Most people listen in awful rooms. Yet many seem to deeply care about gear measurements. Is there a contradiction here?
Most people listen in awful rooms.
and quite a few rooms don't suck
That said, I have for many years found it interesting the amount of money and effort spent on gear and tweaks relative to that spent on the room, which does indeed dominate the sound for most of us.
(...) and quite a few rooms don't suck. less than perfect is different than 'suck'. and if a speaker is appropriate to the room size then many rooms can work quite well. i would disagree, 'that most audiophiles i know listen in aweful rooms.' (...)
But it is interesting how audiophiles are the focus, when there are as many if not more musicians (including amateurs) with very expensive classical instruments at home, in untreated rooms.
Orb
We own a Steinway baby grand which we have in our living room with a vaulted ceiling. My kids also practice, flute, guitar and saxophone in that room. It sounds better and more realistic than in my dedicated music room!
My stereo room does not have state of the art treatments and I would place it on the 'it doesn't suck' scale of things.
I'm amazed on a daily basis by the physical nature of live acoustic music versus reproduced...even in Mike L's and Bruce B's amazing rooms.
Tim, you're right on the money. You know what's coming, the listening room is irrelevant IF the system is working properly: in the same way a live instrument will always sound the real deal no matter where it's played, so will good reproduction. The key point you made is "understand the reflections and enjoy them". That's exactly what should happen with an audio system, and the fact that you don't is, and here it comes, too much irritating distortion mixed in with the sound. As Mike and Roger and others have said, you don't appreciate how much muck "normal" systems eject into the listening space until you hear one that doesn't do it. So, if too much unwanted sound, then an option is to treat the room to minimise the audible impact of such ...Apples and oranges. Live instruments sound good in very lively spaces. We seem to understand all the reflections and enjoy them. Playback systems, not so much.
Tim
What the real thing has is the ability to go loud without distortion. Most domestic systems can't do this, well crafted pro setups can: I'm certain if if someone who really knew his stuff set up a professional playback in your room he would have no trouble knocking the real saxophone off the stage. I'm not talking hideously distorted loud, but genuine, clean volume replay ...Actually, I hear the same thing difference in physical presence when my son practices saxophone in my music room (i.e. when he's trying to get away from his annoying little brother).
There's no substitute for the real thing.
the listening room is irrelevant IF the system is working properly:
Frank
Not even close in my experience and opinion. Had you said "slightly less important" -- then maybe.
Irrelevant --- not a shot !!!!!
i'm generally fine with close-miked acoustic in a lively space...but not acoustic records with significant ambient space/noise of their own...the former sounds more like a direcet instrument into your living room. The other has one acoustic reverb fighting with the one in the living room and it does not work as well for me.Apples and oranges. Live instruments sound good in very lively spaces. We seem to understand all the reflections and enjoy them. Playback systems, not so much.
Tim
Tim, you're right on the money. You know what's coming, the listening room is irrelevant IF the system is working properly: in the same way a live instrument will always sound the real deal no matter where it's played, so will good reproduction. The key point you made is "understand the reflections and enjoy them". That's exactly what should happen with an audio system, and the fact that you don't is, and here it comes, too much irritating distortion mixed in with the sound. As Mike and Roger and others have said, you don't appreciate how much muck "normal" systems eject into the listening space until you hear one that doesn't do it. So, if too much unwanted sound, then an option is to treat the room to minimise the audible impact of such ...
Frank
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