Is there Delta - Sigma DAC that is much better than Multibit Ladder R-2R DAC?

Esotar · Sep 4, 2016

I had Meitner DA2.

And I compared DA2 with R-2R DAC MSB Signature DAC V and Aqua La Scala MK II. (not Multibit DAC)

I amazed that DA2's performance is better than Signature and La Scala.

DA2 is Delta-Sigma DAC because all parts is produced by Ed Meitner.

And DA2 is more expensive than La Scala.^^

I think Multibit Ladder R-2R DAC is not absolute solution.

Mike Lavigne · Sep 4, 2016

Esotar said:
I had Meitner DA2.

And I compared DA2 with R-2R DAC MSB Signature DAC V and Aqua La Scala MK II. (not Multibit DAC)

I amazed that DA2's performance is better than Signature and La Scala.

DA2 is Delta-Sigma DAC because all parts is produced by Ed Meitner.

And DA2 is more expensive than La Scala.^^

I think Multibit Ladder R-2R DAC is not absolute solution.

interesting. valuable feedback.

it would be helpful to explain what formats you listened to (redbook? hirez PCM?, dsd? 2xdsd? 4xdsd?) and which server and interface you were using......as the context of comparisons like this is important. and in what ways did you prefer the DA2? were all the dacs connected to a preamp in the same way? and was this a side by side comparison or perceptions from different listening sessions or different systems?

I've not heard a MSB Sig DAC V but have heard the MSB Select II which shares some aspects. and I've owned the Trinity dac which is an R2R design.

Esotar · Sep 4, 2016

I Borrowed Signature and La Scala is mine.

I manage to make high-end powered active speakers. (Accuton, Skaaning, Eton, Mundorf, etc.)

www.digitusupremo.com

So borrowing audio parts are easy thing.

Only changing DAC...

Music Format : 16bit / 44.1kHz Flac and 24bit / 192KHz not DSD (DA2 is strong to DSD.)

3 days test and friends are agreed. (total 5 people)

I know R-2R DAC is more benefits for qualities.

But All R-2R DAC is not good.

I think best DAC in the world is Trinity DAC.

I think Trinity's PCM is better than DSD from Vivaldi DAC.

^^

DonH50 · Sep 4, 2016

The data converter's architecture is just one part of the design. Like many other things, there are many trades, and implementation of the design plays a huge role in how well it performs. You could just as easily say all delta-sigma DACs are not good... Delta-sigma and conventional Nyquist architectures have pros and cons and the rest of the circuit (digital input, power supply, analog output filter and buffer) all influence how it sounds. Similar statements could be made for amplifiers, speakers, etc.

In the end it is how well the component sounds to you in your system.

IME/IMO - Don

p.s. There are a couple of DAC articles I wrote here on WBF, DACS 101 and 102, that delve a little into the technical details. A link to the article list is in my signature.

Esotar · Sep 4, 2016

You're right~!

My system is very simple and Korean made products are many.

Maybe you don't enjoy it.

But I will show you...

My system is...

Speaker : Accuton D-25 / C90-6-724 X 2 / S280-6-282 X [3 Way 5 Speakers] Korean made Power Amp : 400W Mono Block Korean made Pre Amp : Ayre KX-R

Twenty DAC : EmmLabs DA 2 Sourse : Audio PC (Mainboard-C-Clock + USB-Neutron Star Clock / Intel Xeon E5-2660V2 / Samsung DDR3 16G PC3-12800

ECC/REG LP / Inner Power Cable : Silver/Gold Cable Tuning) Cables : Speakers - Mundorf S/G 2.5m X 3 / USB - Entreq Atlantis Set / Entreq Atlantis XLR Set X

2 / Power Cable : Entreq Atlantis Set X 3, Atlantis Digital Set X 2 Power Conditioner : Entreq Atlantis Multitab / Quantum QB8 / Quantum QV2 X 2 Accessaries :

Acoustic Revive RRR-8 Grounding : Entreq Olympus Tellus X 2 /

Poseidon X 2 / Peak X 30 (Only Korea , Entreq Everest's Ultra Upgrade Product ^^) / Silver Tellus + Atlantis Tellus / Silver Minimus + Atlantis Minimus X 3 / Gaia (also only

Korea)

DonH50 · Sep 4, 2016

Nice system!

You should copy that post to the Member's Gallery so it does not get lost in this thread: http://www.whatsbestforum.com/forumdisplay.php?247-Members-Gallery

I bet many here would like to see this and ask about the components, especially the Korean-made gear.

Esotar · Sep 4, 2016

Thank you for seeing in favor~

^^

Jazzhead · Sep 5, 2016

Awesome looking speakers Esotar ! Any more details on them and the special for Korea Entreq products ?

I agree on

I think best DAC in the world is Trinity DAC.

I think Trinity's PCM is better than DSD from Vivaldi DAC.

+1

Alpinist · Sep 5, 2016

Lampizator originally offered the R2R Ladder on their DACs because it sounded superior to their Delta-Sigma chip. But they now feel their latest Delta-Sigma chip is comparable to their R2R Ladder, so they are offering both options. The biggest advantage with the Delta-Sigma chip on the Lampizator is it automatically switches between PCM and DSD, while the R2R Ladder needs to be manually switched due to two separate DACs.

Ken

Esotar · Sep 5, 2016

Korean PC-FI forum "PC Speakers Club"'s host is a very brilliant person.

JPLAY and Audiophile Optimizer are accommodated his opinion.

Entreq's digital power cable and K2 / Everest are born by him.

As the result of his contribution, Entreq gives Peak / Boster and Gaia grounding box for car.^^

There are Pictures about them.

FrantzM · Sep 5, 2016

DonH50 said:
Nice system!

You should copy that post to the Member's Gallery so it does not get lost in this thread: http://www.whatsbestforum.com/forumdisplay.php?247-Members-Gallery

I bet many here would like to see this and ask about the components, especially the Korean-made gear.

+1

I would like to know more about the DIY speakers...

Welcome to the WBF!

LL21 · Sep 5, 2016

+1...Esotar...have been watching your growing contributions to WBF and appreciate them. Thanks for being here, and look forward to reading more...particularly intrigued by Trinity DAC. But as others have already said...also interested in your speakers!

Esotar · Sep 5, 2016

LL21 said:
+1...Esotar...have been watching your growing contributions to WBF and appreciate them. Thanks for being here, and look forward to reading more...particularly intrigued by Trinity DAC. But as others have already said...also interested in your speakers!

LL21

You're right. I'm sorry.

^^

Ken Newton · Sep 6, 2016

This gets back to the age old question of what exactly constitutes better. If you mean objective measured performamce, then sigma-delta conversion performs better than does non-sigma-delta. Subjective performance can be a different matter, and is a matter of personal listening preferences. There are no fixed rules which everyone agrees with. For example, in addition to meitner, dCs DACs utilize sigma-delta conversion.

Jazzhead · Sep 6, 2016

Ken Newton said:
This gets back to the age old question of what exactly constitutes better. If you mean objective measured performamce, then sigma-delta conversion performs better than does non-sigma-delta. Subjective performance can be a different matter, and is a matter of personal listening preferences. There are no fixed rules which everyone agrees with. For example, in addition to meitner, dCs DACs utilize sigma-delta conversion.

so the dCS ring DAC is Delta-Sigma based ?

Ken Newton · Sep 6, 2016

Yes, it's my recollection that the 'ring' DAC is a 5-bit sigma-delta converter.

LL21 · Sep 6, 2016

Esotar said:
LL21

You're right. I'm sorry.

^^

Hi! No apology necessary!! You are doing a great job, and look forward to reading more.

Elberoth · Sep 7, 2016

Esotar said:
I think best DAC in the world is Trinity DAC.

I think Trinity's PCM is better than DSD from Vivaldi DAC.

That well may be true (Trinity DAC owner here), although I would love to hear a head to head comparo with the MSB $120k DAC.

wisnon · Sep 7, 2016

I heard the Select at the Warsaw show last year and was underwhelmed for the money it costs!

Elberoth · Sep 7, 2016

Since last year I have heard it in several more locations and I'm in a position it is def a contender.

Is there Delta - Sigma DAC that is much better than Multibit Ladder R-2R DAC?

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