Please name the audio breakthroughs that have been made by "high end" manufacturers, then broadly adapted by consumer audio.
Tim
Please name the audio breakthroughs that have been made by "high end" manufacturers, then broadly adapted by consumer audio.
Tim
In high-end audio, you can't even fight an opinion with the facts.
I'll get you started Tim, with three different kinds of 'driving' other products:
Quad ESL- still a reference for speaker manufacturers. Not that they are replicating the design or circuit, but it is so revealing in the midrange, I think many speaker designers keep a pair on hand. First released in 1957.
Audio Research tube equipment- close to the lone holdout in 1973-74. Hugely influential in preaching the gospel on tube sound. Today, many, many modest amps and preamps use tubes. Did ARC 'invent' tubes? No of course not, were they a 'driver' in the sense that they influenced other companies? I would say yes.
Asynchronous usb- I'm not much into digital playback, but didn't dcs really promote this? And isn't it now something you find on little cheap DACs as well?
That ought to get the ball rolling.
I am not sure Tim, they do have an intersection of interests but it is rather thin.Originally Posted by Phelonious Ponk
What defines a "high end" manufacturer?
Sony and Phillips developed the CD in their research labs, but I am guessing you would rank them mass-market, not high-end?
Is Carver mass-market or high-end? Audyssey?
The number of what most of us would consider "high-end" is probably small, and whilst innovations have come out of them, I am not sure how many have been widely applied due to patents and cost. Determining how much influence they have had could be hard to define...
Don Herman
"After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music" - Aldous Huxley
The absence of tone controls. Or at less the button to defeat them!
I think the first two is the high-end driving itself. The broad consumer electronics market has abandoned tubes and never adopted electrostatic panels.I'll get you started Tim, with three different kinds of 'driving' other products:
Quad ESL- still a reference for speaker manufacturers. Not that they are replicating the design or circuit, but it is so revealing in the midrange, I think many speaker designers keep a pair on hand. First released in 1957.
Audio Research tube equipment- close to the lone holdout in 1973-74. Hugely influential in preaching the gospel on tube sound. Today, many, many modest amps and preamps use tubes. Did ARC 'invent' tubes? No of course not, were they a 'driver' in the sense that they influenced other companies? I would say yes.
Asynchronous usb- I'm not much into digital playback, but didn't dcs really promote this? And isn't it now something you find on little cheap DACs as well?
That ought to get the ball rolling.
I have no idea who invented asynchronous USB, but it's implementation has definitely been high end and the price has dropped like a rock. But I really don't think there's much of a mainstream CE market for DACs outside of the devices they're converting from/to at all. I wouldn't expect it to have much influence outside of the audiophile market. But I could be wrong....
Tim
In high-end audio, you can't even fight an opinion with the facts.
It's all a tone control. It is just that some are adjustable and others are not.
To avoid the crassness of putting a price point on it, let's call it products designed to appeal to audiophiles, from the most expensive, to bang-for-the-buck. From a DCS Scarlatti to a CA MagicDac.What defines a "high end" manufacturer?
I think just about anybody would call those companies "mass-market."Sony and Phillips developed the CD in their research labs, but I am guessing you would rank them mass-market, not high-end?
I'd personally place Carver in audiophile territory - at the more affordable end of high-end. Audyssey who makes surround sound processors? Mainstream and pro markets.Is Carver mass-market or high-end? Audyssey?
I think I broadened the definition sufficiently above, and if we can identify their innovations, it should be hard to trace their influence.The number of what most of us would consider "high-end" is probably small, and whilst innovations have come out of them, I am not sure how many have been widely applied due to patents and cost. Determining how much influence they have had could be hard to define...
Tim
In high-end audio, you can't even fight an opinion with the facts.
Yes, the absence of tone controls definitely belongs to the high end. I'm not sure of the defeat button. I have a midfi HK integrated from 1972 with semi-parametric eq and a defeat button. This when a lot of more expensive hifi gear still had tone controls. I consider the ability to quickly and easily defeat good tone controls a benefit, if not an innovation. The elimination of them altogether is pretty dubious, in my view. YMMV. But I'm definitely willing to give that one to the high-end. Now, how much influence did it have? Did the late 70s and 80s see a lot of midfi receivers, integrateds and preamps without tone controls? Is this an example of innovation in the high-end driving development in the mainstream?
Tim
In high-end audio, you can't even fight an opinion with the facts.
Sorry, Tim, are you referring to 'consumer electronics' as the lowest common denominator? When you say that consumer audio has dropped tubes, I see tubes on stuff that is very inexpensive, coming out of China, and yes it is promoted for its sound quality, but it is relatively inexpensive, like $150 phono stages and modest power amps well under $1,000. As to the Quads, as I said, it wasn't about emulating the design, it was using it as a reference. And, on the usb thing, I guess we are back to what you define as 'consumer' audio- the low cost DACs I'm referring to are relatively cheap-, ie, under $500. What kind of equipment are you talking about? This stuff is equipment that folks can buy from places like Amazon, or probably at big box stores these days.
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