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Thread: Just When You Thought You've Seen It All

  1. #21
    Member Addicted to Best! NorthStar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bblue View Post
    I love it when folks with no experience with an idea or process voice strong opinions based on ignorance.

    This process works very well, though I've never seen it recommended for use with Elmer's Glue. The preferred is Titebond II wood glue. The process is the same, but it does take a few applications to get the feel of it to get the surface of the vinyl covered smoothly and without runoff. I used Freezer Paper (essentially a wax-type paper) under the record so if glue does come off the record while you're smoothing it out, it doesn't stick to anything.

    It can be messy if you're not careful, and you don't have to apply it on a turntable. Once you get enough glue on the disk by applying it with the pointed dispenser, circularly around the record, I just use a plastic credit card to distribute it smoothly on the surface. The glue doesn't stick to the card, either. Just peel it off when dry.

    When you do the peeling, start from the edge of the record by lifting the glue layer up and away from the vinyl. Keep the peeling large and move slowly. Avoid leaving little pieces or strips of glue on the vinyl. They're a bear to remove individually. Too thin to pull up the tiny layer afterwards.

    I do reserve this step for seriously messed up records. There's no point in going through all of this process on records in good condition that you could clean normally (though it won't hurt anything unless you're sloppy with the glue). I follow this step with a standard two step Disk Doctor cleaning and rinse on an RCM. If the record is still particularly noisy after this much, an application of Last record preservative adds some lubrication that quiets 'rough groove wall' noise down a bit.

    --Bill
    Myles, Bill has the perfect answer to your prior question (in Purple color).
    All the Very Best, - Bob --------- "And it stoned me to my soul" - Van Morrison --------- AudiophileAudition

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorthStar View Post
    Myles, Bill has the perfect answer to your prior question (in Purple color).
    Why not a toothbrush? Lotta people do that?

    Besides the enzyme cleaners do a far better job even on albums in <VG state. How do you get the proteinaceous gunk out of the record grooves eg. that stuff from the cell walls of bacteria and mold? That crap buried in the grooves adds a lot of pops and ticks. Glue ain't gonna do it. As a matter of fact, that's exactly what the original Discwasher fluid was designed to do (FYI Bruce Maier, founder of Discwasher, had his doctorate in biochemistry and realized this issue 30 yrs ago). it wasn't until Bugtussel a couple of years ago that someone made a enzyme cleaner for LPs.

  3. #23
    Member Addicted to Best! NorthStar's Avatar
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    Tootbrush? ...With Baking Soda?

    * I still have my original Discwasher brush, and even some Discwasher fluid;
    but it does NADA (ZIP) to remove 'hard stuck debris' from the grooves.

    Talkin' 'bout second-hand LPs here in the rougher (crude, turbulent) conditions.
    All the Very Best, - Bob --------- "And it stoned me to my soul" - Van Morrison --------- AudiophileAudition

  4. #24
    Moderator Moderator treitz3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorthStar View Post
    Talkin' 'bout second-hand LPs here in the rougher (crude, turbulent) conditions.
    Hello, Bob. This is where RCM's, steam cleaning and/or ultrasonic cleaning comes into play. A toothbrush only works as good as it does on your teeth and may damage part of the playback on a microscopic level. The steam cleaner will even help with those LP's that have mold but you have to know exactly what you are doing, otherwise one risks the same abuse to the substrate as a toothbrush or even worse.

    Tom
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  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by treitz3 View Post
    Hello, Bob. This is where RCM's, steam cleaning and/or ultrasonic cleaning comes into play. A toothbrush only works as good as it does on your teeth and may damage part of the playback on a microscopic level. The steam cleaner will even help with those LP's that have mold but you have to know exactly what you are doing, otherwise one risks the same abuse to the substrate as a toothbrush or even worse.

    Tom
    I know that Tom.

    And not only you have to know what you're doing, but there are steam cleaners, and there are steam cleaners.
    ...Just like there are filthy albums (LPs), and there are filthy Vinyls (LPs, Records, Acetates...).

    P.S. Emoticons are easily removable, without any chemicals.
    All the Very Best, - Bob --------- "And it stoned me to my soul" - Van Morrison --------- AudiophileAudition

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    Maybe Myles, who appears stuck on "negative," should try glue ... ? How does he know that glue "doesn't get that out"?

    It's both physics and chemistry, Myles. The glue invades the grooves but is kept from attaching itself to the vinyl at the electron level, because of repulsion between the glue and the vinyl - it does, however, suck up everything that isn't vinyl. Quite remarkable. As it's time consuming, it's something I would only use if nothing else does the job, particularly as I have an excellent Audiodesk USC, which you are also skeptical of, Myles.
    But an acquaintance with an extremely large and very valuable vinyl collection swears by the glue method, saying it beats everything else available. Go figure.
    Searching wide and far around the globe for my own most preferred distortion.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soundproof View Post
    Maybe Myles, who appears stuck on "negative," should try glue ... ? How does he know that glue "doesn't get that out"?

    It's both physics and chemistry, Myles. The glue invades the grooves but is kept from attaching itself to the vinyl at the electron level, because of repulsion between the glue and the vinyl - it does, however, suck up everything that isn't vinyl. Quite remarkable. As it's time consuming, it's something I would only use if nothing else does the job, particularly as I have an excellent Audiodesk USC, which you are also skeptical of, Myles.
    But an acquaintance with an extremely large and very valuable vinyl collection swears by the glue method, saying it beats everything else available. Go figure.
    Because it's chemically attached and isn't even removed using conventional RC methods. See Buggtussel's SEM photos. Maybe you could explain how glue would remove the bacterial exoskeleton?

    Bottom line: just like any cleaning method want to know it's safety and would like if possible, a SEM to show that it both cleans and doesn't leave anything in the groove. Even the thinnest film will degrade the sound as well as possibly g unk up the cartridge.

  8. #28
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    Myles

    I would think the glue would adhere to anything in the grooves.. Same glue will adhere to my protein based skin with no problem ... Why do you thinkit will not do the same for these protein-based junk inside the grooves? I still would like to know what the Titebond II, which seems to be what is recommended on many forums would do to the Vinyl?
    Now the enzymes would digest the protein-based gunk but don't you have to remove , said junk? The glue method seems to come up with everything. Again what is wrong with the method>
    Frantz
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  9. #29
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    I think if I had a record that was so hosed that I was considering putting glue on it in a desperate attempt to clean it, I would probably throw the record in the trash and buy another copy. The video that Steve posted did show that surface noise was reduced after the glue peel, but it wasn't eliminated. There is a difference between dirt in the grooves and damage to the record grooves. You can't fix damaged grooves. It just seems like a cute parlor trick to me. I’ll pass.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by mep View Post
    I think if I had a record that was so hosed that I was considering putting glue on it in a desperate attempt to clean it, I would probably throw the record in the trash and buy another copy. The video that Steve posted did show that surface noise was reduced after the glue peel, but it wasn't eliminated. There is a difference between dirt in the grooves and damage to the record grooves. You can't fix damaged grooves. It just seems like a cute parlor trick to me. I’ll pass.
    Yes. And how does the glue damage the record grooves?
    Are you surmising, assuming or proposing a fact that you can back up?

    Just asking because I'm curious to learn from you and Myles, who so eagerly share your experience with the method.
    Searching wide and far around the globe for my own most preferred distortion.

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