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Thread: K.I.S.S., the basics and the Sound Revalation, for me anyhow!

  1. #1
    Member Sponsor Addicted to Best! Hi-FiGuy's Avatar
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    K.I.S.S., the basics and the Sound Revalation, for me anyhow!

    So tonight I undressed one of my Maggies to fix a loose buzzing wire. There she is sitting there naked as a Jay bird and I am listening for the buzzing and I kill the other speaker and holy cow, where did all this bass come from. Bring the other speaker back in and reduced bass.
    You know where this is going, I check all my wiring and everything is in phase by colors, everything seems in order. So I figure what the hell and I switch the polarity on one speaker and Holy Crap, the heavens opened up and music rained down.
    I have always had issues with bass and was attributing it to the Maggies (older set). Well tonight I happily shut off the subwoofer!
    I also have been having issues with soundstage, which shouldn't happen with the Maggies, the speakers friggin disappeared and the musicians came in the room.
    I also turned off the Equalizer and have the tone controls almost flat!
    I have been listening to music for hours tonight like its the first time ever with an ear to ear grin!
    Now I will figure out where the phase reversal is happening.
    I know my system is not worthy compared to yous guys, but tonight I feel like I bought a brand new kit!
    Last edited by Hi-FiGuy; 09-05-2017 at 09:08 AM.
    Rega P1/Rega Phono Mini USB/Denon DL-110/
    Pioneer Spec-1 Pre/Pioneer Spec-2 Amp
    Magneplaner .5 QR
    Kubala Sonsa Anticipation Cables
    Pioneer CT-1250/ Pioneer SG-9500/Pioneer TX-6700
    Xonar Essence STX/Samsung DVD-HD841 Audio Only

  2. #2
    [WBF Founding Member] Addicted to Best! JackD201's Avatar
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    Do you use XLR's? I wonder if one of them has got their pins 2,3 reversed. There are phase reverse plugs/adapters that can be bought cheap. They are usually used by roadies in case they come across bum mic cables and are in need of a band-aid. It could be useful if you don't want to open up your Kubalas. Somehow I don't think Joe and company would ever make that mistake though. It could be a mistake inside any of the electronics. If lazy and not OC, just leave it that way
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  3. #3
    Member Sponsor Addicted to Best! Hi-FiGuy's Avatar
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    No XLR.
    I am going to use my Fluke meter and check the cables.
    I am going to check the cross over on the other Maggie and if those turn out correct that pretty much leaves the internals of the amp.
    If its the Amp ,the wires stay switched.
    I do not suspect the cables, but you never know.
    I do not know to much of the history of the amp.
    I have not checked between sources either, only phono so far.
    Will have to start swimming upstream slowly.
    Either way I am thrilled about listening to my rig!
    Rega P1/Rega Phono Mini USB/Denon DL-110/
    Pioneer Spec-1 Pre/Pioneer Spec-2 Amp
    Magneplaner .5 QR
    Kubala Sonsa Anticipation Cables
    Pioneer CT-1250/ Pioneer SG-9500/Pioneer TX-6700
    Xonar Essence STX/Samsung DVD-HD841 Audio Only

  4. #4
    VIP/Donor [VIP/Donor] microstrip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hi-FiGuy View Post
    No XLR.
    I am going to use my Fluke meter and check the cables.
    I am going to check the cross over on the other Maggie and if those turn out correct that pretty much leaves the internals of the amp.
    If its the Amp ,the wires stay switched.
    I do not suspect the cables, but you never know.
    I do not know to much of the history of the amp.
    I have not checked between sources either, only phono so far.
    Will have to start swimming upstream slowly.
    Either way I am thrilled about listening to my rig!
    If you have a Fluke meter feed a low amplitude mono sinusoidal from a test disk to the system and measure the AC amplitude between the two positive pins along the chain - if they are in phase you get 0 as the signals are equal, if out of phase you get 2xVsignal.

    Panels can be disturbing considering phase in low frequencies, as their back radiation self cancels bass. If your room or placement is very asymmetric you can have more bass at some low frequencies when out of phase. In case of doubt I always get the old Hifi News test CD that has a voice recorded in phase and out of phase saying "in phase" and "out of phase" !
    DCS Vivaldi 2.0 stack, SoundLab A1 Px, Forsell Air Force One, ARC Phono 2SE, cj GAT 2, cj ART monoblocks , TA OPUS MM2 IC's and sp, TA XL digital, TA XL gen V power cables, CenterStage footers and Nordost Qkore8's!

  5. #5
    Member Sponsor Addicted to Best! Hi-FiGuy's Avatar
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    Thank you for that will see where I can find the signal.
    Look forward to it as I love investigating things.
    This has been a issue in the last 4 rooms of large varying dimensions.
    Rega P1/Rega Phono Mini USB/Denon DL-110/
    Pioneer Spec-1 Pre/Pioneer Spec-2 Amp
    Magneplaner .5 QR
    Kubala Sonsa Anticipation Cables
    Pioneer CT-1250/ Pioneer SG-9500/Pioneer TX-6700
    Xonar Essence STX/Samsung DVD-HD841 Audio Only

  6. #6
    Member Sponsor Addicted to Best! Hi-FiGuy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JackD201 View Post
    Do you use XLR's? I wonder if one of them has got their pins 2,3 reversed. There are phase reverse plugs/adapters that can be bought cheap. They are usually used by roadies in case they come across bum mic cables and are in need of a band-aid. It could be useful if you don't want to open up your Kubalas. Somehow I don't think Joe and company would ever make that mistake though. It could be a mistake inside any of the electronics. If lazy and not OC, just leave it that way
    Then there is that part, if it is determined that something must be overhauled it will stay switched, otherwise I will not stop until that is determined.
    Rega P1/Rega Phono Mini USB/Denon DL-110/
    Pioneer Spec-1 Pre/Pioneer Spec-2 Amp
    Magneplaner .5 QR
    Kubala Sonsa Anticipation Cables
    Pioneer CT-1250/ Pioneer SG-9500/Pioneer TX-6700
    Xonar Essence STX/Samsung DVD-HD841 Audio Only

  7. #7
    Member Sponsor Addicted to Best! Hi-FiGuy's Avatar
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    Update

    So the update is this;
    The phase issue is in the amp or preamp, the analog and digital chains both are out of phase.
    Wires test fine and the speakers are wired proper internally.
    What this has done however is brought out the tweaker again.
    So these things happened;
    1. Simplified the rig by eliminating the Equalizer/Tuner/Cassette Deck. System is now Amp/Pre/Turntable/Server/Speakers.
    2. Verified and corrected A/C phase polarity (Jim Smith Get Better Sound) Thanks Jim!
    3. Rotated the system 90 degrees in the room
    4. Fabricated phase 1 of speaker stands that stand the panels straight up and put the center of the ribbon at ear level.
    5. Repaired one speaker.
    6. Measured and lasered relentlessly.
    There is only so much revelation that can be had with this level of equipment but I am here to say it was worth all the effort many times over.
    I have not shut the system off since and am having a blast. Didn't know this much good sound could come out of this equipment! All of the hyperbole, better this more of that, bigger, wider, less of some, quieter,expansive sounstage, noisefloor,blah blah blah!
    Loving it as much as I can!
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    Last edited by Hi-FiGuy; 09-27-2017 at 08:50 PM.
    Rega P1/Rega Phono Mini USB/Denon DL-110/
    Pioneer Spec-1 Pre/Pioneer Spec-2 Amp
    Magneplaner .5 QR
    Kubala Sonsa Anticipation Cables
    Pioneer CT-1250/ Pioneer SG-9500/Pioneer TX-6700
    Xonar Essence STX/Samsung DVD-HD841 Audio Only

  8. #8
    Member Sponsor Addicted to Best! Hi-FiGuy's Avatar
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    Can't forget a picture of my listening buddy!
    Attachment 35584
    Rega P1/Rega Phono Mini USB/Denon DL-110/
    Pioneer Spec-1 Pre/Pioneer Spec-2 Amp
    Magneplaner .5 QR
    Kubala Sonsa Anticipation Cables
    Pioneer CT-1250/ Pioneer SG-9500/Pioneer TX-6700
    Xonar Essence STX/Samsung DVD-HD841 Audio Only

  9. #9
    Member Sponsor Addicted to Best! Hi-FiGuy's Avatar
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    The Zone.
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    Double isolation Two stands, one amp, keeps them in the same place.
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    Phase two speaker stands, excellent results!
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    Rega P1/Rega Phono Mini USB/Denon DL-110/
    Pioneer Spec-1 Pre/Pioneer Spec-2 Amp
    Magneplaner .5 QR
    Kubala Sonsa Anticipation Cables
    Pioneer CT-1250/ Pioneer SG-9500/Pioneer TX-6700
    Xonar Essence STX/Samsung DVD-HD841 Audio Only

  10. #10
    Member Sponsor Addicted to Best! Hi-FiGuy's Avatar
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    My listening Buddy that got lost in the previous post!
    Name:  20170925_144028_1.jpg
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Size:  118.5 KB
    Rega P1/Rega Phono Mini USB/Denon DL-110/
    Pioneer Spec-1 Pre/Pioneer Spec-2 Amp
    Magneplaner .5 QR
    Kubala Sonsa Anticipation Cables
    Pioneer CT-1250/ Pioneer SG-9500/Pioneer TX-6700
    Xonar Essence STX/Samsung DVD-HD841 Audio Only

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