Just heard the Avalon Time...

flez007

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Aug 31, 2010
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... and confirmed some hypothesis:

1.- There are some things from tubed designs that I like above SS ones.
2.- Viceversa for point 1.
3.- Resolution is not always a path to musicality.
4.- Hi-End gear has reached insane prices.
5.- System preferences is a subjective mental exercise.
6.- I like the Avalon "house-sound" :)
7.- There are more crazy guys in this hobby than me.
8.- The listening room is one of the top-3 most important performance factor.
9.- Synergy is more important than pedigree.
10.- As time passes, I need to listen to higher volume levels.

:D
 

treitz3

Super Moderator
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Dec 25, 2011
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3.- Resolution is not always a path to musicality.
Hello, Flez007. Could you clarify a tad bit more on this comment, please? I would be interested in your observations.
 

flez007

Member Sponsor
Aug 31, 2010
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435
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Hello, Flez007. Could you clarify a tad bit more on this comment, please? I would be interested in your observations.

I will try..... :)

Many new designs, particullary digital, are focusing more on resolving and extracting all details from recorded media at the expense of a more pleasant, integrated and fluid presentation. While I understand the designer perspective to unmask any colorations and present the true content of any given recorded format, I find this approach sometimes lacking of structure, aggresive and creating severe listening fatigue after just an hour or less of continued audio sessions.

This is quite evident when listening to 15 IPS tapes, at higher notes (cymbals for example) such frequencies are usually not over exposed, the instruments are part of a whole structured piece, instead of individual notes and instruments fighting each other to get ones attention.

I have many friends with respectable systems that prioritize hiper-resolution to, say, truth of timbre and tonality - my hipothesis is that a highly resolving and hiper-detailed system usually fights again a pleasent, involving and "musical" one.
 

treitz3

Super Moderator
Staff member
Dec 25, 2011
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Thank you, sir. To me, if it's not musical it's not higher fidelity. Whether that be clinical or what have you? It doesn't matter. Goose bumps and one's unknowing of the toe-tapping must exist. While there are many other aspects that make a system musical, listening fatigue should not be [IMO] part of "musical". Ever.

Thank you for the clarity with your answer and enjoy the music.
 

Trcnet

New Member
Jun 21, 2015
27
0
0
Your Take???

... and confirmed some hypothesis:

1.- There are some things from tubed designs that I like above SS ones.
2.- Viceversa for point 1.
3.- Resolution is not always a path to musicality.
4.- Hi-End gear has reached insane prices.
5.- System preferences is a subjective mental exercise.
6.- I like the Avalon "house-sound" :)
7.- There are more crazy guys in this hobby than me.
8.- The listening room is one of the top-3 most important performance factor.
9.- Synergy is more important than pedigree.
10.- As time passes, I need to listen to higher volume levels.

:D
Hello Flez007,

As someone who has experienced many of the models Avalon has to offer, where do you feel the Time fits in? I presently own Eidolon Diamonds and plan on moving up the Avalon chain in the near future. I'd love to know your thoughts and feelings on how the Time compares or differs from the ED, Compas and or Diamond version, and the Isis. Also, information about the amps that you can give, tube, solid-state, wattage, etc.. driving any of these speakers would be of great help?

many thanks,
Tom
 

south

Well-Known Member
Nov 4, 2011
33
12
913
Hello Flez007,

As someone who has experienced many of the models Avalon has to offer, where do you feel the Time fits in? I presently own Eidolon Diamonds and plan on moving up the Avalon chain in the near future. I'd love to know your thoughts and feelings on how the Time compares or differs from the ED, Compas and or Diamond version, and the Isis. Also, information about the amps that you can give, tube, solid-state, wattage, etc.. driving any of these speakers would be of great help?

many thanks,
Tom
Hi Trcnet,

I have had a similar evolution: started with Eidolon, then Eidolon Diamond. I then changed the system to a big room and the ED could not move enough air to give me the feeling of involvement I was used to. Make no mistake, they are wonderful speakers and it is strange they are a bit ignored now (at least in net forums), but they have their limitations , in particular sound pressure and level of bass.
I heard briefly the Avalon Time, which can be described as an ED with much more powerful bass. But I eventually purchased the Isis. It is an extraordinary speaker, extremely musical, with an integration that I have never seen (bettering the ED, which has itself a remarkable level of integration), and with serious bass.
The Isis seems also easier to drive than the ED, although I never tried lower wattage valve amps. I am driving them with a Soulution and they are wonderful, but you will have to look carefully into every parameter of the system (cables, isolation).
So, my experience is as follows: if you have a small/mid room, you can live happily with the Eidolon Diamond. But if you have the space and can afford it, give the Isis a try. They are better than many other speakers that nowadays get more "printing space".
Thanks

South
 

edorr

WBF Founding Member
May 10, 2010
3,139
14
36
Smyrna, GA
FWIW, I owned Eidolon Vision's for a while and absolutely loved them. BUT I blew out my midrange drivers playing at not insane levels in a modest size room, so ability to pressurize the room and play loud is an issue with avalon.
 

Robert

Well-Known Member
Nov 10, 2010
163
3
405
Isis is a destination speaker, once dialed-in, there is little desire to consider anything else. However, it requires room, power, and expensive upstream elements to reach its potential. It may take 1-2 years to optimize. I've know more people who couldn't get them to work, than those who could...
 

Trcnet

New Member
Jun 21, 2015
27
0
0
Hi Trcnet,

I have had a similar evolution: started with Eidolon, then Eidolon Diamond. I then changed the system to a big room and the ED could not move enough air to give me the feeling of involvement I was used to. Make no mistake, they are wonderful speakers and it is strange they are a bit ignored now (at least in net forums), but they have their limitations , in particular sound pressure and level of bass.
I heard briefly the Avalon Time, which can be described as an ED with much more powerful bass. But I eventually purchased the Isis. It is an extraordinary speaker, extremely musical, with an integration that I have never seen (bettering the ED, which has itself a remarkable level of integration), and with serious bass.
The Isis seems also easier to drive than the ED, although I never tried lower wattage valve amps. I am driving them with a Soulution and they are wonderful, but you will have to look carefully into every parameter of the system (cables, isolation).
So, my experience is as follows: if you have a small/mid room, you can live happily with the Eidolon Diamond. But if you have the space and can afford it, give the Isis a try. They are better than many other speakers that nowadays get more "printing space".
Thanks

South

Hello South.

I appreciate you taking the time to share your experience. So you did wind up going for the Isis! A big congratulations!!!! I find it interesting your finding the Isis easier to drive than the Eidolon Diamond. Regarding the Time. Did you feel it was anymore detailed and resolving than the ED? Also wondering how these 3 speakers compare in sound-staging and the ability to disappear?

Your response has been helpful to me. I'm starting to believe that the Isis could work with my Bat Rex 160w mono-blocks. Especially considering my room isn't all that large. Enjoy your system South, I'm sure it must be pure magic with the Isis!!!! Now I just need to figure out a way to afford a pair of these things.

best,
Tom
 
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Robert

Well-Known Member
Nov 10, 2010
163
3
405
I heard the Isis with Bat 150 monoblocks in a smaller room when Steve Huntley was a dealer. They sounded great, and I sometimes thought about trying BAT amps in my current set-up.

Steve now works for Avalon. You might consider emailing him for advice.
 

south

Well-Known Member
Nov 4, 2011
33
12
913
Hello South.

I appreciate you taking the time to share your experience. So you did wind up going for the Isis! A big congratulations!!!! I find it interesting your finding the Isis easier to drive than the Eidolon Diamond. Regarding the Time. Did you feel it was anymore detailed and resolving than the ED? Also wondering how these 3 speakers compare in sound-staging and the ability to disappear?

Your response has been helpful to me. I'm starting to believe that the Isis could work with my Bat Rex 160w mono-blocks. Especially considering my room is all that large. Enjoy your system South, I'm sure it must be pure magic with the Isis!!!! Now I just need to figure out a way to afford a pair of these things.

best,
Tom

Hi Trcnet

Many thanks for your kind words. It is an exceptional speaker and I tried hard to have them in good company.

I have no experience with BAT amps, but there is a Isis user in Audiogon (I think) that uses a Lamm SE amp (32 watts, I believe), much less powerful than the Rex and he says it works very well. The Isis is not a very difficult load and the efficiency is reasonable. The Ed is a little less efficient. Particularly at this level you should try the amps with the speaker before purchase.
The isis is a bit more detailed then the ED. I suppose this comes from the bigger area of the tweeter which facilitates the task of the ceramic mid. Sound staging is an hallmark of Avalon and both ED, Time and Isis excel on that area. Still, the Isis is quite big and it is amazing the way it simply disappears.
 

south

Well-Known Member
Nov 4, 2011
33
12
913
Robert

"destination speaker" is an apt description. It is difficult to see what could decisively better the Isis, although there are others at the same level. But Isis has an immediacy and capacity to disappear that I find almost unique.

Congratulations on you system, I am sure it sounds amazingly well.
 

Trcnet

New Member
Jun 21, 2015
27
0
0
I heard the Isis with Bat 150 monoblocks in a smaller room when Steve Huntley was a dealer. They sounded great, and I sometimes thought about trying BAT amps in my current set-up.

Steve now works for Avalon. You might consider emailing him for advice.

Hi Robert,

Yes, I remember you telling me that you auditioned the Isis with the BAT 150se and I'm therefore confident in my size room I'll do just fine with the BAT Rex mono-blocks driving the Isis. Now I feel it's more a matter of picking the right size speaker for my room. The dealer insist that the Isis will work in my room and that he in fact has people who have bought the Isis demoed in a room of similar size to mine. The Compas Diamond is another option for me which I know would work well in my room and is less money. My hesitation in going with the CD has to do its limited low frequency response. I would like this to be my very last speaker purchase and don't want to be saying to myself " yeah they're great but I wish I had that extra low end weight" That sense of scale and size comes from the low end weight and how well integrated it is with the rest of the frequency spectrum.
BTW Rob ... one can tell how great your system is even over the You Tube clips!!!!! Stay well and enjoy

best,
Tom
 
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Trcnet

New Member
Jun 21, 2015
27
0
0
Hi Trcnet

Many thanks for your kind words. It is an exceptional speaker and I tried hard to have them in good company.

I have no experience with BAT amps, but there is a Isis user in Audiogon (I think) that uses a Lamm SE amp (32 watts, I believe), much less powerful than the Rex and he says it works very well. The Isis is not a very difficult load and the efficiency is reasonable. The Ed is a little less efficient. Particularly at this level you should try the amps with the speaker before purchase.
The isis is a bit more detailed then the ED. I suppose this comes from the bigger area of the tweeter which facilitates the task of the ceramic mid. Sound staging is an hallmark of Avalon and both ED, Time and Isis excel on that area. Still, the Isis is quite big and it is amazing the way it simply disappears.

Hi South,

Yes, I've been in touch with Robert ( Strapper on A'gon) He is the person you're referring to that has the Lamm paired with the Isis. He also has a relatively smaller listening room not all that much wider than mine. Just happens that he lives only 15-20 minutes away! I've been in touch and hope to go over for a listen sometime soon.
 

Elberoth

Member Sponsor
Dec 15, 2012
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Poland
A friend of mine has the Isis in a smallish, 30sqm room. They work great. He upgraded from Time.
 

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