R2R DACs 2017

j.phelan · Nov 30, 2017

These type were rare in 2010, now they're surging.

Current production, player or processor, made in U.S. or U.S. presence.

Multiple price points if apply:

Up to 3k: Border Patrol, Monarchy, Denafrips, Audio-gd, MHDT, Holo, Soeskris, Metrum, Schiit

5-15K: Audio Note, MSB, Metrum, Computer Audio Design, Aqua, LessLoss, Totaldac, Lampizator

15K+: CH Precision, Aries Cerat, Light Harmonic, Audio Note, MSB, Totaldac, Lampizator

**Special mention to MSB, Monarchy and Audio Note, who never gave up R2R. Even after the takeover of delta-sigma.

sbo6 · Nov 30, 2017

Yep, quite true.

I have a friend who recently bought a DIY R2R DAC that I believe also comes built called Soekris and it's absolutely outstanding. I think it's about $1500 fully assembled an includes volume and a headphone amp. The digital sonics / $ are ramping like nobody's business!

astrotoy · Dec 1, 2017

I believe my Pacific Microsonics Model Two is R2R Ladder. It is more than 15 years old. Does up to 192/24 PCM with dual wire. Of course it is an A to D and D to A.

Larry

CKKeung · Dec 1, 2017

j.phelan said:
In 2010, it was just MSB and LessLoss -but now, R2R DACs are surging.
Made in U.S. or have presence here. (Euro-brands like Rockna not incl.)
Up to 3k: Soeskris, Metrum, Schiit
5-15K: MSB, Aqua, LessLoss, Totaldac, Lampizator

Two made-in-China brands are becoming popular in Asia and Europe and I am sure that there are owners in N America too :
1. Denafrips : Terminator, Venus, Pontus & Ares. (MSRP USD680-4480)
2. Audio-gd : R2R 7 HE; R2R 7; R2R 1; R2R 2; R2R 11. (MSRP USD350-3480)

christoph · Dec 1, 2017

My trusty Resolution Audio Cantata MC 2.0 from 2011 is also R2R with its four 1704 units

morricab · Dec 1, 2017

I have had almost only R2R dacs in my audio career. Monarchy Audio M22B had BB PCM63s, Monarchy Audio M24 also had BB PCM63s, Kinergetics Research KCD-55 Ultra had two UltraAnalog D20400 modules, PS Audio Ultralink II also has the UA D20400, Aries Cerat Kassandra has 8 AD1865 chips per channel (16 dacs per channel in total). The only detour was for a while I had the Audio Aero Prima DAC that used AD1855 (I think) Delta/sigma DAC...I ended up finding it inferior to the Monarchy M24.

Hyperion · Dec 3, 2017

One of the most musical (R2R) DAC's we've had here in Stockholm:

http://www.computeraudiodesign.com/1543-mkii-dac-digital-to-analogue-converter/

/ Marcus, http://www.perfect-sense.se

marslo · Dec 3, 2017

morricab said:
I have had almost only R2R dacs in my audio career. Monarchy Audio M22B had BB PCM63s, Monarchy Audio M24 also had BB PCM63s, Kinergetics Research KCD-55 Ultra had two UltraAnalog D20400 modules, PS Audio Ultralink II also has the UA D20400, Aries Cerat Kassandra has 8 AD1865 chips per channel (16 dacs per channel in total). The only detour was for a while I had the Audio Aero Prima DAC that used AD1855 (I think) Delta/sigma DAC...I ended up finding it inferior to the Monarchy M24.

I still keep Audio Aero La Fontaine as second PCM DAC and Sacd player with Burr Brown 1792 chipset and upsampling STARS module , micro triodes in output stage.
It is a keeper for me, with R2R Lampi as a first PCM/DSD DAC.

adyc · Dec 3, 2017

Is MSB purely R2R? Their website say hybrid. It implies that it can convert DSD natively.

microstrip · Dec 3, 2017

XXX believes that YYY technology used in current DAC chips does not sound as natural as ZZZ technology.

I have read it tens of time, only XXX, YYY and ZZZ vary. Fortunately we can pick what our preferred DAC technology and smile, some one who feels like us has probably written the proper sentence. I have listened to several technologies sounding excellent, IMHO it is the implementation and details that make the difference. And curiously, most people ignore the technical aspects of implementation and details, they just know the soundbytes.

Pb Blimp · Dec 3, 2017

microstrip said:
XXX believes that YYY technology used in current DAC chips does not sound as natural as ZZZ technology.

I have read it tens of time, only XXX, YYY and ZZZ vary. Fortunately we can pick what our preferred DAC technology and smile, some one who feels like us has probably written the proper sentence. I have listened to several technologies sounding excellent, IMHO it is the implementation and details that make the difference. And curiously, most people ignore the technical aspects of implementation and details, they just know the soundbytes.

Yep.

j.phelan · Dec 3, 2017

I added Mola-Mola and Border Patrol. This list was tough -more and more are coming and half of them haven't been reviewed. At least thru U.S. based publishers.

The count is now 18 (different) brands -2 have diff. price-points.

audio.bill · Dec 3, 2017

j.phelan said:
I added Mola-Mola. This list was tough -more and more are coming and half of them haven't been reviewed. At least thru U.S. based publishers.

The count is now 17 (different) brands -2 have diff. price-points.

With all due respect I'd be curious to know where you have seen the Mola Mola DAC described as being an R2R design? TIA for any clarification.

Ken Newton · Dec 3, 2017

audio.bill said:
With all due respect I'd be curious to know where you have seen the Mola Mola DAC described as being an R2R design?

According to their website, the Mola-Mola DAC features high order noise-shaping. Single-bit sigma-delta modulation DACs also feature high order noise-shaping. The actual quantizer Mola-Mola implements here is NOT an R2R, but a pulse width modulation (PWM) type. PWM is a kind of single-bit quantizer, but operates differently from the much more common pulse density modulation (PDM) type single-bit audio quantizers, such as is utilized in DSD.

audio.bill · Dec 3, 2017

Ken Newton said:
According to their website, the Mola-Mola DAC features high order noise-shaping. Single-bit sigma-delta modulation DACs also feature high order noise-shaping. The actual quantizer Mola-Mola implements here is NOT an R2R, but a pulse width modulation (PWM) type. PWM is a kind of single-bit quantizer, but operates differently from the much more common pulse density modulation (PDM) type single-bit audio quantizers, such as is utilized in DSD.

Thanks very much for your excellent explanation Ken!

j.phelan · Dec 3, 2017

They say "no off-the-shelf chips". Then, 2 boards for conversion w/ discrete 32-stage FIR DAC.

Ken Newton · Dec 3, 2017

j.phelan said:
They say "no off-the-shelf chips". Then, 2 boards for conversion w/ discrete 32-stage FIR DAC.

They very likely utilize FPGA chips to implement proprietary processing algorithms, and the 1-bit PWM quantizer - as opposed to commercial DAC chips.

j.phelan · Dec 4, 2017

When I hear (2) boards for conversion, I think discrete. But you could be right -I'll delete them for now.

sbo6 · Dec 4, 2017

Good stuff. It would be good to have a comprehensive list as the OP had started, maybe keeping it with DACs <=5 years old?. Can we add to this list as we discover more?

Up to 3k: Border Patrol, Monarchy, Denafrips, Audio-gd, MHDT, Holo, Soeskris, Metrum, Schiit, Audio-gd, Border Patrol

5-15K: Audio Note, MSB, Aqua, LessLoss, Totaldac, Lampizator, Denafrips, Audio-gd, Resolution Audio, PSAudio, CAD,

15K+: CH Precision, Aries Cerat, Audio Note, MSB, Totaldac, Lampizator, Audio Aero,

audio.bill · Dec 4, 2017

sbo6 said:
Good stuff. It would be good to have a comprehensive list as the OP had started, maybe keeping it with DACs <=5 years old?. Can we add to this list as we discover more?

Up to 3k: Border Patrol, Monarchy, Denafrips, Audio-gd, MHDT, Holo, Soeskris, Metrum, Schiit, Audio-gd, Border Patrol

5-15K: Audio Note, MSB, Aqua, LessLoss, Totaldac, Lampizator, Denafrips, Audio-gd, Resolution Audio, PSAudio, CAD,

15K+: CH Precision, Aries Cerat, Audio Note, MSB, Totaldac, Lampizator, Audio Aero,

Border Patrol & Audio-gd both appear twice in the first list; and Metrum also has DACs in the 5-15K range.

R2R DACs 2017

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