), so this is something to consider.
 

FrantzM

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Apr 20, 2010
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Hi

More and more convinced by DRC as the solution for my upcoming system. Room is likely to be barely treated (no way in the world there could be Tube traps maybe some diffusion and absorption) modestly treated and is the Living Room so ... Far from ideal... Regardless of the speaker it will have to be a compromise. I am considering DRC. I am convinced. I have been rather regularly to a system with a TacT inserted in it and the results are to me astonishing.
This said. TacT seems to be out of business or on a death bed. There are talks that Emotiva may just grab them but I am not sure what the future holds on this front.
I have been recommended Lyngdorf by esteemed members of this forum. I have looked at the Lyngdorf website and the product looks like a Tact for all practical purposes. TaCt however did build a following and many are using their products. There is a Tact ecosystem, and enthusiasts/user based. There are perople modifying them, etc. There are software tricks , etc and it seems to be more flexible than the software of the Lyngdorf or am I mistaken?
I would like people with experience to chime in. I am a very cautious mover and hate to lose money however small it might be.. I am on the Yahoo Tact forum and I have seen too many nightmarish tales of people not getting their equipment back from repair... I also hate he game of constantly changing equipment ... I tend to buy, optimize and keep my gear for a long time or until something truly unique comes up. I have an upgrade path in mind already and would like the DRC to remain throughout it unless my ultimate room truly doesn't need any, which I doubt.

I have several questions and would like t know if the software from TacT and Lyngdorf are compatible or are they the same?
What are the Differences between TacT and Lyngdorf?
I seem to lean toward the TaCt system and solution more so than toward DeQX , for no particular reasons.. Could DeQX be a good replacement fro TacT?
What else aside from those Three; Tact( moribund :( ), Lyngdorf and DeQX?
Waiting for your replies, advice, suggestions. I could contact some of you by PM but prefer the conversation to be useful to all...
 

Steve Williams

Site Founder, Site Owner, Administrator
Hi Frantz

I'm still at Marty's in Dallas where as I have said his TacT system is the best sound I have ever heard and yes you are correct about Tact.

The Steinway Lyngdorf system is an all in one and is far better than Tact. Marty's Tact has been heavily modded. He is quite familiar with the Lyngdorf and says it is so good that mods are unnecessary.

He is also quite impressed with other newer DRC systems at a far cheaper price.

Have you heard any of the Steinway-Lyngdorf systems? They are quite remarkable. Model M at $40K is something so compact but yet so good. The entire system is $40K !!!

Anyone who denies the benefits of DRC is deluding themself
 

JackD201

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I would go for the Lyngdorf. I used one in a show some years back and nobody but nobody knew it was in the chain. I've set up an RP-1 at my cousin's place as well. I have no affiliation with Lyngdorf by the way.

With most DRC units measurements are taken at the listening position. If you think about it, the data gathered can be dodgy depending heavily on the microphone's pick up pattern and calibration. The Lyngdorfs come with a calibrated microphone and set up requires that measurements be taken in multiple positions in front of the speaker plane. The pain is that the screen is small as it prompts you to place the microphone. You place the mic, it plays the noise, lets you know when that snapshot is saved then you keep on going. The more places you measure, at one point I reached the top rear corners of my cousin's place, the percentile reading for the digital engine goes up. It is asymptotic and I gave up at around 95% and over 20 locations. It would probably have taken me 20 more to get to 96%. The more data points the less the mic's directionality becomes a variable.

In other words the system maps the room prior to applying the correction math. The caveat is that if the room is not quiet, it can take a very long time to get a single snapshot. Close all the windows and doors, shut off the HVAC and if you have someone else in the room tell him or her to not move a muscle and breath quietly. LOL. I would recommend using two telescoping mic stands, one short and one tall. That way the snapshots take only a few seconds.

Good luck Frantz! It sounds complicated but is easy as pie after the first two or three.
 

FrantzM

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
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Jack

It does't look complicated, maybe because I have been reading the Lyngdorf manual :) .. I have been also in touch with them.

THanks everyone. Will keep you informed ..

Happy Holiday to you All ...
 

A.wayne

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Jan 14, 2011
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I would go for the Lyngdorf. I used one in a show some years back and nobody but nobody knew it was in the chain. I've set up an RP-1 at my cousin's place as well. I have no affiliation with Lyngdorf by the way.

With most DRC units measurements are taken at the listening position. If you think about it, the data gathered can be dodgy depending heavily on the microphone's pick up pattern and calibration. The Lyngdorfs come with a calibrated microphone and set up requires that measurements be taken in multiple positions in front of the speaker plane. The pain is that the screen is small as it prompts you to place the microphone. You place the mic, it plays the noise, lets you know when that snapshot is saved then you keep on going. The more places you measure, at one point I reached the top rear corners of my cousin's place, the percentile reading for the digital engine goes up. It is asymptotic and I gave up at around 95% and over 20 locations. It would probably have taken me 20 more to get to 96%. The more data points the less the mic's directionality becomes a variable.

In other words the system maps the room prior to applying the correction math. The caveat is that if the room is not quiet, it can take a very long time to get a single snapshot. Close all the windows and doors, shut off the HVAC and if you have someone else in the room tell him or her to not move a muscle and breath quietly. LOL. I would recommend using two telescoping mic stands, one short and one tall. That way the snapshots take only a few seconds.

Good luck Frantz! It sounds complicated but is easy as pie after the first two or three.

Interesting ,

I like the multi-position technique for measuring , this way you only make corrections to consistent anomalies ....
 

amirm

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Frantz, I have a $16,000 TacT processor that is a brick right now. I can't dissuade you enough from buying it. The hardware is not stable and will die on you and then you will have nothing.

Lyngdorf is a nice system. It was the only that one that came close to the one I am using in double blind tests :). This is how it did:



RC3 is Lyngdorf. RC1 and RC2 are precursors to what is JBL Synthesis ARCOS (one is optimized for one seat, and the other for multiple). As a reference RC4 is doing nothing. RC5 is Anthem ARC. And RC6 is Audyssey. As you see the last two did worse than doing nothing. The tests were with B&W 802 speaker.

Here is the spectral balance and hence the reason for the above scores:



And subjective remarks:



So clearly well done systems do better than nothing.

The JBL Synthesis SDEC-4500 is pretty expensive at $13K retail but there is usually B-stock versions that have much lower cost. It is a 20-channel system that can drive your speakers in bi or tri-amp. It supports up to 4 subs and performs really advanced sound field management and cross over optimizations. I just wrote an extensive paper for Widescreen Review Magazine that will come out in January on how it sorts through 300 million permutations to optimize the bass and crossover! It is the only system that has such features. If you don't need multi-sub optimization, there is a smaller 8 channel system SDEC-3000 that retails for $8K.

The down side of the JBL is that you need a dealer to run the calibration for you. It uses a very expensive system for measurement utilizing 8 microphones. And in its default configuration is analog in, and analog out. Digital I/O can be added to it but it is a custom change.

So if the Lyngdorf is user programmable you may be better off with that.
 

amirm

Banned
Apr 2, 2010
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Here is the frequency response measurements:



Look at the unassisted dashed line for the B&W speaker with no correction. Amazing that we pay $8,000 for that and call it a high-fidelity experience! Clearly there are colorations there. Contrast that with the top line in red. Even visually we can see how much benefit there is.
 

Justus

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Dec 12, 2012
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hey amir, bizar audyssey result. i validate drc and xt32 is FLAT. the test uses a spurious audyssey result i suspect.
i use omnimic and etf btw. what drc are you using now? arcos?
best, justus
 

JackD201

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The Accuphase DRC unit is a doozy too but $$$$$$$$$
 

FrantzM

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
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Hi


I find myself leaning every day more toward the Lyngdorf ... No mention of Sampling frequencies and bit depth. No USB port either a glaring absence IMO .. Else I like what I see.
The price is good too inline with what TacT charged for similar units.

An aside: A complete TacT system with 2 mains, 2 subs and their Millenium amps run much less than the $40K Steve mentioned ... more like 15,000 Euros about $20K for a full range system with DRC...
Maybe it was the Steinway-Lyngdorf Steve was talking about.
 

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