What's Best? Soulution, CH Precision, Vitus, or Ayre?

ogshighend

Member
Aug 13, 2023
5
12
5
59
  • Like
Reactions: DasguteOhr

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
22,588
13,619
2,710
London
How do you know what recordings I play?? You have somehow cameras in my apartment? Last time I checked we never sat down and listened to anything together…ever. My posts don’t really reveal much about the music I play, so not much to glean from that…All BS all the time from you.

the ones you play on your videos.

also, you never refer to any. it is not like you not to not talk about what you know
 

morricab

Well-Known Member
Apr 25, 2014
9,458
5,032
1,228
Switzerland
the ones you play on your videos
I play music I like not just what sounds the best but nearly all the posts I did are of at least very good quality …just not usually classical orchestra.
 

Lee

Well-Known Member
Feb 3, 2011
3,242
1,764
1,260
Alpharetta, Georgia
I would be happy to answer from my experience with PILIUM in the last two years,

I find PILIUM very clear, pure, and flowing, very "liquid", completely transparent, very natural to what was recorded, whether it is the tone of the recording, the dynamic of the recording, the drive of the recording and the energy of the recording.

This matches my experience from the listening session with the Magico M9s.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Bobvin and itay123

Lee

Well-Known Member
Feb 3, 2011
3,242
1,764
1,260
Alpharetta, Georgia
Generally I think valve preamps for SS amps is massaging band aid, and SS preamps into valve power amps is a better strategy.

I think this is outdated thinking now that reference SS and reference tube amps have converged to very similar sonic performance.
 
Last edited:
  • Haha
Reactions: bonzo75

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
22,588
13,619
2,710
London
I think this is outdated thinking now that good SS and Good tube amps have converged.
What are the tube amps you are referring to?
 

Lee

Well-Known Member
Feb 3, 2011
3,242
1,764
1,260
Alpharetta, Georgia
What are the tube amps you are referring to?

Top of mind here are the upper level Audio Research, VTL, and VAC amps. The bass performance is getting close to SS. And on the solid state side, Pass Labs' Class A midrange is approaching tube level imho.
 

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
22,588
13,619
2,710
London
Top of mind here are the upper level Audio Research, VTL, and VAC amps. The bass performance is getting close to SS. And on the solid state side, Pass Labs' Class A midrange is approaching tube level imho.

wow at the lack of experience in hifi. Anyone with an iota of experience would know I was referring to low wattage amps, many single ended, with audio research, VAC, or VTL nowhere in scope. Instead, your total lack of experience made you think of all that as one not appreciating the differences.

at least if you had countered back with SETs and efficient speakers can be equalled by SS and associated low impedance lower efficiency speakers, it would have been a counter view. Now yours just showed lack of experience.

kind of like only digital people who have never investigated analog thinking digital and vinyl is now equal because they did one compare
 

Lee

Well-Known Member
Feb 3, 2011
3,242
1,764
1,260
Alpharetta, Georgia
wow at the lack of experience in hifi. Anyone with an iota of experience would know I was referring to low wattage amps, many single ended, with audio research, VAC, or VTL nowhere in scope. Instead, your total lack of experience made you think of all that as one not appreciating the differences.

at least if you had countered back with SETs and efficient speakers can be equalled by SS and associated low impedance lower efficiency speakers, it would have been a counter view. Now yours just showed lack of experience.

kind of like only digital people who have never investigated analog thinking digital and vinyl is now equal because they did one compare

No reason to be insulting. I have loads of experience: 42 years in the hobby, Chesky recording engineer & producer, 200+ professional recordings, professional reviewer, CEO of TAS and hifi+.

It wasn't clear in the post I responded to that you were talking about SET amps.
 

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
22,588
13,619
2,710
London
No reason to be insulting. I have loads of experience: 42 years in the hobby, Chesky recording engineer & producer, 200+ professional recordings, professional reviewer, CEO of TAS and hifi+.

It wasn't clear in the post I responded to that you were talking about SET amps.

it was on the subsequent. And even them you could have used both. I really don’t rate AR, VTL that much. That said it will still be a better alternative to use Soulution preamp into AR poweramp than the other way round, which was my point. I did not make a point not to use SS pre into SS power where required.

if you need powerful amps, use SS.

it really requires a guy who is going around talking about lack of diminishing returns, 2m speakers, XVX and dCS being at the forefront of technology to have basic knowledge of other elements in hifi.

And call people way more knowledgable than you as “outdated”, that is insulting, for someone in a glass house to throw a stone at someone in a nuclear bunker. You started a post calling someone a douchebag the other day. I wonder how they let you on here.
 
Last edited:

Audire

VIP/Donor
Jan 18, 2019
1,479
1,832
330
FL Panhandle
Top of mind here are the upper level Audio Research, VTL, and VAC amps. The bass performance is getting close to SS. And on the solid state side, Pass Labs' Class A midrange is approaching tube level imho.

Sorry, but I must disagree with VAC - which we just sold. Our SS was and still is superior … And there are other amps - other than Pass (which I sold a year ago) - which are more tube-like. Please listen to a complete Vitus Masterpiece setup! It’s a consistent tube-like sound. Amazing. You’re welcome to my home near Destin, FL for a listen….
 
  • Like
Reactions: ogshighend

sujay

Member Sponsor
May 5, 2012
516
219
955
Singapore
there is a good CH Stenheim system in London you can go around to listen. It has gain, feedback impedance settings to be set right for it to sing
……and I heard the system a few months back with Ked. The learning for me, above all, was how well the system played in a very small room ( when professionally set up and dialed in), completely belying expectation. I also learnt a bit about ‘gain-staging’.

There was no boom, overhang. Just clean and dynamic music. In fact it played grunge rock exceptionally well at very loud volumes, something a lot of systems out there cant do without sounding harsh.

cheers

sujay
 
  • Like
Reactions: Lee and bonzo75

Barry2013

VIP/Donor
Oct 12, 2013
2,307
488
418
Essex UK
Sorry, but I must disagree with VAC - which we just sold. Our SS was and still is superior … And there are other amps - other than Pass (which I sold a year ago) - which are more tube-like. Please listen to a complete Vitus Masterpiece setup! It’s a consistent tube-like sound. Amazing. You’re welcome to my home near Destin, FL for a listen….
I had a Vitus 025 sia for about five years and about three years ago I upgraded to the 030.
My limited experience of CH Precision is of a dry sound which lacks musicality. Some may like that flavour which is also characteristic of the Soulution brand.
To my ears there is a rigthtness about the Vitus sound. It doesn't lack transparency or resolution and there is a lovely liquid organic flow to the sound on all genres of music. Great build quality and they hold their value well.
 
  • Like
  • Love
Reactions: morricab and Audire

Lee

Well-Known Member
Feb 3, 2011
3,242
1,764
1,260
Alpharetta, Georgia
it was on the subsequent. And even them you could have used both. I really don’t rate AR, VTL that much. That said it will still be a better alternative to use Soulution preamp into AR poweramp than the other way round, which was my point. I did not make a point not to use SS pre into SS power where required.

if you need powerful amps, use SS.

it really requires a guy who is going around talking about lack of diminishing returns, 2m speakers, XVX and dCS being at the forefront of technology to have basic knowledge of other elements in hifi.

And call people way more knowledgable than you as “outdated”, that is insulting, for someone in a glass house to throw a stone at someone in a nuclear bunker. You started a post calling someone a douchebag the other day. I wonder how they let you on here.

I apologized for calling XV-1 a douchebag but he has not apologized for calling my thoughtful thread “BS”.

I proudly stand by my comments on the problems with the Law of Diminishing Returns. $2 million speakers refers to technology advances in the future and what realism we might expect. It’s me thinking aloud In wonder. It’s not an endorsement for $2 million speakers. And yes, I do believe the XVX and dCS DACs represent new technology being applied in ways that serve music.
 

Lee

Well-Known Member
Feb 3, 2011
3,242
1,764
1,260
Alpharetta, Georgia
Sorry, but I must disagree with VAC - which we just sold. Our SS was and still is superior … And there are other amps - other than Pass (which I sold a year ago) - which are more tube-like. Please listen to a complete Vitus Masterpiece setup! It’s a consistent tube-like sound. Amazing. You’re welcome to my home near Destin, FL for a listen….

I would love to stop by for a listen. I get to Destin every once and a while.

But I will say the VAC and Acora pairing at Axpona was truly wonderful. Unfortunately the Vitus-Estelon system was not so wonderful there which is a shame for a $1.2 million system.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Audire

Al M.

VIP/Donor
Sep 10, 2013
8,779
4,538
1,213
Greater Boston
……and I heard the system a few months back with Ked. The learning for me, above all, was how well the system played in a very small room ( when professionally set up and dialed in), completely belying expectation. I also learnt a bit about ‘gain-staging’.

There was no boom, overhang. Just clean and dynamic music. In fact it played grunge rock exceptionally well at very loud volumes, something a lot of systems out there cant do without sounding harsh.

cheers

sujay

How small was the room?
 

bonzo75

Member Sponsor
Feb 26, 2014
22,588
13,619
2,710
London

howiebrou

Well-Known Member
Jun 29, 2012
2,789
3,636
1,470
I tested the Ongaku with several speakers but in my modest opinion is absolutely over valued , i compared hand to hand with airtight atm-2211 monoblocks and with airtight atm-300r. All setup tested with vynil records and Tad 2404 speakers . For some friends and me airtight and kondo are in the similar level with very different price. Sound of airtight is more engaging and magic compared with ongaku with great sound stage and lots of detail and so natural with the soul i like. We test with 211 elrog 243 , rca, ge and 300b WE nos in the case of atm-300r
Did you use a preamp with the Ongaku?
 

morricab

Well-Known Member
Apr 25, 2014
9,458
5,032
1,228
Switzerland
Top of mind here are the upper level Audio Research, VTL, and VAC amps. The bass performance is getting close to SS. And on the solid state side, Pass Labs' Class A midrange is approaching tube level imho.
Only US brands...very telling.
 

itay123

Well-Known Member
Mar 5, 2023
168
259
65

About us

  • What’s Best Forum is THE forum for high end audio, product reviews, advice and sharing experiences on the best of everything else. This is THE place where audiophiles and audio companies discuss vintage, contemporary and new audio products, music servers, music streamers, computer audio, digital-to-analog converters, turntables, phono stages, cartridges, reel-to-reel tape machines, speakers, headphones and tube and solid-state amplification. Founded in 2010 What’s Best Forum invites intelligent and courteous people of all interests and backgrounds to describe and discuss the best of everything. From beginners to life-long hobbyists to industry professionals, we enjoy learning about new things and meeting new people, and participating in spirited debates.

Quick Navigation

User Menu

Steve Williams
Site Founder | Site Owner | Administrator
Ron Resnick
Site Co-Owner | Administrator
Julian (The Fixer)
Website Build | Marketing Managersing