"First do no harm." Oh yeah....

amirm

Banned
Apr 2, 2010
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Not sure there is a worse crime. While we vaccinated our kids, I must stay the seeds of doubt were planted in our mind regarding its safety. It is so infuriating to read about the fraud that started it all:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qBmJOlkxDEk

"Autism-vaccine study was 'fraud,' journal says
January 5, 2011

A 1998 study that unleashed a major health scare by linking childhood autism to a triple vaccine was "an elaborate fraud," the British Medical Journal (BMJ) charged Thursday.

Blamed for a disastrous boycott of the measles, mumps and rubella (MMR) vaccine in Britain, the study was retracted by The Lancet last year and its senior author disgraced, after the country's longest-running hearing, for conflict of interest and unethical treatment of patients. But the BMJ, taking the affair further, on Thursday branded the paper a crafted attempt to deceive, among the gravest of charges in medical research.

"The paper was in fact an elaborate fraud," the BMJ said in an editorial, adding: "There are hard lessons for many in this highly damaging saga."

It pointed the finger at lead author Andrew Wakefield, then a consultant in experimental gastro-enterology at London's Royal Free Hospital. Wakefield and his team suggested they had found a "new syndrome" of autism and bowel disease among 12 children. They linked it to the MMR vaccine, which they said had been administered to eight of the youngsters shortly before the symptoms emerged.
Other scientists swiftly cautioned the study was only among a tiny group, without a comparative "control" sample, and the dating of when symptoms surfaced was based on parental recall, which is notoriously unreliable. Its results have never been replicated.

But the controversy unleashed a widespread parental boycott of the jab in Britain, and unease reverberated also in the United States, Canada, Australia and New Zealand. Hundreds of thousands of children in Britain are now unshielded against these three diseases, said the BMJ. In 2008, measles was declared endemic, or present in the wider population much like chicken pox, in England and Wales.

Wakefield was barred from medical practice last year on grounds of conflict of financial interest and unethical treatment of some children involved in the research. The BMJ, delving into the accuracy of the study as opposed to its ethics, said Sunday Times investigative journalist Brian Deer had "unearthed clear evidence of falsification." Not one of the 12 cases, as reported in the study, tallied fully with the children's official medical records, it charged.

Some diagnoses had been misrepresented and dates faked in order to draw a convenient link with the MMR jab, it said. Of nine children described by Wakefield as having "regressive autism," only one clearly had this condition and three were not even diagnosed with autism at all, it said. The findings had been skewed in advance, as the patients had been recruited via campaigners opposed to the MMR vaccine, the journal added. And, said the BMJ, Wakefield had been confidentially paid hundreds of thousands of pounds (dollars, euros) through a law firm under plans to launch "class action" litigation against the vaccine.

[...]

The Wakefield study "was a fraud, moreover, of more than academic vanity. It unleashed fear, parental guilt, costly government intervention and outbreaks of infectious disease," he said.
Wakefield, who still retains a vocal band of supporters, has reportedly left Britain to work in the United States.

Wakefield and his publishing agent did not respond to calls and emails from AFP requesting comment.
Wakefield has previously accused Britain's General Medical Council (GMC) of seeking to "discredit and silence" him and shield the British government from responsibility in what he calls a "scandal."

The Lancet told AFP it would not comment on the BMJ accusations. Autism is the term for an array of conditions ranging from poor social interaction to repetitive behaviours and entrenched silence. The condition is rare, predominantly affecting boys, although its causes are fiercely debated."
 

Gregadd

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There are many studies challenging vaccines that have nothing to do with autism. See Dr. Gary Null. OTOH If I had children I'd be too afraid not to vaccinate them.
 

amirm

Banned
Apr 2, 2010
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There may be. But this is the one I remember. I remember TV stories where they would talk to mothers who collectively where refusing to have their children vaccinated due to fear of Autism. Can't tell you how vivid those images are in my mind. I remember thinking: how the heck do I choose between those risks?
 

RBFC

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The vaccines commonly given to children have been proven to be safe for almost all patients, with a track record of over half a century for many. Compare this record to that of a "recently-reported" panacea, which often has no long-term validation, no control/experimental cohorts, and little attempt to eliminate confounding factors.

This report reminds me of the "vitamin" debate that recently occurred here on the forum. Slipshod scientific methods used to establish a dubious link between causal agent and effect..... just plain wrong.

Lee
 

Gregadd

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The rise of certain diseases such as Autism and Alzheimers is confusing. the effect of vaccines in eliminating diseases like polio is is undeniable. OTOH it is heard to explain how a child who Autistic at birth was the victim of a vaccine.
 

Gregadd

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I don't mean to scare anyone. If you have an ongoing disease process you should seek medical intervention.

Here is what I am talking about.
http://www.vaccinenation.net/
 

RBFC

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The rise of certain diseases such as Autism and Alzheimers is confusing. the effect of vaccines in eliminating diseases like polio is is undeniable. OTOH it is heard to explain how a child who Autistic at birth was the victim of a vaccine.

Somebody looking to sell their latest book or to make a news-worthy name for themselves are all the explanation you need. I've attended national medical meetings for over 25 years and seen many presentations shot down for flaws in the methods and/or conclusions drawn from insufficient evidence.

Lee
 

RBFC

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Here's the FDA on thimerosal:

http://www.fda.gov/BiologicsBloodVaccines/SafetyAvailability/VaccineSafety/UCM096228#thi

Please notice that the EPA Reference Dose (RfD) for thimerosal has been established. Also note that the reported toxicities from thimerosal involve massive overdoses (compared to the RfD). So many of these studies pump rats absolutely full of the substance being studied... and lo and behold... the rats die! As I stated before, you can kill yourself with an overdose of water that is similar in proportion to the dosages used in many of these studies. Read with a cautionary eye, and evaluate the logic and conclusions carefully.

At any rate, in answer to public outcry, many newer alternative preservatives are being used in vaccines and other medications.

Lee
 

Gregadd

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The problem Lee is that there probably is no safe dosage of mercury. Just as there is no safe exposure of radiation. Ingestion of or exposure to any amount of these substances should be avoided when possible. If the FDA lacks credibility it is there own fault due to politicization rather than scientifc ignorance.
 

RBFC

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I'd agree partially with the "no safe dosage" statement, since truly establishing such things takes 50-100 years in many cases. Mortality/morbidity in the original study groups, birth defects and hereditary susceptibility down the line, etc..... However, you're making that statement out of your gut, not out of scientific proven fact. (Sounds like an audio argument, doesn't it!) Fear causes us to want things, or to want to avoid things, that are products of vivid imagination and worry. Not singling you out either. This is everyday stuff, just watch a few commercials for all the things you "need" just to get through your day without embarrassment or failure.

Unfortunately, everyone on earth is exposed to doses of stuff that is potentially harmful/fatal in larger doses. The flip side is that lesser doses may often have no effects at all, with our immune and inflammatory systems able to cope at that level. While reasonable caution and a healthy attention to medical and scientific trends is a positive, it also pays to not get too freaked out over everything.... that type of stress has been shown to shorten lifespan.

Lee
 

Mark (Basspig) Weiss

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As a father of an autistic daughter, who was completely normal before a series of four vaccines and who then ceased all speech within 2 weeks of that doctor visit, I find the coincidence too strong to ignore.
Just 30 years ago, the course of vaccinations for children was less than a dozen. Now the schedule is over 90 injections by age 12. We're filling our kids with mercury and dead viruses.
As for us, we're dealing with the embarassment, headaches and frustrations of raising an autistic child. Imagine having to answer to DCF investigations because some ignorant public school teacher reported your child as 'neglected' because they were unaware that your child's bizarre behavior was due to autism?
Amanda was showing signs of being a child prodigy at age one. By age two, she was reduced to a non-verbal near-vegetable. We worked very hard to rehabilitate her for many years. She is improving, but still not where 'average' kids are for her age.
I know there is a lot of conspiracy theory crap out there, but I do believe that mercury in the vaccine poisioned my little girl.
 

Gregadd

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Some things are necessary. It's not my gut reaction. I take the advice of experts. I'm not going to refuse an X-ray. I am aware that radiation has a cumulative effect. Mercury is dangerous. It was used in medeval times to make hats. Hence the term "mad hatter." I realize even for experts these issues remain under investigation and debate. I probably have mercury in my tooth fillings.
Going back to polio. It was sobering to see my cousin in North Carolina basically crawling around on crutches because he had polio as a child. OTHO when I did personal injury as a lawyer we got a Tort reporter from lawyers who sued because others had claimed to have actually contracted polio from the vaccine. Everything has a risk.
 

RBFC

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I would caution anyone who is tempted to blame a syndrome like autism on any one "consumable item". We're all aware of the litigious nature of our society. When there is a chance that we can blame something or someone for an ill that has befallen us, we are apt to do it. Linking cause and effect is part of human nature. Autism, Asperger's syndrome, and some other conditions tread the fine line between genius and mental illness. We truly do not have a complete understanding of why this happens. I do not say this to minimize the impact these conditions have on the families of those affected, or the individuals themselves. I say this as a medical professional of over 30 years with an 11 year-old son. My son has had 4 open-heart surgeries and is completely dependent upon his pacemaker. He is also mentally retarded, along with a few other physical maladies. I have exhaustively examined information as to what causes many of the classic syndromes, and to blame vaccinations for causing autism is a stretch. Mark, you're not alone.

Lee
 

Mark (Basspig) Weiss

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I still wonder about tooth fillings, myself, as since getting a lot of them done 35 years ago, I have been chronically tired all the time. I've had blood tests back in the early 80s to try to nail down the cause, but the docs didn't find any mercury of unusual quantity from the amalgam fillings, of which I had about 25 put in in the 1970s. Strangely, since the early 80s, I have been chronically tired all of the time, so much so, that I could not hold down a job due to oversleeping. Now I'm self-employed for the past 25 years and earning much less than I did in manufacturing, but much happier with my work days. Still tired though.
Autism is not a pretty illness. It leaves kids screaming and wailing like some sort of Islamic prayer ritual and it's disruptive to family activities. A number of people are driven mad by it. We've worked very hard with Amanda and she's making progress, but it's consumed enormous time and resources.
 

The Smokester

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Another example of an ill-understood potential health risk comes with the use of cell phones. For example, current statistical studies show no correlations between cell phone useage and brain tumors. Also, the frequency of rf used cannot break molecule bonds in tissue and the amount of heat deposited from cell phones operating within regulatory limits is regarded largely as harmless. So it has been largely accepted that the risk of cell phone use to the human brain can be neglected. Until recently there was no scientific evidence that cellphones could have any physical effect on the human brain at all.

A publication in the JAMA this week has changed that. It reports that "researchers peered inside the brains of 47 healthy subjects using positron emission tomography, also known as PET scanning, to measure the location and timing of brain activity by detecting signs that cells were consuming energy. They found that despite official skepticism that cellphones' electromagnetic energy exerts any influence on nearby cells — including statements issued by the Food and Drug Administration — it clearly does."

While the study in no way links cell phones with cancer or any other risk, it is the first evidence that there is any effect at all and has caused a re-thinking of the topic.

Here is a link to an LA Times article about this:
http://www.latimes.com/health/la-he-cell-phones-brain-20110223,0,4544944.story
 

Gregadd

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Given the incubation period of cancer it may be awhile before we have any empirical results.
 

The Smokester

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Given the incubation period of cancer it may be awhile before we have any empirical results.

If you are refering to the cell phones: Absolutely yes. That is the problem and prior to the above-referenced study we mainly had speculation--albeit reasonable and well informed--on why cell phones should have no relevant effects. This new paper concludes that is wrong and so opens up the possbility of long-term health effects which are not yet observable, or for which we have not been alerted to look out for.

In a parallel case, it has taken more than 50 years to resolve even simple issues for long-term, low-dose radiation effects. See here:
http://www.nasa.gov/centers/ames/research/lifeonearth/straume.html

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