Just read the Fremer review of the Ypsilon Hyperion...interesting

morricab · Apr 6, 2018

awsmone said:
The comment section was very interesting indeed

I was wondering whether JA listened to the amplifier?

Often when Stereophile has such criticisms they subject it to further review, especially from such a well respected maker, like with the M28

I must admit if there is no negative feedback in the SS amplifier, your going to get some interesting results so it’s hardly surprising , I think it would be interesting if we new JA views on the listening, he describes it as tailored, but is removing something tailoring it ie NF, or is adding NF tailoring it to make it “neutral”.

I just find it strange that it is clear the amp is no feedback (look at the THD vs. power curves) that he would be more critical than he is with most SETs (particularly with Lamm SETs, which don't measure any better but get a "clean bill of health" from JA).

IMO, anything that has some color and life in the sound to them is "tailored". What a drab, grey sonic world they live in...

morricab · Apr 6, 2018

Al M. said:
The component list in my system thread reads when it comes to power chords:

Power chords:
stock or thicker version of regular power chord (Tripp Lite 14 AWG chord, $ 16)

You are missing some potential in your system then...

morricab · Apr 6, 2018

awsmone said:
This thread seems to be diverging from amplifier measurements to power cords and dacs, not sure how we got onto that.

Personally I think MF comments about PCs was perfectly reasonable, and consistent with my own observations, having said that, some manufacturers insist their equipment is voiced for their PCs, MF pointed out, though theyYpsilon Hyperion used a 20A IEC they didn’t provide a pc with it and he used his own

As he owned musical fidelity tri vista which used those 20A IEC, like AR, I assume he had these lying around as I still do and used them.

Well, I have heard this amp and I have to say I thought it was pretty good and the measurements, despite what JA says, are pretty consistent with a push/pull hybrid that has no feedback. I am not surprised that Fremer found it more "right" sounding than his Darts...havin heard both amps I would concur with his assessment. Now, whether the Hyperion sounds better than Lamm ML3s...

bonzo75 · Apr 6, 2018

morricab said:
Well, I have heard this amp and I have to say I thought it was pretty good and the measurements, despite what JA says, are pretty consistent with a push/pull hybrid that has no feedback. I am not surprised that Fremer found it more "right" sounding than his Darts...havin heard both amps I would concur with his assessment. Now, whether the Hyperion sounds better than Lamm ML3s...

By having heard both at a hifi show in separate systems you concur with this assessment?

awsmone · Apr 6, 2018

morricab said:
I just find it strange that it is clear the amp is no feedback (look at the THD vs. power curves) that he would be more critical than he is with most SETs (particularly with Lamm SETs, which don't measure any better but get a "clean bill of health" from JA).

IMO, anything that has some color and life in the sound to them is "tailored". What a drab, grey sonic world they live in...

I cannot see how adding NF is any less talilored than no NF

There are a few amplifiers I have had where u can very the NF, I always preferred the least, the ch precision u can very, not heard it but be interested in people who have owned it like Gian?

Al M. · Apr 6, 2018

morricab said:
You are missing some potential in your system then...

Yeah, that's what they say. Frankly, so far I haven't heard any obvious improvements with expensive power chords, and worse, actually deterioration of sound with some, compared to a stock power chord. Call me an unbeliever in fancy power chords if you will.

Al M. · Apr 6, 2018

microstrip said:
Why a thicker version of the regular power cord? Did you notice any improvement?

I just didn't want to have any "current restrictions"

I have not checked if it made an improvement, no need to do so for an expense of just $ 16.

KeithR · Apr 6, 2018

morricab said:
I just find it strange that it is clear the amp is no feedback (look at the THD vs. power curves) that he would be more critical than he is with most SETs (particularly with Lamm SETs, which don't measure any better but get a "clean bill of health" from JA).

IMO, anything that has some color and life in the sound to them is "tailored". What a drab, grey sonic world they live in...

why would we be comparing a 400 watt SS amp to a 20 watt SET? and why are you only focused on one graph?

quite frankly, the Lamms measure much better.

morricab · Apr 6, 2018

awsmone said:
I cannot see how adding NF is any less talilored than no NF

There are a few amplifiers I have had where u can very the NF, I always preferred the least, the ch precision u can very, not heard it but be interested in people who have owned it like Gian?

I had only one amp with variable feedback, the VAC 30/30, and it was far better on zero than any other setting.

morricab · Apr 6, 2018

Al M. said:
Yeah, that's what they say. Frankly, so far I haven't heard any obvious improvements with expensive power chords, and worse, actually deterioration of sound with some, compared to a stock power chord. Call me an unbeliever in fancy power chords if you will.

Which did you try?

morricab · Apr 6, 2018

KeithR said:
why would we be comparing a 400 watt SS amp to a 20 watt SET? and why are you only focused on one graph?

quite frankly, the Lamms measure much better.

Because of how it is designed. I am not focused on any one graph...nothing I have said gives that impression either. The Lamm hybrids do measure better in some ways...they also have some negative feedback. The ML2 does not really measure better, nor does the ML3.

bonzo75 · Apr 6, 2018

KeithR said:
why would we be comparing a 400 watt SS amp to a 20 watt SET? and why are you only focused on one graph?

quite frankly, the Lamms measure much better.

Because SETs have to win

microstrip · Apr 6, 2018

Al M. said:
I just didn't want to have any "current restrictions"

I have not checked if it made an improvement, no need to do so for an expense of just $ 16.

Can you define "current restrictions" (without smiles, please

) ?

Well, how are you sure that the new cable did not degrade the performance? Blind faith in thickness?

BMCG · Apr 6, 2018

bonzo75 said:
Because SETs have to win

ahh yes...the world according to SETs....a wondrous world as depicted through rose coloured lenses.

Al M. · Apr 6, 2018

microstrip said:
Well, how are you sure that the new cable did not degrade the performance? Blind faith in thickness?

Yes, blind faith in thickness.

Cheaper than blind faith in expensive power chords. Of course, if some of them actually do sound better, then it's all good and things transition from blind faith to evidence. However, I have found that in this case, as in others, sounding different does not necessarily mean sounding better.

microstrip · Apr 6, 2018

Al M. said:
Yes, blind faith in thickness.

Cheaper than blind faith in expensive power chords. Of course, if some of them actually do sound better, then it's all good and things transition from blind faith to evidence. However, I have found that in this case, as in others, sounding different does not necessarily mean sounding better.

Unfortunately for our wallets good power cables (or grounding devices, BTW) can bring real significant improvements in sound quality. We have surely to match them to our systems - there is no miraculous "best choice". I had to try several complete looms until I settled in my current choice. And still keep several complete sets with very different characteristics on hand, surely not too expensive,

to be sure that I always give a fair opportunity to equipment I want to listen.

In this hobby it is very easy to exclude or be negative about something - most of the time we do not have instantaneous reward.

Al M. · Apr 6, 2018

microstrip said:
Unfortunately for our wallets good power cables (or grounding devices, BTW) can bring real significant improvements in sound quality. We have surely to match them to our systems - there is no miraculous "best choice". I had to try several complete looms until I settled in my current choice. And still keep several complete sets with very different characteristics on hand, surely not too expensive, to be sure that I always give a fair opportunity to equipment I want to listen.

In this hobby it is very easy to exclude or be negative about something - most of the time we do not have instantaneous reward.

Possibly there is merit in some expensive power chords. I have not yet had been fortunate enough to hear good evidence for that.

KeithR · Apr 6, 2018

morricab said:
Because of how it is designed. I am not focused on any one graph...nothing I have said gives that impression either. The Lamm hybrids do measure better in some ways...they also have some negative feedback. The ML2 does not really measure better, nor does the ML3.

you mean the Ypsilon's impedance deviation, poor sine wave, and high distortion in the bass don't matter? as an SS amp with no OPT?

KeithR · Apr 6, 2018

I really hate the excuses for gear sometimes. JA does us great favors to even provide the stuff.

morricab · Apr 6, 2018

BMCG said:
ahh yes...the world according to SETs....a wondrous world as depicted through rose coloured lenses.

You must see the world in grayscale then

Just read the Fremer review of the Ypsilon Hyperion...interesting

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