What are the BEST analog systems to assemble for EXPLOSIVE Dynamics and Full-Bodied (non-fat!) tone?

caesar

Well-Known Member
May 30, 2010
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What are some the best analog systems (table, arm, cart, phono) one can assemble that can dynamically explode on hard rock and provide presence and full-bodied (not fat, syrupy) tone?
 

Nooshinjohn

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Mar 14, 2017
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image.jpg image.jpg
What are some the best analog systems (table, arm, cart, phono) one can assemble that can dynamically explode on hard rock and provide presence and full-bodied (not fat, syrupy) tone?

Can't speak to the entirety of your question, but I can tell you that I love my turntable setup passionately. It consists of a TriangleART Reference SE table(prototype) Origin Live Conqueror MkIII 9" arm, with ClearAudio Titanium V2 cartridge. Speed is maintained by Walker Precision and cables courtesy of Analysis Plus. Phono stage is a Pass Labs xOno twin chassis model.

The speed, weight and tonal qualities of this setup are second to none. I can hear deep within a recording, and hear things missed for years on other tables. My 1400 LP collection by and large sound as if I am hearing them again for the very first time.
 

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
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What are some the best analog systems (table, arm, cart, phono) one can assemble that can dynamically explode on hard rock and provide presence and full-bodied (not fat, syrupy) tone?

Since you have MBLs why don't you visit Greg Baron and see if you like his TT and Tape set up? You can then go from there.
 

DasguteOhr

Well-Known Member
Sep 26, 2013
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Hello,

TW Raven AC 3 Motors
Tw 10.5 with Lyra Titan I
on a Moon 610 or 810 Lp Phonostage extreme low noise...
 

JackD201

WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
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The combo I use with the biggest detonation factor. Air Force One with SS upper platter, Phantom Elite, Lyra Atlas.
 

Frank750

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Jul 8, 2011
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The combo I use with the biggest detonation factor. Air Force One with SS upper platter, Phantom Elite, Lyra Atlas.

Jack,

Have you heard the new Tech DAS titanium arm wand for the Graham Elite arm?
 

JackD201

WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
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Hi Frank

Steve, Jadis and I heard it in Hong Kong last year. :) Over all sound was excellent on the TD, Ch Precision, Marten system.
 

JackD201

WBF Founding Member
Apr 20, 2010
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That table is on the shortlist of tables I would like to hear before my bucket gets kicked...

Hi John

This forum probably has the highest number of TechDAS owners in the world. East Coast, West Coast, Europe, Asia. If you plan to make any visits let us know. All in all we are an obliging bunch :) Love the look of the "nude" Triangle Arts by the way. Lucky you to have snagged the prototype. That's a keeper for sure!
 

Mike Lavigne

Member Sponsor & WBF Founding Member
Apr 25, 2010
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What are some the best analog systems (table, arm, cart, phono) one can assemble that can dynamically explode on hard rock and provide presence and full-bodied (not fat, syrupy) tone?

playing LZ's 'In My Time Of Dying' Classic Records 45rpm single-sided pressing on the Herzan'd Wave Kinetics NVS tt, Durand 12" Telos Sapphire tone arm, Clearaudio Goldfinger Statement cartridge, through the new battery powered darTZeel NHB-18NS phono stage, on my big rig has got to be right up there explosively and dynamically in it's full bodied magnificence with anything......

at warp 9 the Herzan does allow things to get completely out of hand like it should.

YMMV, just my 2 cents, and all that stuff......
 

ddk

Well-Known Member
May 18, 2013
6,261
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Utah
What are some the best analog systems (table, arm, cart, phono) one can assemble that can dynamically explode on hard rock and provide presence and full-bodied (not fat, syrupy) tone?

You can't squeeze blood from a rock (pun intended) Caesar. Many, maybe even most hard rock recordings of the late 60's & 70's are so compressed that no tt/arm/cartridge can really bring them to life. I think the electronics play a bigger role listening to them and personally I prefer solid state amps for hard rock over tubes. I like my very old Linn Sondek for hard rock, just the right balance and with my other ones I find myself turning up the pitch to give the old records some zing; the LP12's pitch was always a little fast.

david
 
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Folsom

VIP/Donor
Oct 25, 2015
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I think good enough electronics (ha, sounds easy when you say it like that) will make rock to be very good for what it is. But I have to agree with David, once you put on something else that's done better from the same period you realize how much was left on the table with the rock albums. Sadly a lot of the remasters didn't hit the nail on the head so the originals can still be better excluding overall compression and a tendency to mute the vocals too much. Often it's about just finding the best mastering and pressing to help too.

For me, thus far, I'm all about non-belt driven TT's. I don't really believe you need the most amazing TT for good playback, but either the TT or you needs to make isolation between it and the floor on top of it being resistant enough to waves in the air.
 

DaveyF

Well-Known Member
Jul 31, 2010
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La Jolla, Calif USA
You can't squeeze blood from a rock (pun intended) Caesar. Many, maybe even most hard rock recordings of the late 60's & 70's are so compressed that no tt/arm/cartridge can really bring them to life. I think the electronics play a bigger role listening to them and personally I prefer solid state amps for hard rock over tubes. I like my very old Linn Sondek for hard rock, just the right balance and with my other ones I find myself turning up the pitch to give the old records some zing; the LP12's pitch was always a little fast.

david

Your OLD LP12 must have been a pretty basic model, without the more recent speed controls. No Lingo'ed model and certainly no Radikal model would have any issues with correct pitch.

IMHO, one of the problems with the LP12 is that it has been around for so long that people remember various itinerations of it, that actually have no real resemblance to today's current version (s) and yet they still claim various issues of this and that. Guys, about the only thing that is the same for today's model is the look of the platter and to some extent the look of the plinth... although even that has changed in subtle ways (no more ribbing). All else is totally different, including the sound!
 

ddk

Well-Known Member
May 18, 2013
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Your OLD LP12 must have been a pretty basic model, without the more recent speed controls. No Lingo'ed model and certainly no Radikal model would have any issues with correct pitch.

IMHO, one of the problems with the LP12 is that it has been around for so long that people remember various itinerations of it, that actually have no real resemblance to today's current version (s) and yet they still claim various issues of this and that. Guys, about the only thing that is the same for today's model is the look of the platter and to some extent the look of the plinth... although even that has changed in subtle ways (no more ribbing). All else is totally different, including the sound!

This one is stock from 1982, I remember having it Lingo'd and maybe Trampolin'd too at some point but I liked it better as it was so I had it reversed. At the time I only listened to rock and the slightly goosed pitch of the LP12 was very enjoyable.

david
 

Nooshinjohn

Well-Known Member
Mar 14, 2017
26
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133
Hi John

This forum probably has the highest number of TechDAS owners in the world. East Coast, West Coast, Europe, Asia. If you plan to make any visits let us know. All in all we are an obliging bunch :) Love the look of the "nude" Triangle Arts by the way. Lucky you to have snagged the prototype. That's a keeper for sure!
Thanks for the welcome. I live in Los Angeles, (Woodland Hills), and do feel quite fortunate to have this table. It looks better IMHO, in the raw than it does all blinged out. I might get the plinth covered in a Rolls Royce type of olde English burl finish, but other than that, it will stay raw.

As far as being able to hear that table, if you are local, or someone else would be, I would love to get ears on it.

Thanks again.
 

ddk

Well-Known Member
May 18, 2013
6,261
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Utah
Thanks for the welcome. I live in Los Angeles, (Woodland Hills), and do feel quite fortunate to have this table. It looks better IMHO, in the raw than it does all blinged out. I might get the plinth covered in a Rolls Royce type of olde English burl finish, but other than that, it will stay raw.

As far as being able to hear that table, if you are local, or someone else would be, I would love to get ears on it.

Thanks again.

Agreed, much more attractive in the raw than the blinged out chrome & gold version!

david
 

woodrand

Well-Known Member
Apr 3, 2017
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transrotor.jpg

I am extremely satisfied with my JR Trans Rotor Rondino Nero FMD. The free magnetic drive system gives me an amazing attack and musicality, even though I have a quite reasonable priced arm and cartridge. And not to forget the class A Whest Ref V phono stage... It provides a totally black background.
 

PeterA

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Dec 6, 2011
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View attachment 31859

I am extremely satisfied with my JR Trans Rotor Rondino Nero FMD. The free magnetic drive system gives me an amazing attack and musicality, even though I have a quite reasonable priced arm and cartridge. And not to forget the class A Whest Ref V phono stage... It provides a totally black background.

Great photo. Love the reasonably priced arm.
 

woodrand

Well-Known Member
Apr 3, 2017
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123
Thank you, PeterA. A friend of mine took the photo when we installed the turntable last summer. Only change I've done since then on the analouge side is changing Avid Pulsare II phono stage with the Whest. By the way, my dealer thinks it would be BIG difference with the SME V arm... What do you think? With the intern cables from Nordost it is for sure expensive.
 

PeterA

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Dec 6, 2011
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Thank you, PeterA. A friend of mine took the photo when we installed the turntable last summer. Only change I've done since then on the analouge side is changing Avid Pulsare II phono stage with the Whest. By the way, my dealer thinks it would be BIG difference with the SME V arm... What do you think? With the intern cables from Nordost it is for sure expensive.

I can't say for sure. I owned the SME 309 and upgraded to the SME V arm on my SME Model 10/A turntable. I noticed an improvement, but it was a long time ago and my system has evolved quite a bit since then. I did notice a big difference between the SME V and V-12 arms on my new Model 30/12 table, though not so much in terms of explosive dynamics. Both arms have that. The V-12 is just better at retrieving information and its extra length reduces distortion. It is smoother and slightly more natural sounding. I also hear greater detail and low frequency extension with the longer arm.

If your dealer has a demo sample of the V arm, I would see if you can borrow it for a few days. I do not use the damping trough, but the dynamic VTF does sound better to my in my system than the static VTF of the 309. I have done many direct comparisons and even tried combinations of dynamic and static VTF. I can't tell from the photo, but you should try to keep the counterweight sled as close to the pivot point as possible by adjusting the weight inserts if available with your arm. I also removed the finger lift because it is something extra that can vibrate near the cartridge. I just use the arm lift.
 

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