Bitcoin

Folsom · May 15, 2021

bonzo75 said:
Btw, if you guys need anymore motivation, Mia Khalifa recommended it too

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1383053816325496839

Wow, what an explosion of dog shit this all is... plus he's going to court if he keeps this up.

What's his message? That everyone poorer than him has to use a shitty inflationary meme-currency because only he's allowed to make products that irresponsibly use electricity - that the government pays for with our tax dollars?

Bitcoin doesn't even use 1% of global electricity. Sustainable energy is solving itself without needs for changes in Bitcoin.

bazelio · May 15, 2021

The last time I looked at the Github repo, the Doge "dev team" had not made a commit or add in over 2 months.

Ron Resnick · May 15, 2021

I really think it's hugely and surprisingly irresponsible of Elon Musk (and of Mark Cuban) to be promoting Dogecoin.

bonzo75 · May 15, 2021

This is going straight to 42k (work some bounces). The king is dead. Long live the dog

andromedaaudio · May 15, 2021

I think they should invent the ( George ) Carlin coin , the one coin that cuts through all the crap / shit coins

DaveC · May 15, 2021

I think it's hugely irresponsible for all the world's governments to allow bitcoin to exist.

Ron Resnick · May 16, 2021

DaveC said:
I think it's hugely irresponsible for all the world's governments to allow bitcoin to exist.

Now I understand why you dislike Bitcoin. Bitcoin is grounded in libertarianism. Your natural impulse seems to lean totalitarian.

DaveC · May 16, 2021

bonzo75 said:
This is going straight to 42k (work some bounces). The king is dead. Long live the dog

Previously I said $20k, but IDK if it'll dip that low.

I am getting the feeling holding any crypto that ends up going mainstream, and by that I mean a large number of businesses willing to take it as payment for something that actually has value, is going to be massively financially beneficial for the holder.

And I don't think it'll be btc simply because far superior and much more efficient options will replace it. But since it's an original people may treat it like gold, that's already the thing... it's NOT a currency, it's a "store of wealth". Lol. But there's nothing there! At least with gold you get some nice jewelry.

Then everything will be chaos when a breakthrough in computing power and/or AI makes it all a lot less secure than it is now. It's really just a matter of time. Potentially a lot less time than you'd think if things keep progressing as they have historically.

DaveC · May 16, 2021

Ron Resnick said:
Now I understand why you dislike Bitcoin. Bitcoin is grounded in libertarianism. Your natural impulse seems to lean totalitarian.

Not for most things. But for btc I think it's lack of efficiency and use for criminal activity is enough to simply ban it, and there are other social reasons such as the fact that we as a society depend on using money to function and and a gentle evolution rather than a revolution is far less harmful to more people.

How is it fair that some are able to risk big $ on speculative assets like btc while other can't afford to take that risk, and then their money becomes less valuable as the one who takes the risk gets richer. The one who can afford to take the risk is already relatively wealthy, so this seems like a scheme for some people to just keep getting much more wealthy WITHOUT CONTRIBUTING ANYTHING.

Ron Resnick · May 16, 2021

DaveC said:
. . . their money becomes less valuable . . .

In your analysis why does "their money becomes less valuable"?

bonzo75 · May 16, 2021

Dave is right to the extent that any investment has risk and therefore those who cannot afford to lose can't take it, so invariably rich take the risk and get richer. But this is not restricted to crypto and is same for stocks.

DaveC · May 16, 2021

To make the situation worse Elon Musk is making it so that if you bet on him with doge and he succeeds you will make a ton of money. It seems he's really trying to get doge to work and go mainstream. If he's successful it seems likely we'll see that $5 doge, or more. $5 doge is 10x, Elon succeeding is maybe 50/50... not sure any bookie is going to take those odds!

So, people realize this and are like, OMG, I gotta take this bet! And now EVERYONE owns doge because the bet is too good not to hedge against it... And Elon wins!

Ron Resnick · May 16, 2021

bonzo75 said:
. . . those who cannot afford to lose can't take it, so invariably rich take the risk and get richer.

In what world do all financial risks result in positive returns?

It is a "risk" precisely because the prospect of profit or loss is uncertain, not invariably profitable.

DaveC · May 16, 2021

bonzo75 said:
Dave is right to the extent that any investment has risk and therefore those who cannot afford to lose can't take it, so invariably rich take the risk and get richer. But this is not restricted to crypto and is same for stocks.

Like stocks on steroids!

And another part of the issue is many people may lose more money than they can afford to gamble because of the odds I postulated above.

And then old folks with cash-rich fixed retirement accounts all of a sudden have to reduce their standards of living simply because of this.

And then... (I could go on...) Look, these are some of the issues people don't consider, there are potential downsides to a society that uses competing currencies. Think about it. The biggest issue is the poorest and most vulnerable will be the losers. This isn't a positive trend. We're all better off when there is no poverty.

DaveC · May 16, 2021

Ron Resnick said:
In your analysis why does "their money becomes less valuable"?

IMO, that will be the inevitable result of competing currencies, and the rate of growth of cryptocurrencies has allowed those able to invest unusually large returns. As I said, stocks on steroids.

Again, the issue is the monetary system should reward those who contribute the most value the most wealth. Crypto is allowing people who have the opportunity to invest an ability to grow wealth without contributing anything at all.

At least in stocks you buy into a company that is rewarded financially for producing value, and as an investor, and hence part owner of that company, you share the rewards. It's a totally different thing vs crypto which does not provide value.

bonzo75 · May 16, 2021

Ron Resnick said:
In what world do all financial risks result in positive returns?

It is a "risk" precisely because the prospect of profit or loss is uncertain, not invariably profitable.

Yes but the poor can't afford a risk was his point. My point was that this is not a crypto thing

DaveC · May 16, 2021

DaveC said:
To make the situation worse Elon Musk is making it so that if you bet on him with doge and he succeeds you will make a ton of money. It seems he's really trying to get doge to work and go mainstream. If he's successful it seems likely we'll see that $5 doge, or more. $5 doge is 10x, Elon succeeding is maybe 50/50... not sure any bookie is going to take those odds!

So, people realize this and are like, OMG, I gotta take this bet! And now EVERYONE owns doge because the bet is too good not to hedge against it... And Elon wins!

This is how crypto will take over the world, it's becoming a self-fulfilling prophesy.

I forget who said it's irresponsible not to invest in crypto, but that may be true. If it is true, then everyone who doesn't want to financially cripple themselves out of principle must invest. Not too many folks want to financially cripple themselves, I think it's an insignificant number. So, everyone invests. Let me know where this logic doesn't work out!

At least for now I just made ~15% in the last week on doge and my 401K made about the same last year. So IDK about comparing crypto to stocks. There are big differences. Tons of people bought in around $.05 and it's now $.50, and that's in the last 30 days!

cal3713 · May 16, 2021

DaveC said:
Not for most things. But for btc I think it's lack of efficiency and use for criminal activity is enough to simply ban it, and there are other social reasons such as the fact that we as a society depend on using money to function and and a gentle evolution rather than a revolution is far less harmful to more people.

How is it fair that some are able to risk big $ on speculative assets like btc while other can't afford to take that risk, and then their money becomes less valuable as the one who takes the risk gets richer. The one who can afford to take the risk is already relatively wealthy, so this seems like a scheme for some people to just keep getting much more wealthy WITHOUT CONTRIBUTING ANYTHING.

Like with everything else?

The rich get richer, the poor get poorer, and no one does it better than the USA.

Zero000 · May 16, 2021

Buy now. Before it's too late?

Apparently it's on UniSwap.

bonzo75 · May 16, 2021

Best advice is to counter trade myself. When you expect bitcoin to nuke, it will start up to 100k.

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