File storage device for Gary's latptop server

Alex I

Well-Known Member
Mar 31, 2012
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Hi everebody,

I was thinking about building Gary’s PC music server but could not find all components and found his paper on laptop server today and decided to use this one.

Gary obviously does not need external storage device for his laptop server because he uses it for demos only and uses his PC server at home. I wonder what kind of storage devices guys who built laptop servers are using? It looks like USB HDD is not a good option if I intend to use USB DAC.

My other question is which Dac Minerva or M2Tech Young guys here perefer. I understand Minerva works better via FireWire. Does anybody on this forum runs Minerva without pre?


Thanks for your help.
PS. Gary, thank you for the design and the instructions!

Alex
 
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amirm

Banned
Apr 2, 2010
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garylkoh

WBF Technical Expert (Speakers & Audio Equipment)
Sep 6, 2010
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Welcome to the forum, Alex. And you're welcome.

With the laptop server, I only store my most frequently demo'ed files on the internal SSD. It also has a SD card slot that will take the latest SDXC cards. I have a couple of 128Gb Sandisk Extreme cards that I load with more demo files when I travel. For the rest of my library, I use a 2TB NAS - the playback quality off the NAS is pretty good - almost as good as the SD cards.
 

Alex I

Well-Known Member
Mar 31, 2012
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296
That's kind of big :). If it were smaller, and money was not tight, I would have suggested an SSD drive. Assuming you are storing the CDs in lossless format, that is 300 Gigabytes. A 512 Gigabyte SSD will hold it and the OS but will set you back about that much in dollars: http://www.amazon.com/gp/search/ref...+drive&ie=UTF8&qid=1333249804&rnid=5057182011

I always thought that it's not very small, but I'm reading on the net that a lot of people need TBs for their collections, so I’m filling kind of small :). Your solution looks very appealing at the moment because of its simplicity. The only worry that I have , what if I really like high resolution formats that will become available to me after i move to the server? I would need much more space very soon I guess.
 

Vincent Kars

WBF Technical Expert: Computer Audio
Jul 1, 2010
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I understand Minerva works better via FireWire
It does as it doesn't have a USB :)

There are many ways to Roma.

All on a SSD
OS on a SSD, audio on a HD (common as SSD is a bit expensive)
All on a HD
All on a HD + memory playback (no I/O during playback)
Audio on an external HD
Audio on a NAS

I have a very simple setup: OS on HD, audio on a NAS
It allows me to access the audio from various PC’s
 

Alex I

Well-Known Member
Mar 31, 2012
4
0
296
Welcome to the forum, Alex. And you're welcome.

With the laptop server, I only store my most frequently demo'ed files on the internal SSD. It also has a SD card slot that will take the latest SDXC cards. I have a couple of 128Gb Sandisk Extreme cards that I load with more demo files when I travel. For the rest of my library, I use a 2TB NAS - the playback quality off the NAS is pretty good - almost as good as the SD cards.

Thank you Gary. I liked the idea of NAS but recall reading somewhere that it degrades the sound. I don’t remember all arguments but one was the use of the computer resources. Other than the size and the number of HDs are there parameters that I should look at when choose NAS.
 

Audioseduction

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Dec 6, 2010
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For a SOTA setup I myself use a Seagate 3 TB USB 3.0 Ext. hard drive plugged into the USB 3.0 port on my laptop music server. This works extremely well. The USB 3.0 port is on a separate bus from the USB 2.0 which my USB to SPDIF Converter is plugged into. Talking about playback so jaw dropping pure and clean I have JRiver set to play from RAM. So another word the laptop is a memory player. Don't you just love technology when it comes togather? :D
 
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Audioseduction

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AudioExplorations

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Apr 5, 2012
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I decided to go for a robust long term solution where I would not run into space constrains. I bought a QNAP 559 Pro+ NAS with 5 x 2TB hard drives, setup in a RAID5 configuration so if a drive fails no data is lost (giving me 8TB of storage). This houses my archive library (FLAC) and working library (AIFF), and allows eSata external devices to be connected for direct backups of both libraries.

Works like a charm, and I am double protected from physical (HD) breakdown and have a weekly backup in case of virus/human error.

The device is in another room as well so my listening room is free of spinning discs.
 

Audioseduction

Well-Known Member
Dec 6, 2010
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That sounds like a real robust long term solution to me but I feel strongly that I'll never fill up a 3TB drive with just audio files as of now I have just approx. 300GB of music files which is over 300 CDs. I can't see I filing that 3TB drive up in my life time and I think it's a little ridicules to have way more CDs then you will ever listen too unless you listen to 1 or 2 tracks per CD. I mirror my 3TB HD with another 3TB HD so I feel very safe in regards to data loss. This setup is very cost effective. Now if you also store movies then I can see you needing more storage.
 
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Bruce B

WBF Founding Member, Pro Audio Production Member
Apr 25, 2010
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www.pugetsoundstudios.com
When you start storing high rez, that 3TB fills up mighty fast. I just acquired 6 recordings from MA Recordings in high rez, and that was already 40GB.

I also rip my vinyl to high rez, and that's about 1.2GB per album.

I'm on my second Synology 411+II 12TB server
 

Phelonious Ponk

New Member
Jun 30, 2010
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I have a very simple setup: OS on HD, audio on a NAS
It allows me to access the audio from various PC’s

I had this set-up, but I carefully compared it to files right on the laptop's hard drive, and through galvanic isolation and reclocking outside of the computer, to be honest, I couldn't hear a difference. So when it came time to replace that HD, I put a big drive in there and I keep all my music files on it. It's convenient because the whole system can be picked up and moved with a DAC/Headphone amp, and because I can do one backup for my entire system, including music. I'm not saying there is no difference or can be no difference, but evidently I don't have the hearing or the patience (more likely) to hear it, even on very good headphones, so I'll keep it simple.

Tim
 

Vincent Kars

WBF Technical Expert: Computer Audio
Jul 1, 2010
860
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I can imagine that e.g. an build-in soundcard is more susceptible to what is going on inside a PC than an out board one. Likewise an outboard one combined with galvanic isolation should be less susceptible than one without. Likewise with/without re-clocking. Etc.

Did a couple of experiments:
  • Play from HD
  • Play from HD combined with memory playback
  • Play from NAS

As one plays from NAS:
  • Play from NAS
  • Play from NAS and use the power schema to spin down the HD
  • Likewise + shut down the monitor
  • All of this + killing all kind of processes.

I don’t hear any difference. Possible explanations
  • My hearing is like yours :p
  • My patience even shorter
  • Good quality hardware/ software
  • Reasonably jitter immune DAC
  • Good luck
  • Etc, etc.

This why I like Gary’s “music server”.
A decent quality laptop, some mild tweaking, a good DAC and all is left is to enjoy the music.
 

FrantzM

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
6,455
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I can imagine that e.g. an build-in soundcard is more susceptible to what is going on inside a PC than an out board one. Likewise an outboard one combined with galvanic isolation should be less susceptible than one without. Likewise with/without re-clocking. Etc.

Did a couple of experiments:
  • Play from HD
  • Play from HD combined with memory playback
  • Play from NAS

As one plays from NAS:
  • Play from NAS
  • Play from NAS and use the power schema to spin down the HD
  • Likewise + shut down the monitor
  • All of this + killing all kind of processes.

I don’t hear any difference. Possible explanations
  • My hearing is like yours :p
  • My patience even shorter
  • Good quality hardware/ software
  • Reasonably jitter immune DAC
  • Good luck
  • Etc, etc.

This why I like Gary’s “music server”.
A decent quality laptop, some mild tweaking, a good DAC and all is left is to enjoy the music.


Hi

I am in the great danger of losing all my audiophiles creds :( .. I performed some of these experiences and my results were similar to Vincent's . I used very, very good headphones (Denon D-5000) and headphones amp for the listening test but couldn't hear any differences. i even went as far as comparing music files from a Wifi connected drive .. no difference that I could hear. i use Garry's Music server and have re-enabled networking with no ill effects... I will try again with music I hate ..Maybe I will pay, then, attention to the sound and not the music...
I have about 2000 CD and they take slightly less than one Tb (about 900GB).. The High Rez are however a different story. I will acquire a larger NAS because of these. On the subject of RAID and connected NAS. I would advise people with an important music collection to copy it to a disc and leave this disc in a safe location. I have noticed that in a few occasions , i have had some music files corrupted (by an internal process likely) and this was propagated to the other disc ( i don't use any fancy RAID only basic RAID 1). Of course there is a way to mitigate this is to write protect all music files but if you only rely on RAID as archival a corruption provoked by the RAID controller ( a possibility) will still mess up your music. I have also learned to rip my CD as individual files (in FLAC mostly) rather than a cue sheet and one big FLAC or whatever lossless file with all the music in it.. If you have any mishap the whole album file/CD goes down whereas with individual files you lose a song or two... Another thing is to archive regularly. RAID is not an archive and doesn't dispense from the need of regularly archiving.. Storage is cheap these days so buy a HDD and back up your collection regularly on it. It is worth the sub $200 they are asking for 2 TB HDDs. I synch my 3 NAS across the 'net using rsynch. A free tool and there is a version for windows called cwrsynch.
 

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