Danley SH-50 Synergy horns and subs

spiritofmusic

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A couple of days ago I hosted a visitor who really liked my system.
On chatting all things audio, we got around to horns.
My visitor is a pro install guy, setting up systems for clubs and live venues, and has a lot of experience with, and admiration for, Danley gear.
And he strongly suggested I consider the SH-50 full range tapped Synergy horns w very fast subs like REL or JL.
I’ve looked at the Danley website, and these Synergy horns look fascinating, effectively 50Hz-18kHz, and a manageable size.
And the one or two reviews pertaining to home audio use (as opposed to pro installs) are extremely enticing.
So WBF, thoughts on Danley for our uses, and the SH-50 in particular.
 
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Blue58

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kodomo

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Multiple Entry Horns are quite a thing to experience! Tom Danley is the master of course. It will sound better, more refined than most of the stuff that has been named as high end. It has a great and even response even if you are very close to the horn (you can put your head inside the horn and still can not discern different drivers).

I have a large 5 way horn system and here is the part that sh-50 has advantage over mine. You can sit close or far, it always sounds coherent and balanced. In my system, you have to have a big room and it sounds best after about 3.5 meters. Still, I would consider sh-50 as my second system as the tone/refinement I have in my system seems better to me. It may be because the bms drivers they utilise (which I used in the past) or it may be something else, it may even be a delusion of mine!

My main concern in audio starts with the time domain and then amplitude, which was why I designed my own horn system the way I did. Danley has a better solution overall if you consider space and being able to array of course. Synergy series rocks for their great phase response and also has a flat amplitude response.

If you get danley tapped horn along sh50, you don't need any subwoofers for sure, be it rel or any other brand. You can customise the looks if plastic does not float your boat. I remember someone making wood panels to cover it. Personally, I like it for what it does and love it for coming up with a new approach to horns as a horn lover. I also really read whatever Tom Danley writes online and learned a lot from him. He is very open to share as far as I am concerned and that is another win in my book.

Are you still sticking with the soundsmith strain gauge? That is on thing I am considering nowadays for a change.
 

spiritofmusic

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Kodomo, either the SH50 will “talk” to me and is thus the biggest bargain in loudspeakers today, or it’ll strike me as a PA spkr not suitable for the subtleties of high end listening.
There are few chances to hear it in the U.K., so the domestic setting/Class AB amps/tt setup will tell me a lot when the time arises.
Yr comment on not needing a sub I don’t quite get - as it tails off at 50Hz, I surely need SOMETHING to extend down to 30, or even 20Hz.
 

spiritofmusic

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Straingauge? Yes indeed.
I had been running it with a Red Wine Audio twin battery psu, but despite a good sound, this was terribly unreliable.
I now run the SG with a bespoke overspecced transformer psu designed by Peter Downs of Alternative Audio in SW England, and the result is wholly positive.
 

kodomo

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You definitely need a sub, actually you need at least two (believe me) I recommended danley tapped horns along a synergy horn, it got lost in my writing. I am not a native speaker, sorry :) Try Danley THspud and you will have a response down to 18hz ;)

It sounds refined and as good as most of the high end speakers with great horn dynamics and the incredible phase response. It may sound a tad bright but that can be sorted out with good component matching if it bothers you (it may not, it is quite flat)

My system is 109db efficient and no hum and noise aspect of sg is really inviting for me. I will try with his wall adapters along his wwe filter. Hopefully I will get a demo on first weeks of March! My friend who has it also has a transformer power supply he uses with it and it utilises a Tamura transformer!
 

spiritofmusic

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Kodomo, your English is just fine .
Can you mention which exact Danley tapped horn sub you’d recommend? Which model?
 

kodomo

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THspud was the model I suggested, you can find it under tapped horns on their page. If you can spend more, the dts10 matches the efficiency of sh50's and sound great with them. Both work very well in home environment along sh50's.

I think two dts10 subwoofers and two sh50's would sound very good and would be a great match. If you have the space, wanna spend more, I have a DTS20 clone (over 2meters) and it is crazy! You can always get two DTS 20's as well ;)

I always suggest stereo as these will most probably have output up to 70hz- 80hz.

ps. how big is your room?
 

spiritofmusic

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Kodomo, your help here is much appreciated.
I’ve converted the roof/loft space into an excellent sounding dedicated room.
18’/5.5m wide
48’/14.5m deep
10’/3m high at midline apex
Eaves descend R and L at 30 degrees incline to side walls 4’/1.3m high.
800 sq ft/80 sq m area
5600 cub ft/160 cub m volume
 

spiritofmusic

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Kodomo, that DTS10 is a beast!
But I can’t get it into my space
Only access is via 50” x 30”/1.75 x 1.25m hatch
 

Folsom

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Custom made synergy horns would be a nice option. They will likely sound better and be half the price. The Danley brand uses drivers meant for stadiums, and command a premium for purely SPL purposes that require an EQ that makes the highs astoundingly loud anywhere near the speaker.

For fast subs you cant beat OB servos, which you would have custom made from GR-Research, and the next level up is me doing acmod on the amps. People have replaced a lot if subs with them, one guy even a JL sub.
 

spiritofmusic

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Folsom, what’s your thoughts on something like the SH50 for home audio use? Not custom ones, but the ones Danley sells.
 

kodomo

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SH-50 uses BMS 4550 for its 1" compression driver, its a pro driver but is good and can be used at home. SH50 is not meant for stadiums, those are crazier Danleys like the Jericho! SH-50 had a passive crossover, and like I said, it measured very flat. The highs were not exaggerated amplitude wise. Still, I feel they are bright as well. (check out the response at the spec sheet https://www.danleysoundlabs.com/danley/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/SH-50-spec-sheet11.pdf)

You can also go active with them and ask Danley to create a curve better for home listening :) I believe he would do that!

If we come back to my first concern, I could not have the same finesse/details whatever you call it with Danley and continue with my own horns.
 

spiritofmusic

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Komodo, I hear you. I’m coming from Zu Definitions 4 spkrs which aren’t the last word in finesse, lack of colouration, or ultimate transparency either.
Audiophile horns search may take me to Haigner Alphahorns/Gammahorns, Sadurni Acoustics Staccatos/Miracolis. Etc.
 

Folsom

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Folsom, what’s your thoughts on something like the SH50 for home audio use? Not custom ones, but the ones Danley sells.

You might want your complimenting gear to offset the sound some. The guys I know that like them are into a fairly sterile sound. They would be a drastic change from Zu's.

kodomo suggesting a little different crossover is a nice idea if you can order it that way. I think I had the SH50 price mixed up with another that was... way pricier.
 

spiritofmusic

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Folsom, no way do I go less sophisticated than my Zus.
This is so weird, there are posts on other forums of guys trading in their AG Duos and Trios for the SH50. Go figure.
 

Folsom

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What does sophisticated mean?

I'm not surprised people with AG's would look at SH50. There are benefits to getting the drivers closer together like the SH50 has done. The Synergy horn is not perfect, but it's actually a little bit of a marvel. I couldn't think of a better HT speaker, that's for sure.
 

Mark Seaton

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The Synergy/Unity design has a lot of potential for home use, but most of the offerings are currently optimized for professional use. They've teased about a studio version or the like for quite a while, but have thus far only shown prototypes. The designs with molded horns have much smoother transitions and reduce some of the irregularities in the horn, which is the hurdle in executing the design vs the loading, phase, and off axis benefits of the concept. For home audio, most are happier with a wider dispersion than the 60 deg of the SM-60F which is probably the most home-suitable. While the form factor might be tricky, the ones I'd look to utilize in a hifi system would be the SM-96, or the SH96HO where you have a full 90 deg wide horn and plenty of extension to meet a subwoofer. Based on my experience with the early Unity designs working with Tom Danley at Sound Physics Labs, I would custom order which ever model you chose with the front "lip" that captures the grill shaved off as it greatly reduced audible edge diffraction and makes it all look/feel more hifi like. We did some of the SH95 predecessors like this and the difference was rather striking. Implementing the active version of the SH96HO with home audio quality using something like a Trinnov or other active speaker capable system might be very interesting as well (look at the difference in the frequency response on the PDF spec sheet). Mixing any of these with active room correction would be a great idea as well, where you then have the ability to get the right overall tilt/voicing for your room vs the very different application they were designed for. You might get lucky with some models being voiced well for your use, but realize it's not what they were designed for.
 

spiritofmusic

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There’s a distinct scarcity of chances to hear Danleys in the U.K. in a domestic environment w Class AB amps and a tt as source.
I’ll hsve to gauge from this demo whether the Danley sound is indeed for me.
 

kodomo

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trading a ag horn to a synergy would be the right thing to do, if it was me too! AG sound is definitely not the best to hear of a good multiway horn system in my eyes.
 

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