Absolute Sound is Rubbish

**rbbert** · 06-24-2012, 11:45 AM

Perhaps an interesting topic for a new thread would be the pros and cons of dividing up X dollars available for audio on 2-channel vs. 5- or 7-channel. I'd bet a poll of members here would show an overwhelming majority in favor of optimizing the 2-channel system, at least until one is talking about 6 figure amounts.

**tomelex** · 06-24-2012, 11:47 AM

Originally Posted by mep

I would appreciate it if you did not repeat ad nauseam you disdain for two-channel audio. We all know it's not perfect and we acknowledge that. Change your tagline and your attitude if you want to change how people feel about you. Starting threads like this one only increases your need for buying asbestos underwear before you sit down at your computer and type "Absolute Sound is Rubbish."

I do not disdain two channel audio, the fact that I explore the limitations of it is hard for some folks to handle. I do not want anyone to change how they feel about me, the more folks post here, the more others know about them and where they stand. That is to be expected. And judging by what I know of the universe, variety (or differences) is the natural course.

I am going to change my tag line to tighten it up a bit more but I don't expect to change anyones attitudes but I will continue to endeaver to stay strictly within the terms of service like we all do.

Anyhow, I have more to say about my lifelong hobby and electronics.

Tom

**tomelex** · 06-24-2012, 12:34 PM

Originally Posted by rbbert

Perhaps an interesting topic for a new thread would be the pros and cons of dividing up X dollars available for audio on 2-channel vs. 5- or 7-channel. I'd bet a poll of members here would show an overwhelming majority in favor of optimizing the 2-channel system, at least until one is talking about 6 figure amounts.

One of the members in our audio club had a five channel system and he made his own speakers. He is an acomplished mechanical engineer. His system, costing about as much as mine, was the best sounding of all in our club for clarity and being more lifelike and that is by my preference of course. I say was because he moved to Las Vegas where he said he will begin manufacturing a speaker line.

I have lost touch with him...email changed or whatever, but the last one we had about 6 months ago he said he had some interested backers. I wish him luck and will let folks know when I see any of his stuff, as I know his style, and by the way they were dipoles.

Tom

**NorthStar** · 06-24-2012, 02:18 PM

Originally Posted by mep

... increases your need for buying asbestos underwear before you sit down at your computer and type ...

-----

...Now, that is a good line LOL.

* Now, please, anyone, don't read more into this than what simply it is: a funny line.
And that's it! No one is attached to it. Not Tom, and not even you Mark (but it's your line).

**JackD201** · 06-24-2012, 02:21 PM

Originally Posted by Phelonious Ponk

No doubt you can get closer with multi-channel. Where are you going to get the recordings to take advantage of it?

Tim

You hit the nail right on the head Tim.

It isn't that we don't accept the limitations of two channel, we are simply trying to mitigate them. Content is king after all and while as Kal says there are thousands of titles out there, unfortunately they could be the wrong thousands.

To me it always comes down to what the objective is at the outset. In my case I'm not trying to be at THE concert, I'm trying to simulate being in A concert. I think that is an important distinction. As far as individual instruments or voices go, it would be nice if I could easily tell a Strad from a Guarneri if I'd actually heard two of them live side by side but I'm happy enough being able to tell easily if it is a violin. Same goes for electric guitars and guitar amps or different Pianos. Ultimately I'd have to draw on my own experiences to do that. Now, would it be live or recorded? Live preferably but it isn't always possible. Lets talk voices. Who has heard at least ten of your favorite singers live and unamplified? Heck, make it five, make it two even. He or she would have to be your close buddy. To make things even more impossible a whole lot of my favorite singers are dead!

Should I now get hung up about this? I could but choose not to. I may not be able to recreate being at THE concert but I think I've gotten some success at placing myself in A concert with only two channels mainly because that's what I've got. Did I stray from flat response? Acoustically yes I did, I had my engineer design a bit of bass lift in. Electrically? I believe I have done so as well by selecting particular tubes to replace the otherwise flat stock ones. What I didn't do was go so far as to make a violin sound like a cello because I like warmth (who doesn't anyway?) or a Steinway like a Bosendorfer or Pavarotti like Domingo. Just a nip here and a tuck there that incidentally makes for a slightly more forgiving system. I always tune my system ruler flat and later de-tune it for everyday use. The last thing I want is to be limited to so called audiophile approved music or synthesized music.

**NorthStar** · 06-24-2012, 02:23 PM

Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson

There are several thousand out there. :-)

-----Abso!ute!y Kal; there is such a place (among many more) right there in my sig.

**Phelonious Ponk** · 06-24-2012, 02:32 PM

Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson

There are several thousand out there. :-)

Perhaps I wasn't specific enough. I didn't mean surround sound recordings. I mean surround sound recordings specifically recorded and mastered to create a realistic sense of space in the center of all those sound sources, in the listener's room. What there are thousands of are surround sound recordings that put the listener in the middle of a space that's even more contrived than the average studio recording, a space where you're surrounded by the musicians and the horn section (or whatever) suddenly comes sweeping in over your left shoulder. I'm no more interested in those than I am in 3D movies that use the technology to get things to jump out of the screen at you.

If there are thousands of the other kinds of surround sound recordings, please point me to them. That would be worth building a 5-channel system.

Tim

**NorthStar** · 06-24-2012, 02:40 PM

Originally Posted by Peter Breuninger

What is wrong with me posting in this thread, perhaps I like train wrecks and never knew it. I have two friends who are 5.1 high priest zealots...when I have enough of their sermonizing 5.1 as the only way to listen and demonizing my 2C system I ask them to play me a 5.1 LP or a 5.1 reel tape.

-----You know what Peter? ...We all live in a fantasy world; be it 2D, 3D, or 4D.
...And from one channel Mono, and up to one thousand channels Multi-surround. ...And from music download to 78s albums. ...With SACD, Blu-ray, USB, CD, XRCD, compressed, uncompressed, MLP Lossless audio (DVD Audio), ... all in between.

Simply put: We all are music lovers; irregardless of the mediums and number of speakers we use.
And that is the great challenge in our audio forums; trying to get all along.

The more we spend (time, energy, money, experimentation, comparison, analysation, ...) the greater our chances to reach the u!timate abso!ute truth!

**NorthStar** · 06-24-2012, 02:50 PM

-----"Rubbish"; is that like Jitter?

**NorthStar** · 06-24-2012, 02:55 PM

Originally Posted by rbbert

Perhaps an interesting topic for a new thread would be the pros and cons of dividing up X dollars available for audio on 2-channel vs. 5- or 7-channel. I'd bet a poll of members here would show an overwhelming majority in favor of optimizing the 2-channel system, at least until one is talking about 6 figure amounts.

Well, of course because it is much more easier to set up a two-channel Stereo system than a Multichannel one.

But easier doesn't mean better.

I bet if people would take the time to 'complicate' their life a little more,
they would get closer of replicating reality!