H J s system !

LL21 · Sep 2, 2014

andromedaaudio said:
Thanks ,yes its the XPE loudspeakers playing on the zanden 300 B ( with a cheap non audiofile dvd player) ..i must say this new speakersystem makes cd s more interesting /enjoyable..

that's what its all about (for me)...enjoy and congrats. That's been a real work of passion, and its been fun so far to watch it come to reality.

andromedaaudio · Oct 11, 2014

I am finished on the woofersection now as well , all the filtering adjustments are done, time to have some professional pics made and update the website , they will be available in any colour , multiple times spraypainted but they cannot get the full polishtreatment , the finish is perfect and off course polished but not to "absolute mirrorfinish" , it was just to much for the polishers to flip an almost 200 kilo speaker over and over again(7 times ..spraypainting/ polishing )

, it can be done but then there have to be wooden panels inserted in the sides for example , to hide M 12 threads for hoisting points
Sadly its also the end off my audiojourney , i have run out of ideas and could spend more on the design but not make it considerably (if any ) better , the only progress would be in bigger/moving more air , meaning more mids , woofers and possibly more tweeters

.
I might make some trickle down speakers , using the same tweeter and mid and woofer , and make a 3 way with the 13 inch or eleven incher , or a 2,5 way system in d appolito .
Anyway anything i ll have build will be made from HPL phenolic resin laminate , no more MDF

Anyway 300 B amp owners or above that , these are the real deal

Playing tiesto full throtlle for example ,while putting a finger on the housing just 10 mm from the 13 inch woofer making large excursions , you just feel nothing , rock solid, PE (preserve energy ) any energy which sets the housing in motion is essentially loss of energy , and besides that this will affect the constant changing music signal

andromedaaudio · Nov 1, 2014

Update on the woofers and overall sound !
Amazing no overhang just fast and deep,as if they werent there , i was afraid of heavy and slow woofer sound but none of that , The real big differences start when you open up the knob to neighbourpunishing volumes , then the total amount of membrane surface really kicks in , its basically the summum of high end for me turn up the volume and the sound stays crystal clear it just is extremely powerfull dynamic , almost life like : the gunfiring section in heat for example
A few things arose how ever , i ve compared the zanden to the Cat ultimate mk 2 /Hawk A 18 combination (plays 10 watts pure class A).
The zanden is great but 8 watts 300 B tube class A just isnt the same as 10 watts transistor class A in terms of power dynamics , on real high volume the zandens bass becomes thinner not as deep ,it is playing to close to the maxx , the 10 watts class A transistor is more then enough however on all circumstances
I might buy a couple of ML 33 H or 33 s and keep the Cat maybe buy a ML 32 as well , but no hurry , i just love the transistor class A sound , when the whole system has been on the juice for a day or so the whole presentation starts " glowing of some sort " , the zanden has as an advantage that it creates a kind of sound bubble
Basically totally happy every design plan basically fell in place, only thing i need is a ultra quit dedicated listening room where i can really crank up the volume

ultra quit to maxx out dynamic contrast

All brings me to another conclusion : there are a lot of manufacturers who can design a good poweramp, but designing a very good pre amp is more difficult /rare.
Best poweramp that i had so far BOULDER

although it might not be pure class A
Besides the one mentioned i want to try vitus, the gryphon and i need to try boulder again off course since the 1060 was a class AB design the 2000 series are class A , a new 2160 is a bit out of my financial reach at the moment, i d rather put those amounts of money in real estate rather then audio

andromedaaudio · Nov 12, 2014

If all goes well i ll be having a 3,5 year old CAT JL2 sign mk 2 in the house instead of the zanden (in perfect shape new Svetlana tubes , Original package /documents ), also all the preamp tubes will be tested with a tube tester and replaced if necessary , looking forward to it , 145 pounds of 6550 tube beauty, while aiming at best of both worlds

regarding M. michaelson of soundstage it should deliver all the grunt i need :

http://www.soundstage.com/revequip/cat_jl2_signature_mk2.htm

andromedaaudio · Nov 22, 2014

In da house , spent a whole afternoon at a audiodealer , hearing my voyager designs on both the CAT and my former zanden amp , digital was top of the line accuphase DP 800 (or whatever ) NAT signature line stage and a whole variety of speakers , horns fullrange and more , quite interesting , my cat has the KT 120 svetlanas , which use a different bias , the bias adjustment on the CAT is exelent to use , even for a mechanic like me

My last amp possibly , according to the dealer he had a whole group of audiophiles who ended up with cat as being the ultimate , he couldnt sell them anything anymore , they just wanted a newer CAT

Didnt bring the XPE speakers , far to heavy
The CAT weighs 82 kg the heaviest single amp i had the pleasure to own , more weight means more expensive , which results in better sound

I also saw the heaviest and thickest cables / connectors i d ever seen , the powercables on ASR emitters , my god
I possibly heard about 25 K euros or more on cabling being used , it surely didnt pull me over to buy or try out , what became clear to me again is that analogue rules on acoustic music /instruments /voices

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andromedaaudio · Nov 22, 2014

And running , it triggered the power safety switch , which i had to reset never had a amp that did that on startup , there is some noiseresidu when on pause , i hope that will be gone with the new preamp tubes , otherwise this poweramp would not be as noise free as the zanden on my around 94 db xpe speakers , sounds very good though but to early to comment
Its probably the poweramp as the noise doesnt go away really with the pre amp turned to zero , guess thats part of tube life

ive put the bias on 28 as recommended
The bass and overall control the amp takes reminds me of the Boulder
I put my smartphone on top of the amp for comparison , huge amplifier

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LL21 · Nov 22, 2014

Congrats...i have heard great things about the big CAT amps. Enjoy!!!

andromedaaudio · Nov 23, 2014

Thanks ll21, i purchased this as well , dont know what it is though

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andromedaaudio · Nov 24, 2014

First impressions after listening :
yesterday i listened on 28 bias as recommended , i adjusted the bias at the end of the session as recommended by CAT , after warming up a little i checked the bias today and with a colder amp it runs now on 32,7 .
Sound : Wauw ,....this is good , this amp has a natural flow that is uncanny , best voices ive heard , detailretrival best ive heard ,it takes control from top to bottom like the boulder but all the leanness is gone , full of bloom and transparency while staying absolutely neutral or should i say real .
The zanden and boulder sound lean in comparison , cant give my final verdict on movies and electronic music but it sounds very very good .
Thanks soundstage for bringing cat amps to my attention , while they are mostly neglected by the "commercial press " overhere

Transformer hum is just slightly more than the zanden , pretty good probably as the CAT has much larger transformers , noise when on pause is also slightly more than the zanden , for that boulder definetively has the advantage

Its recommended to adjust the bias to the prescribed level for the first 2 weeks with new tubes , after that the bias will slide gradually , but that will be an advantage according to them as older tubes run best on lower bias , i would like to know what would be the opinion of CAT themselves on what value the KT 120 s should have, i might send them an email

andromedaaudio · Nov 24, 2014

This also has something to do with excellent detailretrival/transparency / naturalness a 250 euro a piece capacitator they sound great . duelund vsf copper

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andromedaaudio · Nov 28, 2014

Little update on the all tube system i have now !
Most obvious about the Jl2 sign amp is the tremendous amount of detail that is passing through , i Always thought a simplistic 300 B integrated would be detail champ , no extra preamp short signal path ,and so forth .
But the CAT power amp ( KT 120 )rewrites that expirience , i started with a whole new cap test based on what i heard , duelund VSF being the winner on sheer naturalness they dont seem to introduce much of their own sound .
Control is great , just perfect deep bass and unitcontrol but not transistor like, a little different more bloom /roundness then SS, i would say i still like both but i always seem to have a tube pre in the system .
based on the enourmous amount of detail passing through which recreates atmosphere , this amp is quite possibly the best i ve had , more tube like then the zandens 300 B for sure which are leaner less tube bloom , maybe its coloration but i am not so sure on that.
The down side is still noise , the transformer hum and tweeter noise are not at the very low level as i would want when the system is on pause( not audible at the listening spot but audible as you stand next to the poweramp or if you are close to the tweeter ), the Rolex like ultra quit " no worries boulder " is still a very attractive amplifier as well .

I feel i ve pretty much ended my ampflier search/comparison as well , the A 18 merely for movies/ electronic music, it holds up perfectly to my surprise in this particular speakerdesign , the CAT for that and everything else , i am probably gonna " specialize " in tapeplayback from now on

Solved a big part of the" transformer hum" today , apparently the transformers set the protection cage at the back in vibration , i put a couple of 2 kg iron weights on each corner of the housing to kill the vibration and it works the amp is now about as quit as the zanden

Life can be so simple

, the sound is intoxicating though ,one thing that can be said about CAT amplification is that it has a certain rightness to it , another word woud be involving

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andromedaaudio · Dec 5, 2014

Friday night time to cranck up the volume , first time i listened at volume 3 o clock , Unfortunately i dont have the boulder 1060 in the system so i cant compare .( never heard the 1060 on the xpe speakers )
But ....this tube amp definetively has basscontrol , its almost frightening, apart from /comparable to the Maxx 2 halcros this is the most controlled /deepest bass i ever heard anywhere .
IMO you are never gonna reach this kind of control on anything less then phenolic resin based cabinets , the transientresponse / explosiveness is just without limits

andromedaaudio · Dec 6, 2014

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andromedaaudio · Dec 13, 2014

Picking up the CAT amp and listening to response speakers , horn speakers and also to some high eff speakers (incl to some with full range units ) i did nt listen to the genesis unfortunately :

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andromedaaudio · Dec 14, 2014

the final mid - tweetersection filter , the tweeter serial cap is the duelund VSF copper , expensive but worth it ( no longer made, Duelund RS Copper Foil Capacitors is the replacement), if any listening fatique ever existed in this design the last bit is erased with this capacitor , the resistor is a 25 watt one with cooling ribs .
You can see the massive copper windings of the cap , it is all mounted on a thick phenolic resin plate which is bolted inside the speaker .
Its a first order parallel filter , this speaker design could easily be made bi-ampable with a extra set of cardas connectors (incl jumper when in singleamp mode ) , but imo there is no need to ,as it is very easy to drive .
First order means that 1 filtering component per LS unit is used ,( a cap or a coil )

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With black " verzonken imbus boutjes ", i dont know what these kind of bolts are called in english , but it looks much better

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andromedaaudio · Dec 24, 2014

If all goes well i ll be having the clio FW 01 and clio 11 software in a couple of weeks , looking forward to it , the kirchner i have now isnt compatible with windows 8 and to be honest its not really an easy plug and play tool to start with . Clio is a widely recognised reliable valuable tool and has more measuring options as well , i ll datalog some models again , measuring is discussed quite often here on this site , and to be honest you wont get topclass speakers with only measuring , with measuring you can check if it complies to a certain set of basic requirements thats all , its probably more a dedication /expirience /construction/artthing in the end , like most (technical) things

http://www.audiomatica.com/wp/?page_id=23

I ll post some interesting screenshots as the clio has very nice graphs

I ll be also adding a accelerometer ,it would be interesting to see how the new design measures compared to the former mdf based enclosures , just dont know which one yet , a stand alone or the clio model.
I ll also measure the cat transformer casing with and without weightdampening

, i am actually thinking of putting some massive copperplates on top about 10/15 mm thick , probably with some holes for cooling( the transformers have cooling from the sides as well )

andromedaaudio · Jan 3, 2015

tried some new goodies , the kharma pre exhibited some 50 hz hum ,( its gonna be checked he told me it is all second hand stuff) otherwise i probably would have bought it, it sounded delicate and spacey , the weiss sounded a bit better then my cheap dvd player but not enough to buy it , so it all stays the same after all.
When the kharma is noise free , i might buy it so its not off the table , appart from the 50 hz hum the speakers were dead quit so the cat poweramp is quit soundwise , the pre might need some new tubes .
The guy really liked the speakers(and cat poweramp ) , he found them very natural sounding , he had audio research ref series / kharma DB 7 s himself , particulary also the large speaker , big/spacey image sound , i should make a smaller/cheaper HPL model , but hey..... that aint a challenge , i only wanna move forward not backward

Ps i might have bought the weiss anyway but it had a firewire connection an my comp doesnt have it

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andromedaaudio · Jan 4, 2015

Comparing cheap versus expensive ,high power tubes versus small watts transistor
To be honest forgetting about price /whatever , i like both maybe there is a powerlimit after all , meaning a loudspeaker will sound best within a certain power range , for example a 94 db 8 ohm minimum speaker will have a optimum power range of about 10 -12 watts and 50 watt max otherwise its going to sound to much upfront to powerfull, to controlled after a while , i am just astounded how good a 10 watt class A , 20 watt class AB amp of (at that time 500 euros for the boards and parts, schematics ) will sound on good speakers and a good pre amp
Mixing and matching ... not really a problem on electronic music however

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andromedaaudio · Jan 9, 2015

Hope to make some shots at the audioshow tomorrow if they will allow me , (and my work )
Regarding the new XPE LS ive been listening to for quite a while now , they keep surprising me all the time , i never could imagine what housingmaterial and a lot extra (bass) membranesurface would add .
Its like stepping from a volkswagen golf in a rolls royce , the distance you cover with both cars might be the same , but the ride is quite different.
I am very pleased also with the sidefiring construction , the bass doesnt seem to be in your face as might have been with a frontfiring design , by far my best design ever , and exactly how i would design a speaker after all , no ifs left.
The only thing i sometimes think about is how the sound would be if i gave the baffle a little dampenening material no felt(to much dampening imo ) but something like 3 mm suede leather around the drivers and for more bling/ different dampening crocodile leather
Just a tiny thing which might even sound worse but non the less , the tweeter itself already has some synthetic dampening material off factory ,

andromedaaudio · Jan 10, 2015

Mr vd hul serviced a lot of carts from different manufacturers , on the demonstration /show from attendees .
Very interesting what he had to say about various designs , the microscope had a live view on the big LCD screen
As for me i liked the ikeda , very well made good sounding cart , but you need at least a 63 db phonstage as it has a 0,16 - 0,19 mV ? output it played on a dr feickert table

It was at A 10 audio in amsterdam

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