Lampi GG 512dsd + 44k + 48k superclocks + RTR PCM + KR242 + grounding post + SGM server----

bibo01 · Jan 11, 2017

http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews2/lampizator/3.html
As shown in 6Moons review, in Lampizator Golden Gate's DSD it appears to be a sanded chip.
Rumors say that it's an AK4490 used as pass-through for DSD.

opus112 · Jan 12, 2017

Can't be an AK4490 as the package is wrong - the picture shows SSOP28 but the AK is in a square LQFP48. But it definitely is not any kind of logic gate, that's most certainly a DAC chip of some kind.

Comedus76 · Jan 12, 2017

From Page 1 of the 6moons review:
"In his DSD engine, ?ukasz Fikus uses no standard converter chip to process the signal. In fact, there’s no chip at all. Digital-to-analog conversion is handled exclusively with a filter developed by Herr LampizatOr himself. What we know is that he uses passive parts without data manipulation, hence no sigma-delta modulators or upsamplers. As such, the DSD signal path is most minimal. It consists of a USB receiver, passive filtration with nearby power regulation and an analogue section. I know of no outfit which handles DSD in more purist fashion."

Now I'm really confused. The earlier post said that the DSD is chip based, the following post said that it is "DAC-chipless"; this reviewer says that "there's no chip at all" and he uses only passive parts without any sigma-delta modulators but from the pics you guys can see some sort of DAC chip.

Would love to get a more definitive answer.

opus112 said:
Can't be an AK4490 as the package is wrong - the picture shows SSOP28 but the AK is in a square LQFP48. But it definitely is not any kind of logic gate, that's most certainly a DAC chip of some kind.

opus112 · Jan 12, 2017

Comedus76 said:
"In his DSD engine, ?ukasz Fikus uses no standard converter chip to process the signal. In fact, there’s no chip at all........"

If there's no chip at all, why go to the trouble of sanding it down?

Another piece of corroborating detail which supports the conclusion its a DAC chip is the presence of the daughter board sporting an AT Mega328 microcontroller. This is almost sure to be used to communicate configuration data to the DAC over SPI or I2C buses.

<later edit> Having studied a few datasheets and looking at which traces carry the audio outputs, I'm now fairly sure which DAC chip it is - CS4398 from Cirrus.

wisnon · Jan 12, 2017

Comedus76 said:
Well, posts #121 and #124 pointed to some chip in the DSD section. I have no idea what it does - that's what I'm trying to understand. My I/V converter assumption appears wrong.

There are all kinds of chips that are not Dac chips in electronics. Said elaborate filter box, thus there will be componentry i.e. some OTHER types of chips.
If there is electronics involved then you will have some kind of "chips" involved...they don't have to be dac chips for DSD. That is the point.

wisnon · Jan 12, 2017

bibo01 said:
http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews2/lampizator/3.html
As shown in 6Moons review, in Lampizator Golden Gate's DSD it appears to be a sanded chip.
Rumors say that it's an AK4490 used as pass-through for DSD.

No, there is no Dac chip, no AK anything. No pass thru. DSD is handled by a separate engine.

wisnon · Jan 12, 2017

Comedus76 said:
From Page 1 of the 6moons review:
"In his DSD engine, ?ukasz Fikus uses no standard converter chip to process the signal. In fact, there’s no chip at all. Digital-to-analog conversion is handled exclusively with a filter developed by Herr LampizatOr himself. What we know is that he uses passive parts without data manipulation, hence no sigma-delta modulators or upsamplers. As such, the DSD signal path is most minimal. It consists of a USB receiver, passive filtration with nearby power regulation and an analogue section. I know of no outfit which handles DSD in more purist fashion."

Now I'm really confused. The earlier post said that the DSD is chip based, the following post said that it is "DAC-chipless"; this reviewer says that "there's no chip at all" and he uses only passive parts without any sigma-delta modulators but from the pics you guys can see some sort of DAC chip.

Would love to get a more definitive answer.

Lampi is 2 dac engines in one box. the PCM part in the GG was delta sigma at one point and is now r2r. The sanded chip in that first get GG was for PCM only. All Lampi owners know this. It is a distinguishing feature...2 days in one box.

RubenV. · Jan 12, 2017

Some feedback from my side regarding the DSD512 engine. I have a Golden Gate which does have the superclocks and DS512 engine, but also has the older basic PCM engine. When I bought the GG I used my dual streamer setup with JPlay (streaming Tidal through ASIObridge towards JPlay). I connect as follows, dual streamers > PPA DDC (with its own linear psu)> SPDIF into the GG selecting the “old” pcm engine. This sounded already very very good. After the past two weeks I’ve been updating the dual streamers in order to use HQPlayer to upsample the Tidal stream to DSD512. After some setbacks (equipment broke down) I am now using the audio pc (with the new Jplay femto usb card and full linear psu) as NAA and my regular desktop pc to run HQPlayer. This already sound as good as the previous test on the PCM engine. With upsampeling to DSD512 I get far more details and depth. Because of the use of the a regular desktop (noisy), and the lack of the PPA DDC in the chain it is too early to draw conclusions. I will not use the DDC in the future because it can’t pass on DSD512. I’ve ordered the newest Sablon Audio usb cable (data only) which will arrive probably tomorrow and I hope to find some time this weekend to get the control pc (upgraded with a 6700K) working again, since the pico psu might not be powerfull enough. From previous experiences with the dualstreamer setup (which entails its own LAN mini network, without any other interfering gear on it) it made a big difference. When that’s working I can also run AO on the control pc which also has a big impact on SQ. So I am looking forward to get everything up and running again. That will give the best impression of the capabilities regarding DSD512. However, I already got an idea of the potential it has.

bonzo75 · Jan 12, 2017

Hi, I am selling my KR 274b. This rectifier valve is for sale at 182 EUR. KR would additionally charge you tax (usually 20%), bank charge, and postage. Postage is free from me in EU and UK but I will charge elsewhere.

Hardly used since I don't have speakers to play. In the Lampi we preferred it much more to the EML recti

RubenV. · Jan 12, 2017

bonzo75 said:
Hi, I am selling my KR 274b. This rectifier valve is for sale at 182 EUR. KR would additionally charge you tax (usually 20%), bank charge, and postage. Postage is free from me in EU and UK but I will charge elsewhere.

Hardly used since I don't have speakers to play. In the Lampi we preferred it much more to the EML recti

Could you describe the differences tween the KR and EML (and also which EML is used)? I might be interested, but I have to check which EML I am using at the moment. Is there something else to check wether I could use this KR on my GG?

bonzo75 · Jan 12, 2017

RubenV. said:
Could you describe the differences tween the KR and EML (and also which EML is used)? I might be interested, but I have to check which EML I am using at the moment. Is there something else to check wether I could use this KR on my GG?

Hi I had the EML 5u4g mesh, and Bill had the 274b mesh. All, including the KR rectis, work on the Lampi.

The difference is the KR is punchier, more bass and dynamics. I found it better and sold my EML. Now I have the special Lampi KR recti which is even better, hence selling this. Only a few rectifiers were made for Lampi by KR and so they are unobtanium, I got one of my distributor.

Comedus76 · Jan 12, 2017

Thank you. My questions aren't just academic in nature - I have an Atlantic (the spec sheet for it says PCM R2R and DSD R2R) which I'm looking to upgrade to the Golden Atlantic (the Big 7 or GG don't fit size-wise in my environment). I'm trying to make a decision on whether to add the DSD512 option (extra Eur 1000 which is not an insignificant addition). I want to understand in detail how Lampi handles DSD in general and what is the nature of difference between the regular DSD256 implementation and the 512 upgrade (which you explained earlier - thanks!). I think your post above suggests the following:
- there are no sigma-delta "DAC" chips in the GG/GA; the confusion above might be related to the earlier GG having the sanded "DAC chip" for PCM and the newer GA/GG having R2R PCM (no longer requiring the sigma delta chips like AK..., BB...., etc)
- the DSD (both 256 and 512) low pass filter contains "chips" as part of the filter network but this is not a "DAC" chip; the chip(s) in the filter box are doing "something" that is part of the filter network
- the DSD 512 board is separate with upgraded parts and also dedicated without relying on the R2R ladder for somethings; that is the difference between the regular 256 and the 512 upgrade.
Is my understanding now correct? Thanks again for indulging my questions.

wisnon said:
Lampi is 2 dac engines in one box. the PCM part in the GG was delta sigma at one point and is now r2r. The sanded chip in that first get GG was for PCM only. All Lampi owners know this. It is a distinguishing feature...2 days in one box.

wisnon · Jan 12, 2017

Comedus76 said:
Thank you. My questions aren't just academic in nature - I have an Atlantic (the spec sheet for it says PCM R2R and DSD R2R) which I'm looking to upgrade to the Golden Atlantic (the Big 7 or GG don't fit size-wise in my environment). I'm trying to make a decision on whether to add the DSD512 option (extra Eur 1000 which is not an insignificant addition). I want to understand in detail how Lampi handles DSD in general and what is the nature of difference between the regular DSD256 implementation and the 512 upgrade (which you explained earlier - thanks!). I think your post above suggests the following:
- there are no sigma-delta "DAC" chips in the GG/GA; the confusion above might be related to the earlier GG having the sanded "DAC chip" for PCM and the newer GA/GG having R2R PCM (no longer requiring the sigma delta chips like AK..., BB...., etc)
- the DSD (both 256 and 512) low pass filter contains "chips" as part of the filter network but this is not a "DAC" chip; the chip(s) in the filter box are doing "something" that is part of the filter network
- the DSD 512 board is separate with upgraded parts and also dedicated without relying on the R2R ladder for somethings; that is the difference between the regular 256 and the 512 upgrade.
Is my understanding now correct? Thanks again for indulging my questions.

Perfectly correct.

The separate DSD512 engine can also obviously handle higher clock sppeds ass it has its own dedicated infrastructure.

Where to get the 512 module? Are you a DSD lover and also want to future proof, my answer is a resounding YES!!!

The DSD256 R2R offshoot module is good...the separate 512 module is outstanding. To me the difference is NOT subtle. A must for any DSD enthusiast. The 256 is good for mixed playlist playback. LoL

I sent you a PM.

RubenV. · Jan 12, 2017

bonzo75 said:
Hi I had the EML 5u4g mesh, and Bill had the 274b mesh. All, including the KR rectis, work on the Lampi.

The difference is the KR is punchier, more bass and dynamics. I found it better and sold my EML. Now I have the special Lampi KR recti which is even better, hence selling this. Only a few rectifiers were made for Lampi by KR and so they are unobtanium, I got one of my distributor.

Can I buy it from you?

bonzo75 · Jan 12, 2017

RubenV. said:
Can I buy it from you?

Sure. Let me know where you are, and will post. Will pm you PayPal

YashN · Jan 12, 2017

Comedus76 said:
- the DSD (both 256 and 512) low pass filter contains "chips" as part of the filter network / the chip(s) in the filter box are doing "something" that is part of the filter network.

I don't think that's true either (under correction of wisnon or Lukasz).

opus112 · Jan 12, 2017

There are sanded chips visible on the underneath PCB in that 6moons picture. The under PCB being the one for DSD.

RubenV. · Jan 13, 2017

bonzo75 said:
Sure. Let me know where you are, and will post. Will pm you PayPal

Done deal, thanks Bonzo

christoph · Jan 18, 2017

Hello Mike

Mike Lavigne said:
thank you. will try tonight. sounds easy.

Have you been successful with roon?

Any news on preferred HQPlayer settings for your GG?
Where do you see (rather hear) the sweet spot of your GG?

Mike Lavigne · Jan 18, 2017

christoph said:
Hello Mike

Have you been successful with roon?

yes, a little. I was able to use those filters and organize the titles by format.

unfortunately many of my favorite files were not recognized by Roon 1.2. so for now I'm just missing those files. according to Ed, it's possible that Roon 1.3, coming out in a few months, will be more flexible in terms of the type of file names and types it will recognize.

from my perspective; Roon is not yet ready for prime time compared to JRiver. JRiver easily recognizes every file and access is super quick and easy. I do respect that Roon's interface is slick, works great with Tidal, and includes MQA now. but.......I want all my files. that is job one for any file organization product for me.

Ed is going to install another interface other than Roon that is less restrictive for me (I can't recall the name right now) that should allow all my files to play.

Any news on preferred HQPlayer settings for your GG?

Where do you see (rather hear) the sweet spot of your GG?

later when I have time I will try to respond about these questions.

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