Emm labs DA2 v2 upgrade

awsmone

Well-Known Member
Apr 6, 2014
1,616
513
435
Canberra Australia
Dammit never realised that lol.... being at the top in the Southern Hemisphere and Emm Labs at the bottom in Canada

I personally always run round the block backwards before putting a record on...;)
 

thedudeabides

Well-Known Member
Jan 16, 2011
2,118
646
1,200
Alto, NM
Long time audio asylum inmates will know i have a ritualistic procedure when playing optical discs - that is, i will shut down the player/transport & dac combo prior to playing any optical discs. I've developed a strict sequence of always powering up the transport first, insert disc, letting the transport read disc toc and settle, before i then go on to power up the dac. Music simply sounds better with this powering up sequence. However I encounter a very peculiar problem with the tsdx/dac2x v1 combo.

Do you go through this routine every time you play a disc in the same listening session?
 

thedudeabides

Well-Known Member
Jan 16, 2011
2,118
646
1,200
Alto, NM
I follow a similar routine with my non-EMM Labs digital gear. Before I sit down to listen, I touch my nose with my left hand and my left ear with my right hand, then reverse the procedure because the order is somewhat critical.

After loading the CD, I take it out, put it in upside down, hit eject, then put it in data-side down. You'd be surprised at the difference this makes. Well, maybe you wouldn't but everyone else would.

Then I walk the width (never the length) of my listening room left to right twice (once sounds okay, three times sounds awful), returning to my listening seat at precisely a 120 degree angle (I have the path marked out on the floor with black duct tape).

If I don't go through this somewhat time-consuming routine (it took me 20 minutes once after a few too many cognacs), the system sounds fuzzy, gray, ill-defined and unfocused.

YMMV.

Too funny.
 

Legolas

VIP/Donor
Dec 27, 2015
1,041
387
455
France
Ha Ha, I can beat this. One of my buddies (honestly it is NOT me) has a collection of CDs, maybe 2,000+. When he buys a new CD he can listen to it only once. Then he has to go back in rotation to his entire collection, in purchased order. Then at some point, maybe 1 years time at least, he can return to his 'new' CD to listen to it again. I questioned his logic, and he said he had to listen to all his music, or there was no point in buying it in the first place. Go figure!

But I can see a situation where many CDs we have almost never get listened to for whatever reason. I find, unless it is a really great album, there is often some annoying track that I don't like so much, so maybe that is why. And those albums can be viewed as 2 or 3 great tracks, with the rest as 'fillers' or one level or another.
 

awsmone

Well-Known Member
Apr 6, 2014
1,616
513
435
Canberra Australia
Well I can see the logic

He must be very OCD
 

cyclopse

Member
Jul 25, 2016
51
3
8
Ha Ha, I can beat this. One of my buddies (honestly it is NOT me) has a collection of CDs, maybe 2,000+. When he buys a new CD he can listen to it only once. Then he has to go back in rotation to his entire collection, in purchased order. Then at some point, maybe 1 years time at least, he can return to his 'new' CD to listen to it again. I questioned his logic, and he said he had to listen to all his music, or there was no point in buying it in the first place. Go figure!

But I can see a situation where many CDs we have almost never get listened to for whatever reason. I find, unless it is a really great album, there is often some annoying track that I don't like so much, so maybe that is why. And those albums can be viewed as 2 or 3 great tracks, with the rest as 'fillers' or one level or another.

Does he have to listen to every track on each CD or can he be selective and play particular tracks?
 

Bar81

Well-Known Member
Mar 24, 2017
129
20
98
Firmware installed......


No issues installing firmware

very comprehensive instructions it seems

and a special application to load it up

hey presto its working

Firmware seems to have on some files a November 2017 date on it, with september update of usb drivers

First impressions..

Well if you don't want to read the rest the Dagogo review is pretty spot on

First Day observations

Overall

Is one of great improvement, all the weakness seems to have been attacked and greatly rectified
More musical
Better timing, it’s quick, but with the ease of a great artist, not mechanically quick, yet breathes
Better timbre
Better midrange; with greater more natural information and harmonic density
denser treble, more accurate harmonics, with touch of sweetness where appropriate

greater image depth
less bass confusion
longer sound trails
Greater difference between recordings, and HQplayer settings
Lower noise floor
extraneous noises in recordings more compartmentalised

Bass is less plodding and very articulate, and frequencies between 100-200 more fleshed out, and appropriately, like the frequency spectrum has pulled its "socks up"

Finally got a USB cable long enough to do the upgrade (it needed to have a booster as it's over the 15ft max of USB spec).

The vocals, instrument delineation, density of what's there, added meat on the bone, harmonic richness, musicality - WOW!!!!! Everything that was lacking has been addressed - it is now the player that I hoped it would be.

The best compliment I can give is that it is now akin in performance, musicality and level of upgrade as that of my recently purchased D'Agostino Momentum M400 mono blocs (if you've heard them you'll appreciate how high of a compliment I'm giving).
 

awsmone

Well-Known Member
Apr 6, 2014
1,616
513
435
Canberra Australia
The vocals, instrument delineation, density of what's there, added meat on the bone, harmonic richness, musicality - WOW!!!!! Everything that was lacking has been addressed - it is now the player that I hoped it would be.

+1
 

marty

Well-Known Member
Apr 20, 2010
3,016
4,153
2,520
United States
Now with 2 days of the DA2 firmware update I agree that it is a noticeable improvement in musicality. Higher definition throughout is the hallmark, but slight changes in timbre, particularly at the bottom end are also apparent. Very slight de-emphasis of bass below 25Hz w a slight improvement in the mid and upper mid bass (60-90 Hz) are what I take away. Overall bass balance is therefore improved and more articulate. Ed Meitner's firmware upgrades are always beneficial and this one is no exception. It amply rewards those that made the initial investment to remain current with the SOA. And you can't beat the price. A shout out to Shahin Al Rashid at Meitner sales for helping me walk through the download and install.
 
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Bar81

Well-Known Member
Mar 24, 2017
129
20
98

The more I listen, the more impressed I am with this update. Combined with the D'Agostino M400s, the noise floor in my system is now so low it's shocking - the low level information I am hearing now is stunning - sucking me into the performance. The other impressive improvement is with the treble - they've finally gotten rid of the last vestiges of lean-nes, to the point where I can maximally enjoy the benefits of the beryllium tweeter in my speakers without any hint of fatigue.

I also agree with you on the quickness. I feel that it's touch slower than it was before on transients, but it sounds more natural. Depth of soundstage also seems to be noticeably improved. So all in all, I concur on all of your points above.
 

awsmone

Well-Known Member
Apr 6, 2014
1,616
513
435
Canberra Australia
I been unable to listen last few days as been caring for my two year old

However I got to descend to the man cave yesterday

I put on RR Symphonic dances, and the naturalness of the orchestral presentation was most impressive

I put on a Steve Davis dsd recording

The deep harmonics of the plucked double bass and ability to tell which string was being plucked and obvious harmony development when two strings were plucked were a revelation

The bass is less clouded and bloomy , now more articulate, but not dry...cannot get enough of it

My recording of corroboree it’s like the stage is twice as deep, width little changed
 

Yuen A.

Well-Known Member
Jan 4, 2018
521
230
153
Hi Dear Members, I am new to this forum.

However, I would like to share my thoughts on the new V2 firmware upgrade.

I had mine installed about 2 weeks ago. Wow! a major breakthrough - the explosive dynamics (the most obvious characteristic), the greater resolution, huge soundstaging, greater ambient detail, greater bass slam, etc. I honestly believe that the upgraded DA2 is currently the best DAC available. I am still stunned by it!
 

awsmone

Well-Known Member
Apr 6, 2014
1,616
513
435
Canberra Australia
Hi Dear Members, I am new to this forum.

However, I would like to share my thoughts on the new V2 firmware upgrade.

I had mine installed about 2 weeks ago. Wow! a major breakthrough - the explosive dynamics (the most obvious characteristic), the greater resolution, huge soundstaging, greater ambient detail, greater bass slam, etc. I honestly believe that the upgraded DA2 is currently the best DAC available. I am still stunned by it!

Welcome and thanks for sharing your thoughts
 

Yuen A.

Well-Known Member
Jan 4, 2018
521
230
153
The more I listen, the more impressed I am with this update. Combined with the D'Agostino M400s, the noise floor in my system is now so low it's shocking - the low level information I am hearing now is stunning - sucking me into the performance. The other impressive improvement is with the treble - they've finally gotten rid of the last vestiges of lean-nes, to the point where I can maximally enjoy the benefits of the beryllium tweeter in my speakers without any hint of fatigue.

I also agree with you on the quickness. I feel that it's touch slower than it was before on transients, but it sounds more natural. Depth of soundstage also seems to be noticeably improved. So all in all, I concur on all of your points above.

Hi Bar81

Just wondering what you meant by "it's touch slower than it was before on transients". My impression, after the firmware upgrade, was/is that the transients was/is much better than before (it now sounded explosive).

Interestingly, I used to own a Wadia separates. However, because Digital lack sufficient resolution at that time, I went back to analog/turntable. Since then, I own EMM Labs CDSA- XDS1- DAC2X (I bought them because of their musicality, but they lack sufficient dynamics and resolution) The DA2 is different. I believe it can compete with any high-end turntables.
 

awsmone

Well-Known Member
Apr 6, 2014
1,616
513
435
Canberra Australia
To me transients are more natural and intelligible, and dynamics are increased without congestion

This means many tracks are more listenable, and can be listened at a lower volume

Inner detail is increased and space between instruments is so clear and lacking grain
 

Bar81

Well-Known Member
Mar 24, 2017
129
20
98
Hi Bar81

Just wondering what you meant by "it's touch slower than it was before on transients". My impression, after the firmware upgrade, was/is that the transients was/is much better than before (it now sounded explosive).

Being explosive and speed on transients are separate things. What you are describing is on the back end of a transient and what I was discussing is on the front end of the transient.
 

Yuen A.

Well-Known Member
Jan 4, 2018
521
230
153
Being explosive and speed on transients are separate things. What you are describing is on the back end of a transient and what I was discussing is on the front end of the transient.

Hi Bar81 The following is from Robert Harley's book:

These characteristics are associated with transient response, a system's ability to quickly respond to an input signal. A transient is a short-lived sound, such as that made by percussion instruments. Transient response describes an audio system's ability to faithfully reproduce the quickness of transient signals. For example, a drum being struck produces a waveform with a very steep attack (the way the sound begins) and a fast decay (the way a sound stops). If any component in the playback system can't respond as quickly as the waveform changes, a distortion of the music's dynamic envelope occurs, and the steepness is slowed. Audio components described as quick or fast reproduce the suddenness of transient signals.
 

Bar81

Well-Known Member
Mar 24, 2017
129
20
98
Hi Bar81 The following is from Robert Harley's book:

These characteristics are associated with transient response, a system's ability to quickly respond to an input signal. A transient is a short-lived sound, such as that made by percussion instruments. Transient response describes an audio system's ability to faithfully reproduce the quickness of transient signals. For example, a drum being struck produces a waveform with a very steep attack (the way the sound begins) and a fast decay (the way a sound stops). If any component in the playback system can't respond as quickly as the waveform changes, a distortion of the music's dynamic envelope occurs, and the steepness is slowed. Audio components described as quick or fast reproduce the suddenness of transient signals.

Nothing personal but every time I read anything from Harley I feel as though I got just a bit dumber.
 

Yuen A.

Well-Known Member
Jan 4, 2018
521
230
153
Nothing personal but every time I read anything from Harley I feel as though I got just a bit dumber.

Hi folks, This quote might be helpful:

"As any good engineer will testify, a recording’s transient detail – in other words, the first few milliseconds of sound energy contained in an instrument’s attack phase – forms a defining part of the overall sound quality of a track. This comes as little surprise when you realised just how much auditory information the ear extracts from a transient, with a sound’s complete identity often being formed in a time period as short as three or four milliseconds. "
 

Yuen A.

Well-Known Member
Jan 4, 2018
521
230
153
I been unable to listen last few days as been caring for my two year old

However I got to descend to the man cave yesterday

I put on RR Symphonic dances, and the naturalness of the orchestral presentation was most impressive

I put on a Steve Davis dsd recording

The deep harmonics of the plucked double bass and ability to tell which string was being plucked and obvious harmony development when two strings were plucked were a revelation

The bass is less clouded and bloomy , now more articulate, but not dry...cannot get enough of it

My recording of corroboree it’s like the stage is twice as deep, width little changed


To all who have the DA2 v2,

If you want to blast your sound system with zero distortion, listen to this: Dvorak Slavonic Dances, op. 46 & op. 72, Budapest Festival Orchestra, Ivan Fischer (Channel Classics SACD). Unbelievable dynamics and speed! The DA2 is now a totally different beast.
 

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