Vivid's new flagship Giya G1 "Spirit" launch in Chicago 11 Feb. 2017

caesar

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Another great strength of the G1 Spirit is their ability to get an even more stable and focused image. The background seems darker, and there is no longer that kind of "pump effect" I could have felt during the tutti and forte of a symphonic recording, that is to say the sensation of increasing the size of the sound stage with the sound pressure level. It was quite an obvious feature with my previous K1 pair, whilst it was definitely better with the regular G1, and now it's close to perfection with the new Spirits. The size of the sound stage does no longer vary according to the volume pressure. That's a sensation very comparable to the one felt listening to the best contenders such as Magnepan 20.7 or Leedh E2 Glass.

Another striking feature is the reduction of the audible distortion level that allows you to listen even louder compared to the previous Giya flagship. I did not remind of such low distortion level except my experience of the MBL 101E Extreme, or my more recent review of the Leedh E2 Glass speakers which could not compete nevertheless in terms of dynamics with the Vivid speakers. Listening to such difficult hard rock pieces like AC/DC's "Highway to Hell" or "Thunderstruck" at realistic (i.e. very loud) levels, the sound remained surprising sweet, resolved and "natural". It was really close to what you can feel at the live event when you are surrounded by this huge sound pressure without feeling any particular ear pain.

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he same impression applied to Sia Furler's album "This Is Acting" despite she often shouts more than she sings. If I can hardly imagine allowing my daughters to organize a party using my regular G1s, I think it would be nevertheless within the realms of the possible with the new Spirits as they behave on this musical genre as big JBL speakers: you have the sensation that you will never reach the saturation point. It's nothing but impressive. And many of my best friend had the same thought : "your kids are going to organise giant parties in your room !"
In the same time, and far beyond JBL speakers capabilities, the level of detail has also increased compared to the original G1.

View attachment 38656

Listening to Bruckner's fourth symphony performed by the Hamburg Philharmoniker conducted by Simone Young (OEHMS DSD recordings), on the first movement (allegro), the strings acquired unusual clarity and tonal density. We are more commonly used to hear the bows' moves than the strings vibrations on these symphonic pieces. It generally makes the strings sections sounding a bit ethereal and mysterious. But this time, instrumental timbres sounded definitely more natural than with my own G1 pair. The Spirit provided me with the sensation of having more organic and less ghostly presence, especially on violins. It sounded more like a baroque music recording and that was indeed very close to what you can hear at the best places in the concert hall. I am even not far thinking it was finally better than any seat you would have chosen at the live event.
That was incredibly accurate and concert conditions rarely met our highest expectations in terms of sound quality.

The Sprits' accuracy was also highlighted by the precise location of each instrument among the whole orchestra. Listening to the Spirits, I had the feeling that each instrument had its own exact localisation within a three dimension perspective. This sensation relies on the fact that each instrument seemed well separated and distinct from the others. At a certain point, I had the impression of receiving perhaps too much information compared with a more global listening of the whole orchestral mass. But at the same time, everything was perfectly organised in width, height and depth. This sensation of hearing so many details, without feeling at any moment some kind of chaos or sound disorder, has been a real ongoing enjoyment.

And on the most violent passages, I have been impressed by the possibility given by the speakers to hear so many tonal contrasts despite such increase in volume pressure. During the most demanding tuttis, the hoboes, the flugelhorns were always distinct, as well as the violins and the percussions.
That's so far a unique experience highlighting the key role of the speakers in the overall result.
Indeed, with a good but affordable amplification like the small Red Dragon amplifiers, the Spirit went far beyond what were able to deliver the regular G1s in terms of detail and tonal accuracy. They were indeed closer to studio monitors, providing me with an impressive level of information, within a more stable and solid sound stage.

In comparison, the regular G1s provide a thinner sound, with perhaps more air and clarity in the top octaves. It's finally quite a totally different proposal, more romantic with a less focused and stable soundstage compared to what the G1 Spirit can afford. I think nevertheless that the original G1s could also provide a bit more finesse for classical music lovers compared to the Spirits that are definitely more versatile speakers. And if I am completely convinced about the superiority of the Spirits over the regular G1s, I also believe the choice between the two generations of G1 could rely on what you are listening to. If clarity in the upper octaves is a priority over midrange density and bass robustness, then perhaps you could prefer the original G1s. I think it's important to highlight they finally are two very different choices in terms of sound. I could describe the G1 Spirit as a kind of hybridisation between the previous G1 DNA and the Magico Q7, summing the qualities of each speaker inside one sole design.

But that difference of tonal DNA between mother and daughter that I have been sincerely convinced of during several months turned out to be completely inaccurate.
That's an important fact as, in my opinion, it could be a deal breaker or a game changer depending on the nature of your floor...

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Indeed I have used on my wood floor during many months the rubber feet which are provided by the manufacturer under the crossover chassis. In fact, equally to the loudspeaker itself, you have the choice between the usual spikes and the rubber feet. You will easily understand that, when you have a wood floor, the rubber feet are a better choice under such big speakers. They allow you to easily move the loudspeakers and I assume they are so far quite neutral from a sound perspective.
It was also quite a pragmatical choice using the same feet under the crossover boxes. And I could not have imagined that vibrations on my wood floor would have impacted so drastically the behaviour of crossovers enclosed in their carbon fiber chassis.
But when I tried the spikes without expecting something special, I have been amazed by the increased quality of sound. At that stage, no particular argument or particular musical genre can defend the cause of the original G1s. The Spirits outclass them in all aspects.
I understand that in the previous versions, the internal crossover had a greater inertia due to the overall weight and stiffness of the enclosure. Obviously, the new external version needs a more careful setting...

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It could be also useful to provide you with almost a few words regarding active filtering capabilities of the G1 Spirit. Of course, the game become a bit more complicated, and as for the previous Nautilus design, you will need as many amplifiers as ways to be filtered (i.e. 8 monaural or 4 stereo amps). You will require also special speaker cables as you will have to use from the speaker side the dedicated Neutrik NL8 connector and from the amplifiers side 8 regular cable's terminations. And last but not least, you will have to acquire a 8 channels capable active filter, such as the Trinnov Altitude 32 used during the last year Munich exhibition.

According to Dickie's previous tests, the choice of the digital filter is a key issue. Indeed, Laurence is used to work with digital filters in order to benchmark his own passive designs. The passive external crossover used with the Spirits is said to provide better results than usual digital crossovers.
It's nevertheless possible to acquire the Spirits without their external crossovers, which represents a saving of $ 3,000 on the retail price. In front of that, it's important to have in mind that you will have to spend a higher amount for all the necessary stuff to go forward with the active mode. All things considered, the purchase of the passive crossover boxes remains in my opinion totally recommendable.
I asked Trinnov for a loaner to explore tis possibility, and having received from Vivid Audio the required speaker cables. Unfortunately, the French company had a very limited number of demonstration equipment and we didn't succeed in crossing our agendas. My second choice has been so far a less ambitious setup consisting of a Monacor digital crossover DSM-48LAN and 9.1 Yamaha Home Theater amplifier.
It hasn't been an easy task as the cable's color codes on the amplifier side were not identified and I had to test each driver's connection with a battery.
It was difficult in this case to compare apples with apples and the results achieved through this home theater setup and also with 4 stereo amplifiers (two Luxman M800a + two Red Dragons) were clearly below what I could achieved through the regular passive crossover.
My understanding is that this option could deliver interesting results but at a very elevated price (Trinnov Altitude + 8 good monaural amps). And the potential better result would be at some extent more or less directly linked to the possibility to adjust the phase response of the speakers in the listening room, which slightly digresses from the sole active amplification scope...

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Summing up, the final question could be: "are they the best speakers ever hosted in your room ?"
The answer is: "yes they are, definitely !"
Laurence Dickie has undoubtedly released another new state of the art benchmark in loudspeaker's design.
On all aspects, except perhaps the liveliness that was already very good with my own setup, they are objectively and subjectively far superior to their taller mother.

The salient feature remains the way they reproduce dynamics and transients. I have never heard something so impressive. And for all amplified music lovers, especially rock, they are in my opinion the best proposal I could recommend to audiophiles having sufficiently deep pockets, and looking for higher versatility of a speaker able to deliver extreme acoustic pressure but also stunning finesse.. But even for classical music addicts like me, they are fantastic speakers, and my new personal reference.
When I listened for the first time two years ago the very commendable Magico M Project speakers, after coming back home, I was quite disappointed by the sound of my regular Vivid Audio G1 speakers. Now, having the G1S in my listening room, there is nothing of the Magico speakers that could convince me to leave the South African manufacturer.
The G1 Spirit is without any contest a response to who was thinking Vivid speakers had not enough slam or not enough density in the low mids. Now, the Vivid Audio flagship has everything that the best competitors can deliver to their healthy customers, and perhaps even more...

Cheers,

Joël.

Dear Sir,

I enjoyed reading your posts in this thread. Thank you!

What is your take on Sterephile writer's conclusion that "...Classical piano, small chamber, and full orchestral arrangements were all in the mix the last couple months, and though they all sounded wonderful through the Spirit, the Vivid's attributes shone brighter with modern music, rock in particular. With a chamber orchestra given a lively recording, such as Rachel Podger's masterful take on J.S. Bach's violin concertos with Brecon Baroque (SACD/CD, Channel Classics 30910), the entire ensemble took on a lovely liquid quality, the trade-off being that the instruments themselves were not as distinctly layered in space as I've heard through other speakers. With this many musicians on stage, this layering becomes more critical..." ?

Also: "...In recent months I've heard plenty of pricey competing speakers set up to sound fantastic in a variety of settings: the Wilson Audio Specialties' Alexx, YG Acoustics' Sonja 1.3, various Magicos, and, for much less money, Rockport Technologies' Avior II and Vienna Acoustics' The Music, to name a few favorites.

Vivid's Giya G1 Spirit fits easily in this rarified company. If I had to draw a general conclusion, I'd say that, of the speakers mentioned above, the Spirits were more easygoing on top, while a tad less exacting in imaging and the layering of soundstage depth. ..."


https://www.stereophile.com/content/vivid-audio-giya-g1-spirit-loudspeaker-page-2

Thank you
 

Rodney Gold

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I dont find the spirits easygoing or sweet up top and the improvement in 3d imaging over the already holographic G1's was most marked..but then again I have not compared them to the models mentioned in the $phile article..
 

Joel

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Sep 13, 2013
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Dear Sir,

I enjoyed reading your posts in this thread. Thank you!

What is your take on Sterephile writer's conclusion that "...Classical piano, small chamber, and full orchestral arrangements were all in the mix the last couple months, and though they all sounded wonderful through the Spirit, the Vivid's attributes shone brighter with modern music, rock in particular. With a chamber orchestra given a lively recording, such as Rachel Podger's masterful take on J.S. Bach's violin concertos with Brecon Baroque (SACD/CD, Channel Classics 30910), the entire ensemble took on a lovely liquid quality, the trade-off being that the instruments themselves were not as distinctly layered in space as I've heard through other speakers. With this many musicians on stage, this layering becomes more critical..." ?

Also: "...In recent months I've heard plenty of pricey competing speakers set up to sound fantastic in a variety of settings: the Wilson Audio Specialties' Alexx, YG Acoustics' Sonja 1.3, various Magicos, and, for much less money, Rockport Technologies' Avior II and Vienna Acoustics' The Music, to name a few favorites.

Vivid's Giya G1 Spirit fits easily in this rarified company. If I had to draw a general conclusion, I'd say that, of the speakers mentioned above, the Spirits were more easygoing on top, while a tad less exacting in imaging and the layering of soundstage depth. ..."


https://www.stereophile.com/content/vivid-audio-giya-g1-spirit-loudspeaker-page-2

Thank you

Hi Caesar,

I have also heard a lot of good speakers.
Obviously the perfect one doesn't exist, so you have to point on what makes you enjoy the music.
I have no particular ideas about what has been written in Stereophile. Nevertheless, my main concern would be related to the reviewer's acoustical environment with so many windows. I cannot imagine having a decent stereo image in such environment. The second point is the quality of the preamplifier (home theater stuff), which is in my opinion another key factor for imaging. Third point of concern would be the choice of the Rachel Podger's recording that is not exactly what I should have considered to assess the depth and stability of the sound stage...
The only thing I can say is that in my room (which is acoustically valid according many loudspeaker manufacturers who have already visited me), the G1 Spirit are definitely better than the regular G1s. And holography is undoubtedly a strength of all Vivid speakers. For classical music, the Spirit outclasses the regular G1, that is already very good to my ears. Perhaps this is linked to a bad setting of the external crossover as it seems to work really better with spikes.

So different rooms, different gears, and different listening experiences can lead to different conclusions.
Nobody holds the truth, and something completely to my ears could have a mitigated opinion from someone else...

Best regards,

Joël
 
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caesar

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Thank you so much - makes sense.

Based on what I have heard - including the constantly overhyped Wilson and Magico, if I were shopping for a box speaker, I would take the Giya Spirits
 

QuadDiffuser

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In Stereophile’s review of the original Giya 1, the waterfall data shows undesirable resonance in the tweeter at 9.6kHz:
https://www.stereophile.com/content/vivid-audio-g1giya-loudspeaker-measurements

For the newer Giya 1 Spirit, this resonance at 9.6kHz appears to be suppressed, but with significantly higher hash above 10kHz (though it’s not mentioned specifically in the write-up):
https://www.stereophile.com/content/vivid-audio-giya-g1-spirit-loudspeaker-measurements

Even with heroic amounts of magnetic flux in the revised drivers which presumably provide a better vice-like control/grip on the domes, aluminum alloy will still spontaneously resonate undesirably due their low level of self-damping. I’m wondering whether Vivid will be further refining the tweeter by using a different alloy - specifically, beryllium? This should not be a huge stretch, as the technology must be quite mature by now, given that there are numerous transducer providers who make beryllium diaphragm tweeters.

https://materion.com/-/media/files/...acoustic-properties-of-beryllium_materion.pdf

A review of an OEM beryllium tweeter:
https://www.audioxpress.com/article/test-bench-a-new-tweeter-from-bliesma

Also, does anyone have any insight on whether Vivid will be introducing a “Spirit” version of the G2?
 

sbo6

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In Stereophile’s review of the original Giya 1, the waterfall data shows undesirable resonance in the tweeter at 9.6kHz:
https://www.stereophile.com/content/vivid-audio-g1giya-loudspeaker-measurements

For the newer Giya 1 Spirit, this resonance at 9.6kHz appears to be suppressed, but with significantly higher hash above 10kHz (though it’s not mentioned specifically in the write-up):
https://www.stereophile.com/content/vivid-audio-giya-g1-spirit-loudspeaker-measurements

Even with heroic amounts of magnetic flux in the revised drivers which presumably provide a better vice-like control/grip on the domes, aluminum alloy will still spontaneously resonate undesirably due their low level of self-damping. I’m wondering whether Vivid will be further refining the tweeter by using a different alloy - specifically, beryllium? This should not be a huge stretch, as the technology must be quite mature by now, given that there are numerous transducer providers who make beryllium diaphragm tweeters.

https://materion.com/-/media/files/...acoustic-properties-of-beryllium_materion.pdf

A review of an OEM beryllium tweeter:
https://www.audioxpress.com/article/test-bench-a-new-tweeter-from-bliesma

Also, does anyone have any insight on whether Vivid will be introducing a “Spirit” version of the G2?


Where do you read an undesirable resonance in the tweeter at 9.6KHz? WRT the tweeter, John A states, "The small wrinkle in the traces at 34kHz indicates that this is the primary resonant frequency of the small-diameter tweeter dome."
In Stereophile’s review of the original Giya 1, the waterfall data shows undesirable resonance in the tweeter at 9.6kHz:
https://www.stereophile.com/content/vivid-audio-g1giya-loudspeaker-measurements

For the newer Giya 1 Spirit, this resonance at 9.6kHz appears to be suppressed, but with significantly higher hash above 10kHz (though it’s not mentioned specifically in the write-up):
https://www.stereophile.com/content/vivid-audio-giya-g1-spirit-loudspeaker-measurements

Even with heroic amounts of magnetic flux in the revised drivers which presumably provide a better vice-like control/grip on the domes, aluminum alloy will still spontaneously resonate undesirably due their low level of self-damping. I’m wondering whether Vivid will be further refining the tweeter by using a different alloy - specifically, beryllium? This should not be a huge stretch, as the technology must be quite mature by now, given that there are numerous transducer providers who make beryllium diaphragm tweeters.

https://materion.com/-/media/files/...acoustic-properties-of-beryllium_materion.pdf

A review of an OEM beryllium tweeter:
https://www.audioxpress.com/article/test-bench-a-new-tweeter-from-bliesma

Also, does anyone have any insight on whether Vivid will be introducing a “Spirit” version of the G2?


Can you point to where you read there is an undesirable resonance in the tweeter at 9.6KHz? WRT the tweeter John A states, "The small wrinkle in the traces at 34kHz indicates that this is the primary resonant frequency of the small-diameter tweeter dome."
 

QuadDiffuser

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For the older Giya 1's waterfall chart (in the measurement section of Stereophile magazine’s review), the "+" cursor is placed at 9.6kHz (just before 10kHz) where the aforementioned hash is seen.

For the newer Giya 1 Spirit's waterfall chart, the cursor is placed at 5.812 kHz where a relatively slower decay velocity can be seen; plus there is a significant amount of hash above 10kHz, indicative of ultrasonic resonance. In fact, they extend well into 1.35msec on the time axis. I don’t necessarily agree with the reviewer that the Spirit’s waterfall plot is cleaner than its predecessor’s.

Curious to see to what extent the substitution of aluminum alloy with beryllium for the higher frequency domes will further elevate the "merely" excellent performance of these transducers!
 
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I know that Laurence Dickie was v curiuos about Berylium tweeters. But I don't think they ever progressed any further with production units.
 

sbo6

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Now I understand, you are interpreting the waterfall yourself as there is no comment from John about any ~10KHz resonance. Curious why you believe the graph indicates a resonance when there was no mention from John?
 

QuadDiffuser

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Now I understand, you are interpreting the waterfall yourself as there is no comment from John about any ~10KHz resonance. Curious why you believe the graph indicates a resonance when there was no mention from John?
It’s plain to see on the waterfall graph, isn’t it?
 

sbo6

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I don't pretend to be an acoustic engineer or professional speaker builder but no, I don't interpret it as a resonance and apparently John Atkinson did not either. I will say this - I have heard the Vivid Audio Giya G1s and the experience was so positive it drove me to purchase Giya G2 S2s. I heard in that listening session and hear in my room no such resonance, not that there would be much to hear at 10KHz anyway since there is little musical information at that frequency and above.
 

Stereoeditor

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For the older Giya 1's waterfall chart (in the measurement section of Stereophile magazine’s review), the "+" cursor is placed at 9.6kHz (just before 10kHz) where the aforementioned hash is seen.

I don't think this mode is due to the tweeter. As I write in the review, "There is a low-level mode evident at 9.6kHz, which I imagine is the upper-midrange unit's primary dome resonance after it has been suppressed by the crossover's steep low-pass filter..." https://www.stereophile.com/content/vivid-audio-g1giya-loudspeaker-measurements

John Atkinson
Technical Editor, Stereophile
 
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sbo6

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Thanks for the clarification, John.
 
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QuadDiffuser

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I’m mightily impressed by the Giya 1’s performance, but I’m simply wishing for some engineering improvements in the next iteration, and not going to compete in this contest of selective denials - regardless of the numerous subjective interpretations, “mentioned in the review” (or not), the resonances are plain to see in the waterfall graphs. Looking forward to auditioning the next-generation Vivid drivers incorporating even better transducer domes with improved self-damping characteristics!
 
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QuadDiffuser

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With the prevalence of handheld devices having limited screen space, I've attached two images from the Stereophile reviews (Giya 1: 2010-Jul, and Giya 1 Spirit: 2017-Dec) for easier viewing and comparison. The first graph of the older Giya 1 shows the cursor at 9.632kHz; the second graph of the newer Spirits shows the cursor at 5.812kHz, as well as the substantial hash at ~9kHz (and above). I rest my case!

Vivid Giya 1 - 2010_Jul.JPG Vivid Giya 1 Spirit - 2017_Dec.JPG
 
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lscangus

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With the prevalence of handheld devices having limited screen space, I've attached two images from the Stereophile reviews (Giya 1: 2010-Jul, and Giya 1 Spirit: 2017-Dec) for easier viewing and comparison. The first graph of the older Giya 1 shows the cursor at 9.632kHz; the second graph of the newer Spirits shows the cursor at 5.812kHz, as well as the substantial hash at ~9kHz (and above). I rest my case!

View attachment 56650 View attachment 56651
Thank you for your insight. Can the environment where the measurement took place create this kind of harshness? As far as I understand, the G1 Spirit's measurement was not done in a lab. The G1 and G1S shares the same drivers, what can causes the hash on the G1S but not the G1?
 

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