Which subs are you using for your HT system.

audioguy · Apr 21, 2010

I have used MANY subs in the various theater incarnations I have had. Dual Velodynes, then some other brand, then dual BagEnd InfraSubs (not a good HT sub), then Dunlavy Towers, then some custom subs, back to some different Velodynes, then SVS (4 different models) then dual Velodyne DD-18's and now 4 Seaton SubMersives.

I am now good to go in the sub department. Lots of headroom even at ear crushing levels, only down 4db at 5hz, and incredibly clean and powerful. Don't see any sub upgrades in my future. (I do not use the subs for 2 channel; only HT)

Steve Williams · Apr 21, 2010

Dual JL Audio Gotham 213's.

Prior to that Wilson XS

We need to get Mark Seaton and Health Nut over here as members

Sharp 1080 · Apr 22, 2010

Dual JL audio Fathom 113's. Former owner of REL subs.

Rutgar · Apr 22, 2010

Sharp 1080 said:
Dual JL audio Fathom 113's.

I could see a pair of those in my future! I'm currently using a single Velodyne DD-18 for HT only.

Sharp 1080 · Apr 22, 2010

Rutgar said:
I could see a pair of those in my future! I'm currently using a single Velodyne DD-18 for HT only.

I am very happy with duals. I was heavily influenced by Steve after we spoke about his Gothams which were new in his system IIRC. Bass has never sounded better in my room!

Rutgar · Apr 22, 2010

Sharp 1080 said:
I am very happy with duals. I was heavily influenced by Steve after we spoke about his Gothams which were new in his system IIRC. Bass has never sounded better in my room!

Yes, JL Audio makes excellent Subs! One thing that I like about the Digital Drive Velodynes though, is the multiple user settings. This is especially a nice feature when dealing with different source devices that require different Subwoofer level settings. And I don't see a way to do that with the JL Audios.

Damn, every post I make has the edit tag. Maybe the timer is too short. I often do quick edits after I post (I'm wishy washy that way).

Steve Williams · Apr 22, 2010

Rutgar said:
Yes, JL Audio makes excellent Subs! One thing that I like about the Digital Drive Velodynes though, is the multiple user settings. This is especially a nice feature when dealing with different source devices that require different Subwoofer level settings. And I don't see a way to do that with the JL Audios.

Damn, every post I make has the edit tag. Maybe the timer is too short. I often do quick edits after I post (I'm wishy washy that way).

Bill your comment I find interesting . In fact I started a thread on this very topic at another forum several months ago. Specifically, I asked if members have to change settings or volume on their subs to go from 2 channel listening to HT. It was my feeling that when subs are properly integrated into a system that there should be no need for any setting or volume changes. Have you ever given this some trial in your system.?

My other question is whether you are finding to integrate your room with the Velodyne and the 2 Evolution subs. I would bet that wouldn't be so easy. It took me 3-4 months before I got my pair of Gotham subs well dialed into my system but it was worth all of the testing and listening

rsbeck · Apr 23, 2010

I have two Velodyne in-wall subs in my theater. One is in the center front wall and one is actually in the ceiling in the rear of the theater. Believe it or not, with the help of Keith Yates' acoustical planning, these puppies do a great job. He measured them flat down to 20hz. My theater is not huge. It is 17' x 20' by 9'. However, we were still not satisfied so I added and Keith integrated a JL Fathom 113. This put the jelly in the doughnut, bab-bay! Much better bass.

Thought about adding one more sub, but Keith did the calcs and showed me where we would have to place the fourth sub to do any good and that would have seriously compromised the seating. I'm happy. take all the parameters including wife approval factor which dictated in wall and in ceiling Subs and then wife relenting which allowed for the on floor Fathom 113 and I think Keith did an incredible job. Extremely happy with the overall results. In fact, Keith showed me how having an in-ceiling sub in that location actually helped pressurize the room properly and helped ensure an even bass response throughout the seating area.

I think if you have room for them and want to nail it shut, you go for the four Seaton Submersives. That is just incredible performance and a reasonable price.

If you can only have one or two subwoofers and they are in your price range, you go with JL. 112's, 113's, or Gothams, whatever you need for the room.

If you can only have one or two and you like a sub-woofer that is perhaps a tiny bit more "polite" and you don't have the money for the JL's, you go Velodyne.

If you have to go in-wall or in-ceiling, get an acoustician to help you and there is no other choice but the Velodyne.

Just my opinion.

rsbeck · Apr 23, 2010

/\ /\

I, too, like to make changes after the time limit. My training compels me to constantly revise and I can't help re-reading one more time after I've hit the submit button.

Rutgar · Apr 23, 2010

Steve Williams said:
Bill your comment I find interesting . In fact I started a thread on this very topic at another forum several months ago. Specifically, I asked if members have to change settings or volume on their subs to go from 2 channel listening to HT. It was my feeling that when subs are properly integrated into a system that there should be no need for any setting or volume changes. Have you ever given this some trial in your system.?

My other question is whether you are finding to integrate your room with the Velodyne and the 2 Evolution subs. I would bet that wouldn't be so easy. It took me 3-4 months before I got my pair of Gotham subs well dialed into my system but it was worth all of the testing and listening

Steve, You ask a much more complicated question than you realize! In the past I haven't had to mess with the sub settings between 2 channel and HT. But 2 things have recently changed for me (as you know, the MM2's) and the Oppo BDP-83 SE Universal Player.

In 2 channel I now only use the MM2's. I find no need at this time for any additional sub support. However, in HT I incorperate the Velodyne to add that extra 'kick' for movies. The problem arises with how the Oppo handles LFE using the 7.1 analog outs (which is what I use for movies on the Oppo). Keeping to industry specs, the LFE channel is 10dB down with speakers set to 'Large'. And 15dB down if speakers are set to 'Small'. Although the Oppo has a +10dB boost capability on the LFE out, it is recommended to leave this setting at '0' due to possible clipping issues and adjust the additional needed volume in the receiver or sub itself. Of course, the hitch comes in when using other devices, such as a DVR or HD-DVD player, in which the digital coax is used for audio. In the digital domain, this -10dB standard is understood, and automatically taken care of.

Bottom line is: I initially tried to compensate for this difference in my Pre/Pro. But to reach the proper levels on the Sub, I found I was having both increase the LFE gain in the Oppo its full +10dB for analog, and decreasing the LFE gain a full -15dB for digital coax devices in the Pre/Pro. This method ran both to opposite extremes. I finally had a 'Duh' moment and remembered that the Digital Drive Velodynes have multiple preset settings that are one-button selectable after being set up. So I finally ended up setting everything in the Oppo and Classe' to null, and setting up the differences in the just the Velodyne. This works beautifully. I just simply have to remember to select the correct preset on the Velodyne when switching between movies on the Oppo, and my DVR.

I hope all of this makes sense!

audioguy · Apr 23, 2010

Rutgar: What pre-pro are yo using. That sound really bizarre!

Steve Williams · Apr 23, 2010

I am very interested in the Oppo 83SE. I have been hoping someone might put up a thread in the Oppo section I created regarding the 3 Oppo models and their findings

Rutgar · Apr 23, 2010

audioguy, It is a Classe' SSP-30 MKII I purchased in 2001. The 'MKII' part of it was a factory upgrade I sent it in for, a few years ago.

It has no HDMI (too old for that). The 7.1 analog pass-through is as specified, analog with basic volume control. No individual level settings when using these, including the LFE section. In the digital section of the unit, there are adjustments for everything. But for movies I'm using the analog pass through to take advantage of the newer advanced codecs such as DTS-MA, etc.

I could solve all of these problems by buying a newer Pre/Pro. But one thing at a time! Besides, like I said earlier, the Velodyne is doing a great job with it's multi-preset cablibilities.

- Bill

rsbeck · Apr 23, 2010

Steve Williams said:
I am very interested in the Oppo 83SE. I have been hoping someone might put up a thread in the Oppo section I created regarding the 3 Oppo models and their findings

I have some info from Oppo regarding the difference between the three blu-ray players. I'll post it in the Oppo thread in the Blu-Ray Players forum.

Steve Williams · Apr 23, 2010

Thanks Rob

Gregadd · May 13, 2010

Great SUb

Eminent Technology's TRW 17 Infrasonic Woofer is said to be so powerful that it can move an open door back and forth about half-an-inch at incredibly low frequencies. We’re talking stuff that you feel rather than actually hear.

Steve Williams · May 13, 2010

The Thigpen Rotary Woofer is amazing but not my cup of tea. Several years ago Thigpen flew from Florida in his private plane to the SF Bay area where he set up his TRW in an infinite baffle in one of the members of our Bay Area Audio Society. A well attended event. Even Keith Yates and Mark Seaton attended. The subsonic effects in Master and Commander were staggering. I was standing in the rear corner of the room and had motion sickness for several hours after. The TRW is the real deal.

audioblazer · May 15, 2010

Using Dual JL audio Fathom 113 for HT duty. Recently tried integrating it with my 2 channel after reading about albert porter 's positive feedback. Purchase a tube buffer thru albert. Seems to improve soundstaging and imaging but not exactly sure I got it right esp when I play pomps and pipes Lp, a reference recording vinyl, the bass doesnt sound so correct at very low bass section and I need to set elf -9db to cut down on the rumbling sound. If u want to knw whether your 2 channel can go really low you must try this LP as well as aaanalog.de reel to reel tape , Mozart revisited- awesome

Wardsweb · May 15, 2010

In the past, I have run dual Carver subs (10"), a sinlge M&K V1B (12"), and dual Bassmaxx B1 horns (18"). I presently run a Danley Sound Labs DTS-10 tapped horn (2x12").

http://wardswebllc.com/Danley_DTS10/

audioguy · May 16, 2010

Wardsweb said:
I presently run a Danley Sound Labs DTS-10 tapped horn (2x12").

http://wardswebllc.com/Danley_DTS10/

WOW! That is one ginormous piece of audio equipment! Mark Seaton is just delivering (not to me) some new sub monsters as well but pale in size to that sub...which I guess is why it is a DIY solution. Shipping would cost a small fortune.

He has a customer who is getting two of these, and already had 4 SubMersives all in a 2500cf room !!

Can we spell excess (not to be confused with the Wilson Audio sub of a similar name)?

Which subs are you using for your HT system.

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