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Thread: Help me beat my CD Transport

  1. #11
    Member Sponsor Addicted to Best! Elberoth's Avatar
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    Did you try the Ethernet input on the Vivaldi upsampler ?
    Adam

    Speakers: Magico M3
    Amp: MSB M202 / D'Agostino Momentum Stereo
    Digital: Lampi Golden Gate DSD only + Lampi DSD Komputer server
    Cables: AudioQuest WEL Signature IC / Shunyata Anaconda Z-Tron SC

  2. #12
    Here's the thing you see.

    - Ripped files can never beat the original disc. Because of the memory retention issue.
    (The rigging process being affected by the memory retention issue is the problem, unless you are prepared to spend something like 30 minutes to rip each song, the time being spend to clean PC operating disk, shut down and restart PC, rip disc once to save obtain metadata, then disconnect lan cable and ripping disc 2nd time to obtain noiseless rip quality and then copying metadata over while saving disc to the pc's harddisk, yes, unless you are prepared to do this, otherwise files ripped from discs will never sound as good as the original cd)

    - For the above reasons, it is better to make your comparisons only with downloads.

    - Digital files playback via a PC based program will always be compromised. Because of the memory retention issue.
    (Unless you are prepared to shut down and restart your PC prior to playing every track, then, maybe it might sound close....)

    - playback via a streamer (controlled by external app)
    This can be hit or miss. Some apps control retain playback memory. But if you can shut down and restart the app prior to playing every track, yes, maybe you can get it to sound good. There are also some apps that automatically discard previous playback memory prior to playing the next subsequent tracks. Those can sound very very good.

    I'm lucky to have found such an app that came with my very very cheap streamer which does memory clearance prior to playing every track. It certainly beats my esoteric-based emm lab TSDX SACD/cd transport in normal circumstances. It is very cheap. Are you prepared to overlook the fact that it is so cheaper to give it a try?

    In normal circumstances the TSDX will lose out to the streamer. When I said normal I mean I just press play on the remote or on the player itself. This will not sound good.

    To get the TSDX to sound optimal, what I need to do is shut down the player (from the rocker switch at the back, and switch off the power switch at the mains) to trigger the player to cleanse off all previous memory, prior to playing any disc. Then I'll power up the player again, insert the disc to close the tray. Let the player read disc and settle down. Then I'll cue up track 1 to play by pressing the skip forward button and play button in quick succession. This is the tricky part. The esoteric based player's button is not very responsive. If I press both buttons too quickly one after the other, the player will not register the 2nd command and goes instead into pause mode. When you press play, the sound will not be good. If the buttons are pressed too slowly one after another, you would have imprinted memory into the player, so sound is compromised even before the disc commences playing. This is the big problem with esoteric players. The button keying speed has to be "just right"

    Now if you have a streamer that is controlled by an external app control which empties out memory prior to playing every track, not only are you getting perfect play everytime, you are also avoiding all the inconvenience issue with disc playback.

    The only problem is the price is very cheap. Too cheap for some people to even contemplate.
    Main System: Sources EMM Labs TSDX / DAC2X v2. Amplifiers Sony TA-E1, TA-N1.
    Speakers Sony SS-M9ED. Cables Straightwire Crescendo and Serenade interconnects, Straightwire Serenade double run speaker cables.
    2nd System: Sources ELP Laser Turntable, Pass Labs Aleph Ono Amplifiers Pass Labs XP20, X350. Speakers Sony SS-M9ED. Cables Pro-Ject RCA CC Phono cable, Straightwire Crescendo interconnects, Straightwire Crescendo double run speaker cables.

  3. #13
    VIP/Donor [VIP/Donor] Tango's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeling View Post
    Long story short - My CD / SACD transport sounds better than my music server / file player. Now, I am faced with having to manually playing physical media. Please recommend to me a File based player that can beat my transport.

    CD Transport : DCS Vivaldi

    File based player : Aurender W20 with wordclock input from DCS Vivaldi clock. Output is AES / EBU (tried USB - AES was better)

    DAC : Vivaldi DAC + upsampler

    Please help.
    Dear Sir,

    Love the title of your thread. If I were an owner of American Sound, I would borrow your title and start a thread " Help me beat my American Sound."

    Kind regards,
    Tang

  4. #14
    Thanks guys for all your replies & views.

    jeromelang, right now, I am inclined to go cheap & good. Please do share your gem of a discovery & much appreciated. I thought I was done with the system & should just focus on the music but my friend played the devil's advocate & here we are.

    Mike Lavigne, thanks for your perspective but maybe I should qualify myself on my limited capacity to spend more money on upgrades. I am very happy with the Vivaldi & would like to find a component be it a streamer / file player / computer whatever to beat the Vivaldi transport while the rest of the replay chain remains unchanged. This means I want to keep the upsampler, clock & DAC in the chain still.
    Source : Aurender W20, DCS Vivaldi V2 stack + Antelope Atomic clock, Bergmann Sleipner + Benz Micro LPS, ARC ref2 SE, VPI HRX + Koetsu Blue Azule, Thales Audio Simplicity arm + TT + Benz Micro LPS

    Amplification : Gryphon Pandora + Mephisto Stereo or Naim Statement

    Speaker : ProAc Carbon 8

  5. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Jazzhead View Post
    Joeling ... Slightly OT , but would luv to hear your experience with the mighty Naim Statments !


    Jazzhead, I am not a fan of Naim mostly. Their power supplies & odd interconnect system has always put me off. However, after I heard my devilish friend's 5 series based system, I decided to acquire the Statement. We have the exact model of speakers. That was when the BRENT was USD 100+. Right now, with the BRENT in the mid 50's, I can only count my lucky stars that most of the heavy purchases are done. Anyway, Naim Statement - very articulate, very punchy & combined with the Vivaldi MAP1, quite nice (sublime actually). Have to bear with the break in though - gave me a headache literally when the set just arrived. I would listen for 1/2 hour and a mild headache would develop. Nearly sent the unit back to the dealer. However, after non stop playing music through my SONOS, things began to improve for the better. I think I am pretty happy where I am at the moment save for the fact that if I am unable to find a more capable file based player, then I would need to get up from my throne seat to change disc - back to the old way. Lazy person that I am.

    I am mostly located in Malaysia & this system is in Malaysia.
    Source : Aurender W20, DCS Vivaldi V2 stack + Antelope Atomic clock, Bergmann Sleipner + Benz Micro LPS, ARC ref2 SE, VPI HRX + Koetsu Blue Azule, Thales Audio Simplicity arm + TT + Benz Micro LPS

    Amplification : Gryphon Pandora + Mephisto Stereo or Naim Statement

    Speaker : ProAc Carbon 8

  6. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Tango View Post
    Dear Sir,

    Love the title of your thread. If I were an owner of American Sound, I would borrow your title and start a thread " Help me beat my American Sound."

    Kind regards,
    Tang
    Thumbs up !
    Source : Aurender W20, DCS Vivaldi V2 stack + Antelope Atomic clock, Bergmann Sleipner + Benz Micro LPS, ARC ref2 SE, VPI HRX + Koetsu Blue Azule, Thales Audio Simplicity arm + TT + Benz Micro LPS

    Amplification : Gryphon Pandora + Mephisto Stereo or Naim Statement

    Speaker : ProAc Carbon 8

  7. #17
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    Dear joeling,

    Amazing system! Have a good time with it.

    I have Rossini Player and also think that even Rossini's CD Transport is amazing. I can't imagine Vivaldi Transport.

    What about bringing the Transport or the whole 4 piece stack near your listening position.

    You can just replace CD's without even standing up from your throne

    Love and respect,

    Cagdas
    Digital Source: dCS Rossini CDP + Clock
    Integrated Amp: Pass Labs INT-250
    Speakers: Wilson Audio Alexia
    Signal Cables: Transparent Reference MM2
    Power Cables: Transparent XL Gen 5

  8. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by parkcaka View Post
    Dear joeling,

    Amazing system! Have a good time with it.

    I have Rossini Player and also think that even Rossini's CD Transport is amazing. I can't imagine Vivaldi Transport.

    What about bringing the Transport or the whole 4 piece stack near your listening position.

    You can just replace CD's without even standing up from your throne

    Love and respect,

    Cagdas
    Great idea !
    Source : Aurender W20, DCS Vivaldi V2 stack + Antelope Atomic clock, Bergmann Sleipner + Benz Micro LPS, ARC ref2 SE, VPI HRX + Koetsu Blue Azule, Thales Audio Simplicity arm + TT + Benz Micro LPS

    Amplification : Gryphon Pandora + Mephisto Stereo or Naim Statement

    Speaker : ProAc Carbon 8

  9. #19
    VIP/Donor [VIP/Donor] jfrech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by joeling View Post
    Long story short - My CD / SACD transport sounds better than my music server / file player. Now, I am faced with having to manually playing physical media. Please recommend to me a File based player that can beat my transport.

    CD Transport : DCS Vivaldi

    File based player : Aurender W20 with wordclock input from DCS Vivaldi clock. Output is AES / EBU (tried USB - AES was better)

    DAC : Vivaldi DAC + upsampler

    Please help.
    You might post this on the Vivaldi thread also...

    I to have the 4 stack Vivaldi. It's hard to beat the transport. Only on very well recorded hi rez files is it possible to consistently be equilivent or sometime better here n there. The recent Vivaldi Upsampler update out just a few weeks ago seems to have closed the gap again. (I've noticed the upsampler of the ethernet input seems to get getting better and better with each update).

    I'm using a Synology DS716+II, Apple airport extreme router, Transparent ethernet cables, and Western Digital red pro drives with 8gb ram in in the synology. Using Roon installed on the NAS. It's kinda a pain to set it all up and the NAS drive is noisy (have to damp the case otherwise it rattles and hums from the fan).

    I can hear the higher resolution on most recordings. But it usually misses the musicality of the transports...the recent updates to upsampler have again closed the gap. Plus I upsample to DSDx2 (Mapper 1 on dac) which also helps. I find upsampling to DXD (mapper 3 on dac), while more incisive, bigger stage misses in how the music is stitched together.

    We could also be hearing something in the mastering process of a file vs a physical cd.

    Good topic to tee up on the Vivaldi thread also I think...
    Speakers: Rockport Altair 2
    Pre & Amp: Nagra HD Pre & Amp
    Cables: Transparent Magnum Opus on sources, Opus Gen 5 Pre to amps & speaker
    Power Transparent Opus, Opus Source Power Cords & Opus Power Isolators
    Power Shunyata DPC-6 v2
    Digital dCS Vivaldi full stack w/ Transparent Reference XL Digital cables
    Phono: Grand Prix Monaco TT, Spiral Groove Centroid, Clearaudio Goldfinger Statement v2, Nagra VPS/VFS/MPS
    Racks: Grand Prix Audio Silverstone F1

  10. #20
    jfrech,

    Thanks for that. The dealership for DCS products changed hands in my part of the world so I have to go chase the new dealer for an update disc.

    I too am a fan of MAP1 but I did not warm up to DSDX2 though. Maybe time to test again.
    Source : Aurender W20, DCS Vivaldi V2 stack + Antelope Atomic clock, Bergmann Sleipner + Benz Micro LPS, ARC ref2 SE, VPI HRX + Koetsu Blue Azule, Thales Audio Simplicity arm + TT + Benz Micro LPS

    Amplification : Gryphon Pandora + Mephisto Stereo or Naim Statement

    Speaker : ProAc Carbon 8

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