Zero Distortion: Oswald Mills - the OMA OMG tour

spiritofmusic · Mar 14, 2018

Ked, the Monarch seems superficially similar (in overall design, not quality of components) to that Dutch BD Audio speaker (the successor to the Swing horn), where Bert has a mids/tweeter horn sitting on multiple Class D powered horns augmented by flying wings baffle.
I think you travelled to hear that one.

bonzo75 · Mar 14, 2018

Actually, I mentioned this to Bill. Where the BD horns did not do it was maybe drivers and the SS amps he uses. They had less decay and that Midbass slam and oomph. But yes that planar horn concept was similar

spiritofmusic · Mar 14, 2018

How did the big sealed subs integrate w the main horns in the Imperias?

bonzo75 · Mar 14, 2018

I didn't like that, but the trio bass horn guy did

spiritofmusic · Mar 14, 2018

Well, this seems to be a perennial issue w so-called FR horns. Either a big traditional sub like these Imperias and Magico Ultimates, some w half way decent basshorns like AG Trios, Cessaro Liszts, Gammas, and some that use open baffle bass.
Surely this is an issue when spending big bucks on even bigger horns that have such compromised sub bass tech.

bonzo75 · Mar 14, 2018

Trio bass horns are superb. What's wrong with two 15 inch woofers on the monarch, or the two 18 inch ones on the bespoke German ones I like? Don't see a perennial issue. Also the DIY one guyser (puresound) made for himself is fantastic 800hz downwards. Probably the best for that frequency range.

The only WAF and reasonably sized ones are the monarch, but too expensive. Like with Artisan fidelity, you are paying for added art

spiritofmusic · Mar 14, 2018

Ked, if you talk to the really crazy Japanese guys who’s whole house becomes a basshorn, the consensus is that a TRUE Basshorn needs to be at least 24’ in length. Anything else may sound just fine, but isn’t a basshorn in the true literal sense. More just woofer bass w some added pseudo basshorn loading.
I know someone who stuck his head inside an AG Basshorn unit, the horn length is so minimal it has to rely on a ton of dsp, thus a true basshorn it is not.
I was always wary of Stereo’s idea to use Magico Ultimates. Just how is it “Ultimate” with a sealed woofer box?

bonzo75 · Mar 14, 2018

I don't think there is any point comparing to a while house or 24' in length.

How ultimate will be a horn made by a cone company?

morricab · Mar 14, 2018

bonzo75 said:
Trio bass horns are superb. What's wrong with two 15 inch woofers on the monarch, or the two 18 inch ones on the bespoke German ones I like? Don't see a perennial issue. Also the DIY one guyser (puresound) made for himself is fantastic 800hz downwards. Probably the best for that frequency range.

The only WAF and reasonably sized ones are the monarch, but too expensive. Like with Artisan fidelity, you are paying for added art

Are the two 15 inchers in a sealed or vented box on the Monarch?

morricab · Mar 14, 2018

spiritofmusic said:
Ked, if you talk to the really crazy Japanese guys who’s whole house becomes a basshorn, the consensus is that a TRUE Basshorn needs to be at least 24’ in length. Anything else may sound just fine, but isn’t a basshorn in the true literal sense. More just woofer bass w some added pseudo basshorn loading.
I know someone who stuck his head inside an AG Basshorn unit, the horn length is so minimal it has to rely on a ton of dsp, thus a true basshorn it is not.
I was always wary of Stereo’s idea to use Magico Ultimates. Just how is it “Ultimate” with a sealed woofer box?

3 meters will get you down in the 30s for bass and that can still be in a relatively compact backloaded bass horn. For subsonic frequencies then you need the househorn!

bonzo75 · Mar 14, 2018

I don't think there is any point comparing to a while house or 24' in length.

How ultimate will be a horn made by a cone company?

bonzo75 · Mar 14, 2018

Monarch sounds more like a sensitive panel than a horn. The waveguide from the butterfly is doing it.

Maybe that's the way to the SET panels thing rather trying to run them on apogee, acoustat, etc

ddk · Mar 14, 2018

Tango said:
Looks like ddk’s Table.

Very sure they do their own table.

Tang

It’s the exact same type of Kinetic Systems lab table I use and even spray painted the same way.

david

Believe High Fidelity · Mar 14, 2018

A great read Ked. I had a feeling you might land on Apogee's as a final speaker, but held hopes you would find the right horn setup to convince you otherwise.

shakti · Mar 14, 2018

thanx Ked, nice visit, would love to try the Monarch @home

spiritofmusic · Mar 14, 2018

There is a more manageable system (price wise) somewhat similar in concept to the Monarch, in having vertical array of sub bass drivers augmented by wings and a mids/tweeter horn above from BD-Audio in NL at maybe 20% of the cost of these OMAs.

DaveC · Mar 14, 2018

spiritofmusic said:
Well, this seems to be a perennial issue w so-called FR horns. Either a big traditional sub like these Imperias and Magico Ultimates, some w half way decent basshorns like AG Trios, Cessaro Liszts, Gammas, and some that use open baffle bass.
Surely this is an issue when spending big bucks on even bigger horns that have such compromised sub bass tech.

Lol... well, it's talked about a lot and there's no doubt extremely bad examples but it's an issue with implementation and not design. Bass is difficult to get right and the most expensive part of a speaker. IMO, many/most speakers fall short with bass, it's not just horns with direct radiator bass.

DaveC · Mar 14, 2018

I've heard the AC1 many years ago and thought they were excellent. I'm pretty sure it was over 10 years ago. I forget which track it was, but I remember hearing a small jazz ensemble and the sax was amazing. Very cool gear all in all, pricey but beautiful design and very unique. I'd love to visit.

spiritofmusic · Mar 14, 2018

Imperias seem to have nearly trebled in price, they were $120k a few years back.
I remember thinking back then they were JUST about at the limit of affordability.
Now?...

bonzo75 · Mar 14, 2018

spiritofmusic said:
There is a more manageable system (price wise) somewhat similar in concept to the Monarch, in having vertical array of sub bass drivers augmented by wings and a mids/tweeter horn above from BD-Audio in NL at maybe 20% of the cost of these OMAs.

It needs to be tweaked to get here, if you know how that's fine. As is it can't match. And it was 35k euro when I visited.

I wish he showed it with PTP lenco and SETs

Zero Distortion: Oswald Mills - the OMA OMG tour

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