Jeff's Getting a New Stereo System

morricab

Well-Known Member
Apr 25, 2014
9,537
5,068
1,228
Switzerland
He likes horns and SET amps better, as do I.

I've noticed the cones 'n' domes seem to be converging and are sounding more and more similar over time as design improves... distortion, diffraction and other artifacts are decreasing, polar plots are looking better, etc. While voicing might be a bit different it's subtle variations on a theme and at this point most totl speakers from TAD, Magico, Wilson and on and on are all excellent speakers. I think horns and SET amps can inherently offer higher performance for many reasons. Of course there are always tradeoffs and ymmv...

Saved me some effort. I would like to add that what is becoming more and more clear to me is that what is missing with lower sensitivity cones/domes is the "breath of life" and it doesn't matter how transparent, revealing etc. they are...they just don't have it. It also doesn't matter if they are in the low 90s db and drivable with a SET...they still don't have it. It comes down to dynamics and compression I think but I don't have a definitive handle on it yet. Cones/domes seem to compress even micro dynamics thus smearing or blunting the scaling of these shifts. We can detect that as a lack of realism because in the real world the instrument just does what it does. Blunting or compressing at all levels is what I now hear in nearly all dynamic (ironic name actually) speakers.

Interestingly, one of the cone/dome speakers that I heard that minimized this issue was the original Wilson X1 Grand SLAMM. It was a true 95db and an easy SET friendly load. No Wilson since has had that high sensitivity or that easy of a load. it might been a bit ragged in FR but it was low distortion and scaled with ease and was very lively. Single driver speakers can have life as well, even without horn loading (my Decware HDTs have a pretty good dose of it) but are usually too compromised in other ways...

Funny enough, I got more "breath of life" from my big electrostats, which while being more limited perhaps in ultimate macro dynamics, didn't seem to have the same micro dynamic blunting and could sound spookily real with a simple arrangement (solo, duo or trio) at realistic, unamplified, volumes.

I hear the same microdynamic blunting with SS gear as well...although the best stuff is not too bad this way...just not as good...
 

morricab

Well-Known Member
Apr 25, 2014
9,537
5,068
1,228
Switzerland
Well I know one thing, I have never heard a tube amp that has the bass slam of a clean SS amp. Now maybe a large horn system narrows the gap. Maybe there are SET amps out there that excel in the lower frequencies. My 2nd system will be class A 300B amps w/horns but I will have that system for just a different sound than my DynAudio SS system.

There are SET amps out there that excel at lower frequencies.
 

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
22,643
13,675
2,710
London
With the right speaker
 

morricab

Well-Known Member
Apr 25, 2014
9,537
5,068
1,228
Switzerland
Jeff must have thought the components were worth buying, or he would not have written about them so positively, recommended them to his readers and then bought them for himself. Or are you saying he deluded himself, and as a reviewer who has access to all sorts of gear and time to evaluate in his own system, that he too is susceptible to price bias and assumptions like most people? I would be surprised if that were the case, but it is certainly possible. So he made a mistake with those purchases, he just wants change, he wants to create "buzz" for his readers by bucking a trend and then writing about it? Well, were are all discussing it and the speculation continues. He has succeeded in creating the buzz, at least in this tiny WBF universe.

I won't speculate on why Jeff bought what he did. He clearly likes (or liked) a particular kind of sound that I would call high resolution boredom. After hearing the Magico/Soulution combination many times (and many combinations of Magico speakers and different Soulution products at many different venues) a pattern has emerged where the sound is ultra (apparently) clean, ultra (apparently) neutral and ultra boring. In achieving this Ultra both companies seem to have lost something vital to music and I think it is dynamics and tone. Magico makes, IMO, one potentially great speaker...unfortunately it costs $750K...
 

morricab

Well-Known Member
Apr 25, 2014
9,537
5,068
1,228
Switzerland
This. To assume that someone like Jeff will necessarily prefer horns and SET's is presumptuous at best. Heck, he might end up with Magnepan 20.7's and a cheaper big SS amp, like Pass or even Bryston

No one is assuming he will prefer or go to horns/SETs. I would consider that highly unlikely given his published history...however, I keep think about the story from the Bible about the conversion of Saul...
 

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
22,643
13,675
2,710
London
I won't speculate on why Jeff bought what he did. He clearly likes (or liked) a particular kind of sound that I would call high resolution boredom. After hearing the Magico/Soulution combination many times (and many combinations of Magico speakers and different Soulution products at many different venues) a pattern has emerged where the sound is ultra (apparently) clean, ultra (apparently) neutral and ultra boring. In achieving this Ultra both companies seem to have lost something vital to music and I think it is dynamics and tone. Magico makes, IMO, one potentially great speaker...unfortunately it costs $750K...

Have you heard the ultimate properly. Wasn't impressed at Munich. Jazzhead heard them in a private set up, he has listed impressions on the forum, not that great, I think
 

spiritofmusic

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2013
14,626
5,435
1,278
E. England
Yep, Jeff "downgrades" from Q7 to Ultimates
 

morricab

Well-Known Member
Apr 25, 2014
9,537
5,068
1,228
Switzerland
Have you heard the ultimate properly. Wasn't impressed at Munich. Jazzhead heard them in a private set up, he has listed impressions on the forum, not that great, I think

No, I heard it at Munich too and was not overwhelmed...I think given design, materials etc. though that it has great potential...but what a price!!
 

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
22,643
13,675
2,710
London
No, I heard it at Munich too and was not overwhelmed...I think given design, materials etc. though that it has great potential...but what a price!!

I was impressed by the price
 

XV-1

Well-Known Member
May 24, 2010
3,619
2,629
1,860
Sydney
Sir,

Bose are very good speakers sir. I had the 901 when I was in boarding school. Now I only listen to the LifeStyle little cubes at home.

Kind regards,
Tang


That's why he should try them. He would be too chicken tho :eek:
 

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
22,643
13,675
2,710
London
He could have kept his SS amps and got restored Apogees got much less. Now he can get an integrated tube horn. But since he likes Devialet, his current sound is available for much less
 

Dr Tone

Member
Apr 24, 2016
52
4
8
He could have kept his SS amps and got restored Apogees got much less. Now he can get an integrated tube horn. But since he likes Devialet, his current sound is available for much less

Devialet wouldn't allow him to swap components in and out for reviewing. Unless he's giving up reviewing it definitely won't be Devialet.
 

marty

Well-Known Member
Apr 20, 2010
3,039
4,207
2,520
United States
We should start a pool to see what he gets next. The rules are you can only guess one piece of gear. Let the games begin!
 

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
22,643
13,675
2,710
London
We should start a pool to see what he gets next. The rules are you can only guess one piece of gear. Let the games begin!

Rather than the brand the guess should be for direction. Like similar SS gears and lower level Magicos, panels, tubes+horns, Devialet, Active, etc
 

marty

Well-Known Member
Apr 20, 2010
3,039
4,207
2,520
United States
Rather than the brand the guess should be for direction. Like similar SS gears and lower level Magicos, panels, tubes+horns, Devialet, Active, etc

Fair enough. I'm going with a tube in there somewhere. Ked, you'll love this- a Lampi GG DAC!
 

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
22,643
13,675
2,710
London
Fair enough. I'm going with a tube in there somewhere. Ked, you'll love this- a Lampi GG DAC!

Lol - too much of a turn from a Soulution Magico. I would assume that transition would take much more time ;)

Also, I think he might simplify his cabling, not that I know what he used before.
 

Lee

Well-Known Member
Feb 3, 2011
3,249
1,775
1,260
Alpharetta, Georgia
High resolution = high price?? up to a point perhaps...then the curve gets very flat for the most part.

Yep, I would agree with that. But the question is at what point? $50K, $100K, $300K?
 

RogerD

VIP/Donor
May 23, 2010
3,734
319
565
BiggestLittleCity
Yep, I would agree with that. But the question is at what point? $50K, $100K, $300K?

High resolution is not about the money,especially now.
 

About us

  • What’s Best Forum is THE forum for high end audio, product reviews, advice and sharing experiences on the best of everything else. This is THE place where audiophiles and audio companies discuss vintage, contemporary and new audio products, music servers, music streamers, computer audio, digital-to-analog converters, turntables, phono stages, cartridges, reel-to-reel tape machines, speakers, headphones and tube and solid-state amplification. Founded in 2010 What’s Best Forum invites intelligent and courteous people of all interests and backgrounds to describe and discuss the best of everything. From beginners to life-long hobbyists to industry professionals, we enjoy learning about new things and meeting new people, and participating in spirited debates.

Quick Navigation

User Menu

Steve Williams
Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator
Ron Resnick
Site Co-Owner | Administrator
Julian (The Fixer)
Website Build | Marketing Managersing