Bookshelf or Floorstanders in a small room?

Johnny Vinyl · Jan 18, 2012

My dedicated 2Ch audio room is very small, measuring only 10x11, and I've often wondered if I wouldn't be better served with higher quality bookshelf monitors as opposed to my Totem Sttaf floorstanders. I ask the question, not because I'm dissatisfied, but only out of interest. I've seen examples of both types being used and was wondering what your thoughts were.

flez007 · Jan 18, 2012

I like bookshelf monitors even in medium sized rooms, most frequently they do best at their specified frequency range (that is why I have Avalon Ascents

)

Johnny Vinyl · Jan 18, 2012

flez007 said:
I like bookshelf monitors even in medium sized rooms, most frequently they do best at their specified frequency range (that is why I have Avalon Ascents )

I see some Totem Model One's come up at times for a decent price, and I've often been tempted.

Is there something specific about cabinet size that makes a good quality bookshelf a better choice?

amirm · Jan 18, 2012

I don't think there is any room size limitation to smalls speakers. The only issue is low frequency reproduction. Pair them up with 2-4 subs plus appropriate equalization and it should sound fantastic.

DaveyF · Jan 18, 2012

John, my dedicated listening room is about the same size as yours....in most parts of the world it would be considered a closet

Not here in S.Calif for some reason..

Anyhow, to get to your question

, I had experimented with various speakers in this room prior to my acquisition of my SF's. I had inserted large Hales, Maggies, Quads, Magicos and Focals and realized that the floor standers were typically not the best match for the room size. The amount of real estate that we have available dictates the placement of the speakers and if nothing else, the floor standers which are usually larger, did not leave enough rear space to the back wall to allow for much depth reproduction.
IF you like a larger sense of space and a bigger rendition of the stage (like I do), then you will need to separate the speakers as much as possible, not just from themselves, but IMO from all walls. As i posted in another thread, the 'art' of this hobby is to seemingly match your speakers to your room......i.e. "horses for courses" which is very much more difficult than most people would realize. At least, IMHO.

I would therefore recommend that you try a 'bookshelf' size speaker or a stand mount speaker, and see if it gives you the results that you are hoping for. In my instance, that was the way to go

.

I also agree within what Amir said above....Not necessarily 2-4 subs as this could overload the room, but in my instance at least one(1) sub.

JackD201 · Jan 18, 2012

I'm with amir on the bass extension. Isn't the Staff a floorstanding 2 way? I can think of some floor standers with lotsa lotsa drivers that can't hit 45Hz even at +/- 6dB in room. I can think of a couple of bookshelves that can. Personally I like floor standing two ways. They do what monitors do well, save the hassle of getting an appropriate stand, the added cabinet volume usually means they have a wider latitude when it comes to port tuning. Sad fact is that seeing lots of drivers sell even when a two way monitor or tower can do the same thing and get better integration in close quarters. This makes this form factor few and far between. Reminds me a speaker I had in college. The manufacturer slapped a passive radiator AND the same port on it, I think just because that passive radiator would make it look like a three way and sell better. I got suckered! LOL.

I like the twin sub option too. Just make sure it's got a lot of tuning flexibility like a secondary PEQ. Rythmik plate amps come to mind.

No Regrets · Mar 14, 2012

Sorry for reviving an old thread, but I just came across it and had a thought. I was visiting a friend in Chicago about a month ago and was able to listen to his system. It was an all Naim system from source to speakers. What amazed me was that he was using the Naim SL2's which were designed to be used up close to the wall that resides behind the speaker and was mated with Naim Subs.

This was the first time that I heard subs that were integrated seamlessly with the main speakers. Amazingly, there was a soundstage, and the speakers had great tone. The tenor sax sounded as if it were right there in the room. It had great dynamics, full extended range, and great sound. It can be hard to get all of that in a small room, but being able to use speakers that are designed to be used up against the wall might be just the ticket for a smaller room.

Otherwise, I would look for a well made, sealed (not ported) bookshelf speaker.

Warmest regards,
No Regrets

RBFC · Mar 14, 2012

I'd tend to side with the small speaker/subs combo. It'll be very hard to get good bass in a small room with the placement options you have for soundstage/imaging with floorstander "full-ranges"(it would probably just be lucky if it worked OK). The flexibility you'd gain would be considerable.

Lee

Thomas.Dennehy · Mar 15, 2012

In my 12' x 12' home office, which doubles as my audio restoration space, I have a 2.1 setup wth (rather small) bookshelf speakers and a sub. I'm quite happy with the sound.

Phelonious Ponk · Mar 15, 2012

The advantages of 2-way monitors and subs-- better driver coherence at close distances, point source imaging, less crossover noise, distortion and phase interference, and volume, crossover frequency and placement control of bass will all be more important in smaller spaces (except for the crossover distortions, which are important anywhere). The advantage of multi-driver floor-standers -- possibly higher spls from more drivers, won't be important in a small room.

So yes, in a small listening room, I'd say, in general, that a 10x10 room would be better served by monitors/sub(s). But back to the OP, I'm not sure the Totems are much different than two ways on stands. Maybe a bit more bass extension from cabinet volume. But if its not causing room problems that could be addressed by crossing over to a well-placed sub at a higher frequency, no worries. John if you're thinking about going to 2-way stand mounts, think about active. Lots of advantages.

Tim

Johnny Vinyl · Mar 15, 2012

Phelonious Ponk said:
The advantages of 2-way monitors and subs-- better driver coherence at close distances, point source imaging, less crossover noise, distortion and phase interference, and volume, crossover frequency and placement control of bass will all be more important in smaller spaces (except for the crossover distortions, which are important anywhere). The advantage of multi-driver floor-standers -- possibly higher spls from more drivers, won't be important in a small room.

So yes, in a small listening room, I'd say, in general, that a 10x10 room would be better served by monitors/sub(s). But back to the OP, I'm not sure the Totems are much different than two ways on stands. Maybe a bit more bass extension from cabinet volume. But if its not causing room problems that could be addressed by crossing over to a well-placed sub at a higher frequency, no worries. John if you're thinking about going to 2-way stand mounts, think about active. Lots of advantages.

Tim

I agree, and it isn't causing any problems as far as I can tell. I was more or less thinking out loud as I heard some outstanding monitors (passive though) at last year's TAVE Show and it got my curiosity up.

kleinbje · Dec 26, 2012

Reviving this thread as I am in a similar situation. I have an 11.5*13.5*8 carpeted room. I currenly have VPI ARIES/RubyH/Pass Alephono/NaimNAC82/Supercap/Nap250 system running either Revel M20's or B&W Naut 805's. I am very happy with the sound, but feel I am due for a speaker upgrade. Rock/pop/jazz in that order. Mostly vinyl. I am getting occasional sibilants, and treble harshness, looking for a significant upgrade. Not sure about stand vs floor. Looking for significant upgrade suggestions, and speaker size goals given the room size. I could go to 8k used.

Bruce B · Dec 26, 2012

I'm reviewing 3 sets of monitors/subs for Stereomojo now and have never heard the soundstage and imaging this good. My EA MM3's are nowhere this good.

kleinbje · Dec 26, 2012

Bruce,
Looking forward to reading, what price range?

Bruce B · Dec 26, 2012

kleinbje said:
Bruce,
Looking forward to reading, what price range?

$4k - $14k

microstrip · Dec 26, 2012

Bruce B said:
I'm reviewing 3 sets of monitors/subs for Stereomojo now and have never heard the soundstage and imaging this good. (...)

Even with the X-2?

amirm · Dec 26, 2012

kleinbje said:
Reviving this thread as I am in a similar situation. I have an 11.5*13.5*8 carpeted room. I currenly have VPI ARIES/RubyH/Pass Alephono/NaimNAC82/Supercap/Nap250 system running either Revel M20's or B&W Naut 805's. I am very happy with the sound, but feel I am due for a speaker upgrade. Rock/pop/jazz in that order. Mostly vinyl. I am getting occasional sibilants, and treble harshness, looking for a significant upgrade. Not sure about stand vs floor. Looking for significant upgrade suggestions, and speaker size goals given the room size. I could go to 8k used.

If you liked the Revel, then there is a brand new Performa3 series that has started to ship. The replacement for M20 is mind boggling good. They have a patented design tool for shaping the waveguide that nicely controls directivity. The enclosure are gorgeous (no longer boxy looking) and the prices quite reasonable. Here is the line up:http://www.revelspeakers.com/Products/Details/222

BTW, my company carries the Revel line so you may want to read the above as an advertorial

.

hiroshige · Dec 26, 2012

amirm said:
If you liked the Revel, then there is a brand new Performa3 series that has started to ship. The replacement for M20 is mind boggling good. They have a patented design tool for shaping the waveguide that nicely controls directivity. The enclosure are gorgeous (no longer boxy looking) and the prices quite reasonable. Here is the line up:http://www.revelspeakers.com/Products/Details/222

BTW, my company carries the Revel line so you may want to read the above as an advertorial .

Haha, I just stopped by your store earlier to see if they were in but it looks like they have not arrived yet. Can't wait to check them out.

kleinbje · Dec 26, 2012

Amir,
I was looking at the gems, 1&2, hadn't thought of the performa. Think they can compare? Room is probably too small for the studio's?

kleinbje · Dec 26, 2012

I heard the gem2 had no bass, is that correct Amir? cuts off around 60hz. Have you heard the oiginal? I really want to be blown away my my new speakers, if you know what I mean.

Bookshelf or Floorstanders in a small room?

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