Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 11

Thread: Helmholtz Resonators vs. Broad Absorption? One or the other or Both?

  1. #1

    Helmholtz Resonators vs. Broad Absorption? One or the other or Both?

    Any thoughts?

  2. #2
    [Industry Expert] Addicted to Best! DaveC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Posts
    2,073
    They are for different purposes. If you have standing waves at a certain frequency due to unfortunate room dimensions a helmholtz would specifically address that peak. Broadband absorption is useful for reducing decay times in the listening room.

    Typically a room may need some absorption adjust how "live" the room is, or the rt60 reverberation decay times. This may take different forms depending on the frequencies you want to absorb. Helmholtz resonator otoh seems to be rarely needed but if the room has multiple identical dimensions it might be a good idea.
    Industry Affiliation:
    I own ZenWave Audio
    zenwaveaudio.com
    dave@zenwaveaudio.com
    Furutech Dealer

  3. #3
    Thanks. Some say broadband absorption is too much and kills aliveness of music. Others say Helmholtz approach it too narrow and doesn't take care of all the standing bass waves. Never know whom to trust. Seems like some more audio voodoo sh!t!

  4. #4
    [Industry Expert] Addicted to Best! Leif S's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    California
    Posts
    442
    The thought of putting a hollow box with an adjustable port in a room......I have not had good success with this at all. With the little time I did get to experiment with these traps, it just seem to shift the peaks to different places in the room. Pass
    Leif Swanson
    Vice President, Sales and Marketing
    Designer

    Von Schweikert Audio
    Global Distributor- MasterBuilt Audio Cables

    My System

    VSA Endeavor 5's, E-3MkII's, Audio Alchemy electronics, VAC IQ200 monoblocks, VAC Master Line Stage with Phono Pre, Kronos Pro with SCPS, Black Beauty Tone arm, ZYX cartridge, Lampizator, Aurender, MasterBuilt cables, J-corder open reel deck.

  5. #5
    [Industry Expert] Addicted to Best! Leif S's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    California
    Posts
    442
    Quote Originally Posted by Leif S View Post
    The thought of putting a hollow box with an adjustable port in a room......I have not had good success with this at all. With the little time I did get to experiment with these traps, it just seem to shift the peaks to different places in the room. Pass
    In all fairness, I have very little experience with these so I probably shouldn't have commented on this.
    Leif Swanson
    Vice President, Sales and Marketing
    Designer

    Von Schweikert Audio
    Global Distributor- MasterBuilt Audio Cables

    My System

    VSA Endeavor 5's, E-3MkII's, Audio Alchemy electronics, VAC IQ200 monoblocks, VAC Master Line Stage with Phono Pre, Kronos Pro with SCPS, Black Beauty Tone arm, ZYX cartridge, Lampizator, Aurender, MasterBuilt cables, J-corder open reel deck.

  6. #6
    Addicted to Best! Rodney Gold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Cape Town South Africa
    Posts
    966
    use a tube trap , it can do all 3 ,bass absorption , diffusion and midrange/hf absorption
    Its a pressure device , sits in corners and along side walls , depending how you rotate them , you either get diffusion or absorption or a combo of both as 1/2 the tubes diameter is absorptive and the other 1/2 reflects and scatters .. so you can tune the room as you like and get rid of the nasty bass peaks with a single device
    As you go up in tube diameter , the lower the bass you can absorb.. 20" ID with a 2" wall thickness can even work in the 20hz region. Portable tool .. you need quite a few .. google DIY tube traps for instructions
    Im busy with 12x 2.4m x 500mm tube traps to replace my existing ones and all my flat traps
    Roon/Tidal ..Squeezebox touch . Trinnov ST2 room correction...Twin Devialet D Premier amps , Vivid Audio Giya G1 Spirits .. fully treated room

  7. #7
    [Industry Expert] Addicted to Best! DaveC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Posts
    2,073
    Quote Originally Posted by caesar View Post
    Thanks. Some say broadband absorption is too much and kills aliveness of music. Others say Helmholtz approach it too narrow and doesn't take care of all the standing bass waves. Never know whom to trust. Seems like some more audio voodoo sh!t!
    It's just physics...

    Absorption can certainly be applied too heavily but it depends on the speaker and personal preference. I've heard totl Focals in a very dead room and they sounded great, other speakers wouldn't work out as well in the same room. And there's room for personal preference too so it can be hard to know who to trust, but that doesn't mean one person is wrong, they may just have different tastes.
    Industry Affiliation:
    I own ZenWave Audio
    zenwaveaudio.com
    dave@zenwaveaudio.com
    Furutech Dealer

  8. #8
    [WBF Founding Member] Addicted to Best! JackD201's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Manila, Philippines
    Posts
    10,703
    Quote Originally Posted by DaveC View Post
    It's just physics...

    Absorption can certainly be applied too heavily but it depends on the speaker and personal preference. I've heard totl Focals in a very dead room and they sounded great, other speakers wouldn't work out as well in the same room. And there's room for personal preference too so it can be hard to know who to trust, but that doesn't mean one person is wrong, they may just have different tastes.
    Trust Sabine
    Disclosure of Industry Participation

    Co-Founder and Managing Director PureSound PH - Exclusive Distributor (Philippines only) of Lamm, Von Schweikert Audio, CH Precision, Light Harmonic, Valvet, Townshend, Critical Mass Systems, EERA, KR Audio, Ambience SS, TechDAS, Master Built, Stromtank

  9. #9
    Industry Expert [Industry Expert]
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Deerfield, Illinois
    Posts
    4

    AXPONA 2016 with VonSchweikert and SMT Varitune Helmholtz Resonators

    Quote Originally Posted by Leif S View Post
    In all fairness, I have very little experience with these so I probably shouldn't have commented on this.
    Hi Leif,
    Great seeing you at AXPONA recently. Quite an impressive showing of the Ultra 11s this year. Even more impressive was the fact that you guys managed setup in one day!
    If you recall, last year when we demonstrated the VR-55 Aktives in the Burton Room at AXPONA (2016) we had a very strong modal problem in the mid-60 Hz range. The decay was quite long and dominated the bass response over much of the listening area. We had four adjustable Helmholtz Resonators (SMT Varitune V-4s) in the room located in high-pressure areas which reduced the problem significantly.
    I didnít save our measurements from the show, but you can see two examples below where SMTís Helmholtz concept were used.
    The graph below shows before/after measurements taken from the listening position. The target mode was 35 Hz. Note the reduction of the null centered around 35 Hz at the listening position and the overall broadband bass improvement.

    Name:  What's best jpeg.jpg
Views: 180
Size:  68.9 KB

    The video link below demonstrates the narrow tuning of the hatch to the target mode and the broad band result measuring with the microphone in front of the box.
    https://youtu.be/GjdACNPLzzg
    My experience with Helmholtz resonators is that they are extremely effective at reducing the high amplitude and decay of bass modes, without absorbing mid- and high-frequency energy, allowing those areas to be addressed independently. Just my two-cents as a fan and retailer of SMT products, including Varitune Helmholtz Resonators.
    Ron Lapporte
    Blue Smoke Entertainment Systems
    www.bluesmokesystems.com
    Manufacturer of Blue Smoke Entertainment Systems music and HT servers.
    Retailer for: Analog Domain, Avantgarde, Bag End (E-trap), MSB Technology, Harmonic Resolution Systems, Soltanus Acoustics, Von Schweikert Audio, Master Built audio cables, Theta Digital, SMT acoustics of Sweden.

  10. #10
    VIP/Donor [VIP/Donor] flyer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Belgium
    Posts
    307
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Lapporte View Post
    My experience with Helmholtz resonators is that they are extremely effective at reducing the high amplitude and decay of bass modes, without absorbing mid- and high-frequency energy, allowing those areas to be addressed independently. Just my two-cents as a fan and retailer of SMT products, including Varitune Helmholtz Resonators.
    hello Ron, you don't mention it explicitally so I thought I would do so for the following: the use of helmholtz resonators that have no absorber inside (like SMT), work effectively narrow band attacking the problematic frequency at once (if tuned for it properly) WITHOUT losing its energy!

    Quite a few brands market helmholtz resonators but normally they are stuffed with absorbant material, to increase the effective domain in which this resonator is active but as such greatly reducing their efficiency + they reinject much less the energy into the room, thus creating an overall reduction in SPL in the bass region wherein they are effective.

    IF the latter were desired, then this can easily be done with the SMT varitunes as well by just putting sheets of absorber inside but it is not recommended doing so. But you have the choice, which is great.
    Aries Cerat and Stacore distributor for Belgium, The Netherlands and Luxembourg - Tenor Audio and 432EVO Audition Center
    A few analogue brands are in the line-up to be released soon ...
    www.ultisone.be

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Acoustic Drywall Sound Absorption vs. Transmission
    By Robert in forum General Audio Forum
    Replies: 17
    Last Post: 04-13-2016, 03:15 PM
  2. Absorption from 100 hz - 2000 khz
    By Walnut Horns in forum Room Acoustics Forum
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 05-31-2015, 10:41 AM
  3. WTB: Shun Mook Diamond resonators, Giant or Ultra
    By bonzo75 in forum Buy and Sell Forum
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 03-15-2014, 02:55 PM
  4. Acoustic absorption under a platform
    By phosforx in forum Art Noxon Hosts A Discussion Corner On Room Acoustics
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 06-23-2011, 02:55 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •