Mikey seemed to really like this Integrated Amplifier!

Johnny Vinyl · Jan 15, 2012

As you all know, I'm hopefully going to be in the market for a new amplifier this year, although I haven't made up my mind if I should go seperates or an IA. I'm comfortable going in either direction as long as I'm convinced that whatever I choose is the right thing for me.

I've read Michael Fremer's review of the Vincent Tubeline SV-236MK several times, and I keep coming to back to it. Part of the reason, in addition to the glowing review he gave it, is the pricepoint. Unfortunately, I know of no dealer in my area whereby I can audition one, although there likely is one.

Would you guys do me a favour and read Mikey's review, and then pass along your comments? Even better if you've actually heard this unit! Also, is anyone familiar with any products in the Vincent audio arsenal?

I would like to add this unit to my list of possible contenders! As usual, thanks so much for your help!

http://www.stereophile.com/integratedamps/vincent_tubeline_sv-236mk_integrated_amplifier/

Phelonious Ponk · Jan 15, 2012

What kind of speakers do you have, John? What kind of amp do you have now?

Tim

Johnny Vinyl · Jan 15, 2012

Phelonious Ponk said:
What kind of speakers do you have, John? What kind of amp do you have now?

Tim

I have a Pioneer SA-9500II Integrated from back in 1977 and Totem Sttaf speakers.

DaveyF · Jan 15, 2012

John, I would be curious about the responses you get on the Vincent as well. I have not heard their gear but have heard very mixed reviews from several a'philes locally. The price point of the Vincent would seem to be attractive, I would have a hard time thinking of something else that would likely be better at that price given MF's review, unless you were willing to go into the used market. OTOH, if you were open to used, then separates would be my suggestion. I think most modern gear will be a nice upgrade over your Pioneer. Also, the Totem Sttaf's are good enough to clearly delineate the differences in upstream gear. I would certainly lean towards tube gear if the budget allows.

flez007 · Jan 15, 2012

I have not heard the Vincent line either, but I also like the IA route, and have had some which I really like. Tim questions are relevant, but assuming you want to keep your power hungry (and nice sounding) Totems, I would add to the list the following integrateds:

Naim Supernait
Modwright IA
McIntosh MA6100

Three different flavours, but all will take care of your Totems IMO.

JackD201 · Jan 15, 2012

John loves Rock!

The Vincents are the real deal. Good stuff, even better when you factor in the price.

My fave rocker integrated is a modded LSA Standard. I changed the coupling caps from the stock Auricaps to Mundorfs to fatten up the sound and changed the tubes to JJ Tesla 6922s (not the sweetest or smoothest 6dj8 but has good tone and lots of energy - perfect for rock IME). If you can find a nice unit second hand, I think you can have a lot of fun with this. It has a built in solid state MM stage as well and it's pretty decent.

garylkoh · Jan 16, 2012

I second the modded LSA Standard!! It's unknown, and probably unreviewed, but John Tucker is local (sort of) and a friend, but it's one of the better solid state offerings out there. Winston Ma used to run monoblock LSA Reference in his room, and IMO they were some of the better amps he's had in there.

The other I would humbly suggest is if you can find a second hand Genesis I60 integrated. They were developed as a proof of concept, and we made practically no money on them when sold through dealers. Some of my previous owners had to spend 3 to 5 times more to reach comparable quality.

flez007 · Jan 16, 2012

+1 with the I60, not many in the used market thou...

JackD201 · Jan 16, 2012

Gary, I gave my father in law a basic KT88 Melody amp and the build quality was REALLY up there. I'd long since wondered about the I60 which you had designed to handle much more demanding prospective loads. Do you think you'd ever go for another production run?

garylkoh · Jan 16, 2012

They were a limited edition proof of concept - hence will never be done again. Besides, there are no more of the particular vintage paper-in-oil caps I used.

garylkoh · Jan 16, 2012

flez007 said:
+1 with the I60, not many in the used market thou...

The good ones get snapped up real fast. Some have been "improved" and "modded". Avoid those.

Phelonious Ponk · Jan 16, 2012

John how familiar are you with tube sound? Are you sure you want it? I ask because adding that sound is the only reason to put a couple of 12AX7s in front of a SS power amp, and 2 grand is a lot of money. The best bet, I'd think, would be if you can find a dealer who will send you one on approval for a couple of weeks, so you can compare it extensively to your old Pioneer. If you find yourself absolutely compelled to go with the hybrid amp, enjoy. Anything less than that? I think, in the long run, you'd be better off putting your 2 grand into lots of grunt and headroom for those 88 db speakers. A Harman Kardon HK 990 would be a good choice, or if you really want some serious headroom, for just a bit more than you'd put into the Vincent, you could buy an 300 watt per channel Emotiva XPA-2 and their USP-1 preamp. I think either option would give you great clarity, control and sense of ease than anything with a tube front end. It would certainly give you a more accurate reproduction of the recording. MHO. YMMV.

Tim

JackD201 · Jan 16, 2012

What "tube sound" would that be Tim? Clarity, control and sense of ease are not attributes exclusive to solid state just as euphony is not exclusive to tubes.

Phelonious Ponk · Jan 16, 2012

JackD201 said:
What "tube sound" would that be Tim? Clarity, control and sense of ease are not attributes exclusive to solid state just as euphony is not exclusive to tubes.

The sound that devotees of valve technology hear and love, which cannot be measured.

Tim

microstrip · Jan 16, 2012

Phelonious Ponk said:
The sound that devotees of valve technology hear and love, which cannot be measured.

Tim

And some one who writes in his signature I love the smell of vinyl in the morning! can love.

I can not make suggestions as I am not familiar with John music taste, system , room and listening habits, but some of the more enjoyable sound I have listened came from an hybrid manufactured by Pathos, the Pathos TT. Within its power range, the clarity and sense of ease was beyond reproach.

My only concern with hybrids would be reliability - there were some histories in the past of good sounding hybrids that were very unreliable, as mixing high voltage and solid state can be problematic if not done properly. But good designs are reliable and get fantastic results in terms of value for money.

Gregadd · Jan 16, 2012

Phelonious Ponk said:
The sound that devotees of valve technology hear and love, which cannot be measured.

Tim

Bob Carver can not only measure it, appearently he can duplicate it. SMile.

mep · Jan 16, 2012

Phelonious Ponk said:
John how familiar are you with tube sound? Are you sure you want it? I ask because adding that sound is the only reason to put a couple of 12AX7s in front of a SS power amp, and 2 grand is a lot of money. The best bet, I'd think, would be if you can find a dealer who will send you one on approval for a couple of weeks, so you can compare it extensively to your old Pioneer. If you find yourself absolutely compelled to go with the hybrid amp, enjoy. Anything less than that? I think, in the long run, you'd be better off putting your 2 grand into lots of grunt and headroom for those 88 db speakers. A Harman Kardon HK 990 would be a good choice, or if you really want some serious headroom, for just a bit more than you'd put into the Vincent, you could buy an 300 watt per channel Emotiva XPA-2 and their USP-1 preamp. I think either option would give you great clarity, control and sense of ease than anything with a tube front end. It would certainly give you a more accurate reproduction of the recording. MHO. YMMV.

Tim

Tim-Have you heard the HK 990 and the Emotiva XPA-2?

JackD201 · Jan 16, 2012

Reginald beat me to that one! LOL!

Anybody whose heard tube-ish sounding SS, raise your hands.

Anybody whose heard SS sounding tube amps, raise your hands.

Anybody whose heard crappy examples of both, raise your hands.

Anybody whose heard a perfectly accurate amp, raise your hands. What, nobody? Didn't think so. LOL.

It ain't the topology baby.

Johnny Vinyl · Jan 17, 2012

Thanks for all of the great suggestions guys!

Having tubes is not absolutely essential, although after having heard various tube amps over the years, I wouldn't mind having them somewhere within the chain. One of things I've heard positives about is the combination of a SS Power Amp matched with a Tube Preamp, and I guess in some ways this is the reason for my interest in the Vincent hybrid. I also like an Integrateds value proposition. However, I am not married to this at all.

Tim brought up Emotiva, which I've also heard, and the XPA-2 will certainly have plenty of headroom in my tiny audio room. If I did this, then perhaps something like the Rogue Metis (or Magnum) tube preamp would be a nice budget-friendly one in such a case.

From now until the time I am ready to purchase I'll certainly be looking at the used market as well, although my experience with them has been somewhat mixed. If I did go that route I would certainly only buy local, as I'd want to audition anything first. I know that limits my choices, but I can't afford to pick a dud and have a seller who's reluctant to refund me my money.

Music tastes: Progressive rock, Classic Rock (hate that term), R&B, vocals and acoustical mostly. I enjoy a fair amount of Blues, and Jazz to a lesser extent, with some classical thrown in as well on occasion. I chose the Totem Sttafs as for my budget they did this better than others I'd heard, and I am very happy with them.

Since my Pioneer IA has preouts, I can go completely seperate and buy a power amp or preamp this year, and the other next year.

Phelonious Ponk · Jan 17, 2012

And some one who writes in his signature I love the smell of vinyl in the morning! can love.

Absolutely, but even if you love vinyl, moving from years of all SS to tubes is a step that should be experienced before it is commited to. MHO.

Tim

Mikey seemed to really like this Integrated Amplifier!

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