sme 30/12 vs Lenco

gian60

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Apr 17, 2016
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One my friend has Sme 30/12 with Sme V/12 and Atlas
Pre and amp stereo top Convergent and Tad R1
Now bought also Lenco with a plint of 60 kg,all from Canada with Dynavector 507 and XV1T

He told me Sme with Atlas is more open and clean but he prefers Lenco because has more dynamic,more dense sound and sound seems more real
Also 2 his friends prefer this Lenco.

I will go to listen next days
Regards
 

Bruce B

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Apr 25, 2010
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compare apples to apples then it will be a fair comparison.... Put the SME arm and Atlas on the Lenco or the arm/cart from the Lenco on the SME and it will be apples to apples......
 

gian60

Well-Known Member
Apr 17, 2016
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Sure
The right trial will be this
Could be also change only cartridge the judgement can be different
 

spiritofmusic

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Jun 13, 2013
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And so starts the spectrum description of belt>idler
Detail and imaging>density and texture
 

bonzo75

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The dynamic and dense sound definitely does not come due to the carts here, because the XV1 is not more dynamic than the Atlas nor is it more dense.

SME might be a tad too analytical for him with the Atlas, and might need AT, Koetsu, Zyx, etc etc...who knows what his preferences are. Lenco is probably benefiting from the detail that XV1 is giving it and Lyra will too.

Another guy I know here with the Schopper TD 124 preferred it to his SME 30/2, and to his Brinkmann Lagrange, and PTP Lenco has been preferred to the Raven 1 and Verdier, so this is not uncommon. In Vinyl tough to make out anything from these moves. Lenco gives flexibility you can change arms easily.
 
Last edited:

Loheswaran

Well-Known Member
Dec 19, 2014
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One my friend has Sme 30/12 with Sme V/12 and Atlas
Pre and amp stereo top Convergent and Tad R1
Now bought also Lenco with a plint of 60 kg,all from Canada with Dynavector 507 and XV1T

He told me Sme with Atlas is more open and clean but he prefers Lenco because has more dynamic,more dense sound and sound seems more real
Also 2 his friends prefer this Lenco.

I will go to listen next days
Regards


I think others have made very fair points:
Belt vs Idler
Arm vs arm...

What I do think, nevertheless, and it may be a sweeping generalisation - but I guess this is banter - I find by way of analogy that:
Idlers - especially those well set up - are like a a Tom Kerridge Pub lunch - I say this as he has 2 Michelin stars
whereas you SME is far more like 'fine dining'

Each have equally valid palates that may satisfy you on different days in different ways - may explain why many of us have so many decks. BTW I have a Lenco, and have various DD's and belt drives (although some are in the process of re-capping and plinth'ing).
 

PeterA

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Dec 6, 2011
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The dynamic and dense sound definitely does not come due to the carts here, because the XV1 is not more dynamic than the Atlas nor is it more dense.

SME might be a tad too analytical for him with the Atlas, and might need AT, Koetsu, Zyx, etc etc...who knows what his preferences are. Lenco is probably benefiting from the detail that XV1 is giving it and Lyra will too.

Another guy I know here with the Schopper TD 124 preferred it to his SME 30/2, and to his Brinkmann Lagrange, and PTP Lenco has been preferred to the Raven 1 and Verdier, so this is not uncommon. In Vinyl tough to make out anything from these moves. Lenco gives flexibility you can change arms easily.

Ked, what do you mean by that phrase? Could you define "analytical" and do you attribute it to the sound of the SME, the Atlas, or both?
 

bonzo75

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Ked, what do you mean by that phrase? Could you define "analytical" and do you attribute it to the sound of the SME, the Atlas, or both?

Both together, and as I said, for him, because we do not know what his tastes are. When you find people not liking either, that can be one of the reasons stated.
 

shakti

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May 9, 2015
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I can see, that the SME 30 is staying on a HRS M3x? base.
Which in principle is a very good choice for the SME 30.
I recently had some experience using the M3x platform for my Micro Seiki SX 8000 MKII versus the heavy pneumatic Micro B-600 platform.
The HRS was more energetic in the upper range of the frequencies, the pneumatic has given more substance to the lower mids.

Now I have the Micro Seiki RX 5000 on HRS M3x, again, the RX 5000 is now playing more analytical and with more energy on the tops.

I had to put thin wooden couplers between the Micro feet and the stone platform of the HRS M3x to overcome this. Now is more balanced, but the principle stays

remembering my time with SME 30/II with SME V (9') on HRS , I was always looking for carts with some warm and energetic performance. Finally I used the Benz LP-S , which is a wooden body Cartridge.
 

PeterA

Well-Known Member
Dec 6, 2011
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I can see, that the SME 30 is staying on a HRS M3x? base.
Which in principle is a very good choice for the SME 30.
I recently had some experience using the M3x platform for my Micro Seiki SX 8000 MKII versus the heavy pneumatic Micro B-600 platform.
The HRS was more energetic in the upper range of the frequencies, the pneumatic has given more substance to the lower mids.

Now I have the Micro Seiki RX 5000 on HRS M3x, again, the RX 5000 is now playing more analytical and with more energy on the tops.

I had to put thin wooden couplers between the Micro feet and the stone platform of the HRS M3x to overcome this. Now is more balanced, but the principle stays

remembering my time with SME 30/II with SME V (9') on HRS , I was always looking for carts with some warm and energetic performance. Finally I used the Benz LP-S , which is a wooden body Cartridge.

Shakti, have you ever directly compared the SME 30 with 9" V arm to the SME 30/12 with 12" V12 arm? According to my friend who has both and has compared them with the same cartridge, they sound quite different from each other. He says the 30 is more incisive and energetic, presents the music more boldly while the 30/12 is more relaxed, more natural, more nuanced, has greater resolution and sounds more real. I think this thread is about the 30/12 which happens to be on an HRS base. Perhaps that same HRS base would have a different effect on the Model 30.

My guess from what I have read about the Lenco is that it might sound more like the 30 than like the 30/12, but that is just based on how others have described the various turntables. I own the 30/12 and only directly compared the 9" V to the 12" V12. The two arms sound very different.
 

bonzo75

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Feb 26, 2014
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Ked, how would you define the term "analytical" in the context of audio?

One that ticks off arrives on paper (detail, layering, dynamics etc) but does not as real and involving... Does not additionally have the cohesiveness, flow, tone, and similarity to the imprint of live in our mind, yet let's us hear the recording. Systems like Mike will transcend giving that information to make it real, while many will just give recording information without making it real, to make you say it's there, but I am not feeling it

Btw, this is not my assessment of either SME (which I have had only one flirting experience with and was impressed) or the Atlas, which I like, but can see why I would take Shakti's koetsu set up over it despite losing some information to the Atlas. Ideally I would want both
 

cjfrbw

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Apr 20, 2010
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Shakti, have you ever directly compared the SME 30 with 9" V arm to the SME 30/12 with 12" V12 arm? According to my friend who has both and has compared them with the same cartridge, they sound quite different from each other. He says the 30 is more incisive and energetic, presents the music more boldly while the 30/12 is more relaxed, more natural, more nuanced, has greater resolution and sounds more real. I think this thread is about the 30/12 which happens to be on an HRS base. Perhaps that same HRS base would have a different effect on the Model 30.

My guess from what I have read about the Lenco is that it might sound more like the 30 than like the 30/12, but that is just based on how others have described the various turntables. I own the 30/12 and only directly compared the 9" V to the 12" V12. The two arms sound very different.

I think this would be generally true, and is a good reason for using 12 inch tonearms on a SME 30/12.

The one thing I have discovered that I don't like about the SME 30/2 is the clamping system. It uses the washer to lift the record off the mat, then you basically by force use the screw clamp to push down the periphery of the record edges onto the scrolled cork. This creates a kind of zingy sound, as a lot of the record mass is poorly supported except at the edges, and I fractured several record centers with it. I also don't like the extreme force applied to the spindle. Thick records can barely be clamped down this way.

I now use a leather mat with a 2KG brass weight, which gives a much warmer sound without losing detail, in addition to adding some platter mass. I use a 10 inch arm, which I have managed to shoehorn on with correct geometry.
 

Bruce B

WBF Founding Member, Pro Audio Production Member
Apr 25, 2010
7,006
512
1,740
Snohomish, WA
www.pugetsoundstudios.com
remembering my time with SME 30/II with SME V (9') on HRS , I was always looking for carts with some warm and energetic performance. Finally I used the Benz LP-S , which is a wooden body Cartridge.


I can't be any happier than with my 30/2 with a Coralstone!
 

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