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Thread: Input cables for Spectral preamps?

  1. #11
    VIP/Donor [VIP/Donor] microstrip's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ack View Post
    Here's an short but enlightening MBL pdf http://www.mbl.de/wp-content/uploads...lifiers_EN.pdf ["Using cables with power amplifiers mbl 9008 A and mbl 9011 (or any other high bandwidth amp)"], on cables, magnetic fields, wide bandwidth amplifiers and oscillation. The subject is much, much deeper and complex, if one cares to explore it.
    Ack,

    In fact, what is referred in this MBL pdf is not deep or complex, just very basic.

    IMHO the only complex part it refers is "Non-compliance leads to interference of radio signals from mobile phones and mobile phone masts, Wi-Fi radio waves, DECT signals or other RF signals." People should think about the frequencies involved in these interference signals and that the classical approaches are sometimes unable to deal with such high frequencies ...
    Under construction around a pair of Wilson XLF's , the Forsell Air Force One, the ARC Phono 2SE and the DCS Vivaldi 2.0 stack : ARC REF40 + ARC REF250, TA OPUS MM2 +TA XL digital, TA XL gen V power cables and CenterStage feet ...

  2. #12
    VIP/Donor [WBF Founding Member] ack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by microstrip View Post
    Ack,

    In fact, what is referred in this MBL pdf is not deep or complex, just very basic.

    IMHO the only complex part it refers is "Non-compliance leads to interference of radio signals from mobile phones and mobile phone masts, Wi-Fi radio waves, DECT signals or other RF signals." People should think about the frequencies involved in these interference signals and that the classical approaches are sometimes unable to deal with such high frequencies ...
    Hmm, I didn't say the PDF is deep or complex. I said the PDF is short but enlightening but the subject is deep and complex, meaning the PDF is basic but to the point. High-powered, wide-bandwidth amplification has many challenges.
    Sources: mod. VPI Aries 3;mod. JMW 10.5i/Ortofon A90;mod. Pass XP-25;Spectral 3000SL xport/mod. Alpha DAC;mod. Magnum Dynalab Etude;mod. Revox B-77II Amplification: Spectral DMC-30SV/DMA-400RS Speakers: Heavily mod. MartinLogan (custom Mundorf xover, cabling, woofers; structural mods);mod. REL Cabling: MIT Oracle 50ic,MA-X/Oracle 90.1 Power: MIT Z-Strip, Magnum Z-Trap; Shunyata Black Mamba CX HC cords, Typhon Tweaks: EAR Isodamp c1002 References: Live unamplified music
    System link WBF

  3. #13
    Addicted to Best! caliaripaolo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speedskater View Post
    Cable sensitivity is a sign of poor circuit design.

    * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
    As for high frequency instability, there are countless circuit designs that are stable into the GHz region.
    I'm sorry but I totally disagree.
    All amplifiers are sensitive to the type of cable you are using. But that does not mean they are badly designed.
    As for high frequency instability, first of all Spectral's are stable amplifiers.
    The particular design of the spectral, is based on a high transient response speed and consequently to a large current emission, as well as a large damping factor (stability factor, for instance, contrary to your assumtpion).
    The high transient response speed may cause oscillation, but the high damping factor reduce the risk it happens.
    It is like the F16 aircraft, it uses controlled instability to be more maneuverable.
    Spectral's design is recognized as one of the best projects on the market currently avaliable, contrary to be a "poor circuit design".

  4. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Speedskater View Post
    Cable sensitivity is a sign of poor circuit design.

    * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
    As for high frequency instability, there are countless circuit designs that are stable into the GHz region.
    Heard this before and it just doesn't make sense. It's like saying that even though bicycle tires are a no-go on a passenger car, the fact a Formula 1 racing car would tolerate the use of them even less is a sign of poor design?

    Greetings from Switzerland, David.

  5. #15
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    I have all Ansuz except Pre to Power and to Loudspeaker

    Quote Originally Posted by acousticsguru View Post
    Learnt something that I'd never heard before (surely not from marketing or sales) during a chat on the phone with the service department at Spectral: the input cable may be thought of as "courtesy of the source component manufacturer's" - in other words, of course Spectral-approved and/or -branded MIT may be used, but if the source component manufacturer has a preference for an interconnect to be used with their equipment, use that.

    When I expressed my surprise, I was told the requirement is to use a Spectral-approved/-brandend MIT loudspeaker cable with a Spectral power amp as a matter of course, as well as a Spectral-approved/-brandend MIT interconnect between a Spectral preamp and power amp, but that unless the source component were e.g. a Spectral CD player, one could use any interconnect on the input side of a Spectral preamp one liked.

    Experience has taught me not to believe much in "mixing and matching" (exceptions apply, other than that, simple combinatorics), thus figured it would be best to use the same Spectral-approved/-brandend MIT interconnect on the preamp's input side as from its output to the power amp.

    Now wondering, of course, who does this (i.e. use something else on their Spectral preamp's input side), and what are your findings? Experiences?

    Greetings from Switzerland, David.
    I have Spectral MH770 UL II for Speakers and MIT Shotgun Balanced from DMC30 SL to DMA 180. All Power Cables and Distributor are from Ansuz. I also used to run Shotgun from DAC to Preamp, but exchanged ALL except above mentioned cables against Ansuz Loom from C and Diamond Class. And it was a good move! From Preamp up to Loudspeaker I will stay Spectral / MIT, but the rest ANSUZ. Mighty good cables. Heavily recommended, especially the Power Cables. I also have Ansuz Diamond Class Footers under each component for resonance control: Wonderful! Incredible upgrade to my sound. Test it!

  6. #16
    Senior Member twitch's Avatar
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    so , is it fair to assume that if another brand of cable meets the same specs as MIT all is good with Spectral ? Is it not fair to assume the meeting those specs (resistance, inductance and capacitance) can be done so at not such an astronomical price ?
    Cheers - Dave

  7. #17
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    Ansuz actually is also astronomical in pricing. Guess that comes with industry and business interests: They make you pay for waht works (better). Material price in the cables is a fraction. You pay for the concept of the products. Ansuz cables actually even don't feel and look expensive. Expensive, but beautiful hobby we have with Highend... 😂😬⚡️🔌

  8. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by twitch View Post
    so , is it fair to assume that if another brand of cable meets the same specs as MIT all is good with Spectral ? Is it not fair to assume the meeting those specs (resistance, inductance and capacitance) can be done so at not such an astronomical price ?
    If indeed there were another brand making cables which meet the same specs - I do not know of any others that are optimized to be used with Spectral electronics (= designed to keep megahertz wide-band amps from oscillating).

    Greetings from Switzerland, David.

  9. #19
    Senior Member twitch's Avatar
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    makes you wish Spectral would fall under the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act ............. or does it ???
    Cheers - Dave

  10. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by twitch View Post
    makes you wish Spectral would fall under the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act ............. or does it ???
    I'm Swiss, so please enlighten me: that act is to prevent against "problems as a result of manufacturers using disclaimers on warranties in an unfair or misleading manner", whereas here, amps are advertised to be used with specific cables to be used as a system (I couldn't use another brand's accessories with my Magimix food processor either, to give just one of countless examples one could think of)? In this particular case, misapplication doesn't even pose a potential health risk to the owner, merely the product, and it's just a fact technically that one can't use wide-band amps with any type of cable. There are other brands that build wide-band amps (even if not in the U.S.), and the technical restrictions and warranty disclaimers are similar or the same. No one forces audiophiles to buy a wide-band amp to begin with if they disagree with the system concept. I agree MIT cables are expensive, but I fail to see how pricing would come into the equation. Needless to say, MIT can't be forced to share their patents only for some other brand to offer copycats for less. In short, what makes you think Spectral products do not comply with the Magnuson–Moss Warranty Act?

    Greetings from Switzerland, David.
    Last edited by acousticsguru; 08-23-2017 at 08:08 AM.

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