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Thread: Just When You Thought You've Seen It All

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    Site Founder And Administrator Steve Williams's Avatar
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    Just When You Thought You've Seen It All

    Steve Williams
    aka oneobgyn
    There's ALWAYS another Steve Williams BUT there's only "oneobgyn"
    Dealer Lamm Electronics
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    At first I was horrified of the thought but then I remembered how I can peel it off clearly as he did when I use it for woodworking. So other than worry of it dripping into everything else, seems like a reasonable technique.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Williams View Post
    I'd put this in the top ten stupidest things I've ever seen done in audio. One, show me the chemicals won't damage the record. Two, show me that you can remove all the glue. If it's highly unlikely that one can remove all the RCF with a machine, how the hell will you do that with glue.

    Oh yes, ESP yrs ago, RCFs all had a sound, most likely to what they left behind and the ability of the machine to remove the last vestiges of the RCF. Remember that surface tension goes up as the quantity of fluid goes down, making that last little bit of liquis all the harder to suction off the LP. Today's machines like the VPI Typhoon have a bigger motor eg. more suction and you can clearly hear the difference between it and a normal machine. Of course, one still has to be careful not to have too much suction and affect the vinyl plasticizer.

    Caveat emptor.

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    [WBF Founding Member] Addicted to Best! JackD201's Avatar
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    AT least it wasn't a 6 eye

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    we did this 20-yrs ago with product called Spraylat. its a latex based and water soluble painting mask. brush it on, dries within a hour or so and peel off. the aliphatic glues seems to work just the same except it must take way longer to dry and the force needed to peel off from an LP would concern me (fracturing really old vinyl) the spraylat worked well similar to the results in the vid. chemisty? what chemistry we werent that smart to worry about what it did to the vinyl, all we cared about was trying anything that raised a play grade from a VG to a VG++.

    ps - at that time we also had access to the HW-17 and keith monks machines
    Rob

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    Member Sponsor [WBF Founding Member] FrantzM's Avatar
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    I wouldn't call it stupid. Adventurous? yes. Maybe someone with chemistry knowledge would chime in and tell us about the potential for harm to the vinyll .. We simply don't know. I don't think it is the same thing as a Record Cleaning Fluid .. RCF remains liquid with the impurities kept in the liquid by surface tension and if it evaporates, there remains solid residues that needs to be sucked out .. In this case I have a glue .., to which everything adheres, then when cured, seems to come out rather neatly
    Frantz
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    Had to try this when I first came across it years ago. An acquaintance with a tremendous vinyl collection uses it to rescue records.
    Looked into the chemistry. The wood glues are water based and the vinyl repels it. Thus the adhesive joins to itself and dust/impurities, while not being capable of joining to the vinyl. I've actually pulled off entire LP sides of glue - could probably play it, now with the dust transferred to the glue-copy.

    In spite of that, I dont feel comfortable using the method, and now have an Audiodesk USC, making the point moot.
    Searching wide and far around the globe for my own most preferred distortion.

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    Member Addicted to Best! NorthStar's Avatar
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    That video sounds pretty convincing to me; the sound is much less scratchy.
    And for me that's all what counts; I'm buying myself some wood glue.

    And Myles, you can say whatever ...
    All the Very Best, - Bob --------- "And it stoned me to my soul" - Van Morrison --------- AudiophileAudition

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    Quote Originally Posted by NorthStar View Post
    That video sounds pretty convincing to me; the sound is much less scratchy.
    And for me that's all what counts; I'm buying myself some wood glue.

    And Myles, you can say whatever ...
    Yes but how does it sound?

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    Quote Originally Posted by FrantzM View Post
    I wouldn't call it stupid. Adventurous? yes. Maybe someone with chemistry knowledge would chime in and tell us about the potential for harm to the vinyll .. We simply don't know. I don't think it is the same thing as a Record Cleaning Fluid .. RCF remains liquid with the impurities kept in the liquid by surface tension and if it evaporates, there remains solid residues that needs to be sucked out .. In this case I have a glue .., to which everything adheres, then when cured, seems to come out rather neatly


    Well Frantz, I have a little bit of chemical knowledge. Look up online my article on RCF written oh about a decade and a half ago. Still quoted.

    This is good enough for me. From the website:

    How is glue made?

    Elmer's Glues are chemical based. They are made or formulated from chemicals which are synthesized (created by Man). These chemicals were originally obtained or manufactured from petroleum, natural gas and other raw materials found in Nature. The exact formula and specific ingredients used in making Elmer's products are considered proprietary information, therefore, we cannot share those with you.

    Is Elmer's glue acid free?
    No. Most of our glues that are acid free are labeled as such. Some of our most popular acid free products include all of our glue stick, rubber cement and spray adhesive products.


    VINYL ACETATE HAS BEEN POLYMERIZED INDUSTRIALLY IN BULK SOLUTION, SUSPENSION, AND EMULSION. PERHAPS 90% OF THE MATERIAL IDENTIFIED AS POLY(VINYL ACETATE) OR COPOLYMERS THAT ARE PREDOMINATELY VINYL ACETATE ARE MADE BY EMULSION TECHNIQUES. THE INITIATORS OR CATALYSTS USED IN VINYL ACETATE POLYMERIZATIONS ARE THE FAMILIAR FREE-RADICAL TYPES, eg, HYDROGEN PEROXIDE, PEROXYSULFATES, BENZOYL PEROXIDE, AND REDOX COMBINATIONS BUFFERS ARE FREQUENTLY ADDED

    Then can you show me that this cleaning method is safe over the long term?

    Sorry, I'm not trusting my LPs to any concoction that has not been tested for its reactivity with the plasticizers. We've already had a few record Rx that negatively affected the LP such as Soundguard.
    Last edited by MylesBAstor; 05-14-2012 at 02:59 AM.

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