AQ Niagara vs Shunyata vs EquiTech vs. SilverO vs. Torus vs. ?? What are differences?

Ron Resnick

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. . . a Torus RM 20, would that suffice for the power amps? Understand some might feel that Torus might compromise SQ.
. . .

If the distance between my planned in-wall Torus and my power amps would have been 15 feet or less I would not have hesitated to get the big Torus unit.

Audiophiles who do not care for balanced power/isolation transformer devices make three main arguments against using them:

1) Too great a distance between the transformer and high current amps can have the sonic effect of sapping bass energy.

2) The devices make the sound a bit sterile or cold-sounding.

3) For high current amplifiers you must go with as big a transformer as possible (e.g., 10 kva)​

Another way to go is to "split the baby" and run the power amps directly into the wall outlet and to use a Torus (or similar device) only for the front end and pre-amp.
 

microstrip

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Hi, what does this mean for Apogees in a flat? With a 20A power line, OR a Torus RM 20, would that suffice for the power amps? Understand some might feel that Torus might compromise SQ.

Also, the power chord from the wall will have a 13A fuse, maybe increase that to 15A. I can go EU plugs, fuseless from the Torus or whatever. Will that work?

I have not experience enough to advise you on that matter. The Torus RM 20 is a 2400 VA unit - this means around 10 A at your UK typical mains.

BTW, you have a UK company making excellent isolation toroidal balanced transformers for professional studios at much lower prices than imports - I have asked them a quotation some time ago, but do not remember the name now - I can look in my mail archives if you are interested.

Edit - the company is http://www.one4power.co.uk/mduproducts.html. Look for the 4K & 8K Balanced Power Systems. They are the only people I have found in the net who present a proper technical explanation why sometimes balanced output power can be a good think.
 
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George K

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Jul 26, 2012
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I use a Torus rm16 CE (European version) and feed all my system including Gryphon Antileon signature power amp (97 kilos weight).
And I've experienced more 3D sound, blacker backgrounds and sweeter mids and highs. The overall speed is improved and the bass is more thunderous and defined.
My friend had Equitech 3Q with 12A and tested it against a torus AVR 8A. Ended up selling his Equitech and ordering a Torus RM16. The 8A torus was clearly better and measured 50mvdc noise against 150mvdc noise of Equitech. But surprised with Torus 8A performance; ordered the bigger rm16.
Now the Equitech was a balanced model and the Torus was not balanced. Because there are no balanced models for Europe (CE).

I think that rack mounted Torus or Equitech can benefit most systems instead without. You don't have to go with wall mount 90A or 100A at start. And the benefit is that you put Torus close to your system.

I also know another guy who tested and ordered a Torus unit that feeds his Shunyata triton and typhoon and from there the rest of his system. This works and sounds great too.

With Torus or Equitech you can't go wrong.

On the other hand I had disappointing experience with Furman, RGPC and PS Audio in my system or other's great highend systems.
 

bonzo75

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Thanks, that's good feedback. But why would one need both the Shunyata and he Torus?
 

George K

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Thanks, that's good feedback. But why would one need both the Shunyata and he Torus?

He already had the Shunyata combo and used it in synergy with Torus. Torus feeds the Shunyata and from there to the rest of the gear. It works.
He didn't used the torus alone so far.
 

cuntigh

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Dec 20, 2014
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Have a Torus AVR16 (Europe) that replaced my passive Bybee Holographic (great unnknow product in my opinion). The Torus feeds everything : 2 Air Tight ATM3 amps, ATE 2 pre, TW Raven AC3, Computer Audio Design DAC and the 2 power supplies of the CAT Drive and the Tuner.
When everything is connected less than 3 amp in static are used. torus doesn't indicate the pics of current in use.
I refused to try to connect the Bybee after the Torus because too much complexity and US mains only for the Holographic. The result is amazing and it regulates the tension that is a good thing in my appartment.
The cable from the wall to the Torus is surprisingly supple and I think about changing it for a bulk Furutech with NCF mains.
In the beginning I first decided for the RM30 but it doesn't regulated current, is very very heavy and needs a particular mains 32Amps. S I changed my order for the AVR16.
Torus did advise for a RM or AVR4 or 8, but we are audiophile after all and never know how our system can evolve over the years.
What is interesting with Torus is all the current is run on any output so you can use a distributor if more output are needed without peers.
The advantage of rack mount system is short run of cables and possibility to export when you change home. Ron you could think about it maybe.
I won't look back.
The difference in sound quality between the passives Bybee and before that the big Lessloss was dramatic. All transparence is here, unforced, air between performers, image stability' width, depth of the scene... Dynamic. All is there like in live music.
If I could I would put the Torus as far as possible from my listening seat because sometimes in very quiet music passages, I can here a very slight hum. My bad electricity can be cause of that I've been told. I have to look inside if I can isolate a bit more the transfo with help of some Herbie's and it will be perfect
 

bonzo75

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Hi, can you please clarify. Why did you get AVR 16 and not RM? You said RM 30 does not regulate current, did you mean current or voltage, and is that different with the AVR?

Also, the RM 30 requires a 30a circuit to the wall, but the RM 16 does not?
 

cuntigh

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Dec 20, 2014
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Hi, can you please clarify. Why did you get AVR 16 and not RM? You said RM 30 does not regulate current, did you mean current or voltage, and is that different with the AVR?

Also, the RM 30 requires a 30a circuit to the wall, but the RM 16 does not?

I mean AVR regulates voltage. It's bad english spoken. Sorry.
The AVR16 don't need a 30 amp wall outlet necause it can drive max 16 amp and that is what the usual wall outlet is able to deliver.
 

Elberoth

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If I could I would put the Torus as far as possible from my listening seat because sometimes in very quiet music passages, I can here a very slight hum. My bad electricity can be cause of that I've been told. I have to look inside if I can isolate a bit more the transfo with help of some Herbie's and it will be perfect

You need to try a DC blocker, as DC component present on your AC mains seems to be saturating the transformer core, causing it to hum.
 

microstrip

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(...) Now the Equitech was a balanced model and the Torus was not balanced. Because there are no balanced models for Europe (CE).

I think that rack mounted Torus or Equitech can benefit most systems instead without. You don't have to go with wall mount 90A or 100A at start. And the benefit is that you put Torus close to your system.
(...)

Both Torus or Equitech are isolating transformers. As far as I know in the US both can be used with balanced mains input (2x120V). The Equitech has balanced main output (2x60V) in the US, and 2 x120V balanced mains output in Europe. The Torus has 120V (US) and 240V (Europe) non balanced mains output.

The Torus is more than an isolation transformer - using a patented system adding a resonant extra winding to transformer it cleans harmonic distortion and noise from the mains signal, without any addiction of serial devices. I would like to try and measure it, it looks as one of more effective devices in power conditioning, but it is not distributed in most european countries.

BTW, MSB Technology uses a Torus isolation system in their demo room in Europe (Antwerp, Belgium).
 

microstrip

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You need to try a DC blocker, as DC component present on your AC mains seems to be saturating the transformer core, causing it to hum.

DC blockers are usually very effective removing mechanical hum due to DC, but add a capacitive series impedance to mains - something most people do not appreciate. The BURMEISTER 948 could remove DC without inserting serial elements, but was really expensive.

I have sound that in equipment coming from the US, many times the mechanical noise was due to 3rd and 5th harmonic of the mains - connecting the equipment to a pure wave regenerator solved the mechanical noise, although it could degrade overall performance. As always, we have try and listen.
 

sujay

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May 5, 2012
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Hi,

I have the Bryston BIT 16 which is essentially a Torus RM 16, identical in every respect. It has 12 outlets and I have pretty much plugged everything into it including my mono amps and a pair of the REL G1s. I have had excellent results. There is no transformer hum and at the same time, I don't think there is any current starvation even at high SPLs. The system is absolutely dead quiet. I moved from a normal but very high quality power strip from Japan. And in every respect, the system sounded cleaner and more dynamic - probably owing to reduction in overall noise floor of the system.

I am not qualified to comment any further on this technicality so I will stop here. But I can certainly say that the difference that this move caused was substantially positive. Unfortunately I cannot offer any comparisons other than this as I haven't used any other power conditioner. But I doubt anyone can go wrong with the Torus. It is also a brilliant surge protector. And not very expensive. It's heavy though given the 3400 VA transformer.

I gave Bryston/ Torus my entire system details before purchase and they came back pretty confidently saying I wouldn't need anything more than a BIT 16. And as I mentioned, I can't see the system starving for power, no matter how much I crank it up.

Cheers

Sujay
 

spiritofmusic

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Jun 13, 2013
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Feed isolated from domestic supply to audio room via 16mm Copper SWA cable, to
Bespoke consumer unit CU, to
Oyaide line into 8kVA Westwick 8K balanced power transformer www.one4power.co.uk to
Oyaide line back into CU, to
6 Oyaide dedicated lines, to
6 Furutech US duplexes
---
I believe my Westwick is the UK equivalent of Equi=Tech, indeed I've been told they are not licenced to sell on each other's territory (US/UK)
Like Mike L I'm able to easily switch a/b from balanced to regular supply.
As he has stated, not even close.
 

sujay

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May 5, 2012
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Feed isolated from domestic supply to audio room via 16mm Copper SWA cable, to
Bespoke consumer unit CU, to
Oyaide line into 8kVA Westwick 8K balanced power transformer www.one4power.co.uk to
Oyaide line back into CU, to
6 Oyaide dedicated lines, to
6 Furutech US duplexes
---
I believe my Westwick is the UK equivalent of Equi=Tech, indeed I've been told they are not licenced to sell on each other's territory (US/UK)
Like Mike L I'm able to easily switch a/b from balanced to regular supply.
As he has stated, not even close.

Hi, quite intrigued by your solution. I had mentioned that I am very happy with my Bryston/ Torus unit but am keen to explore. I am a little confused as to how all the components are connected to your Westwick unit. If it makes sense, I can PM you to understand in more detail.

Thanks

Sujay
 

spiritofmusic

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2013
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Sure Sujay.
Basically my electrician installed a splitter on the incoming mains to the house, and a new 100A fuse.
From the splitter, feed A went to the chapel, B to the audio room.
This means that my power does not get adulterated by the domestics.
This feed to my room is a 16mm Cu SWA cable. This terminates in my room in a dedicated treated Consumer Unit CU. From this CU we run a single Oyaide line to the balanced transformer, another Oyaide back from the transformer to the CU. And then from the CU, my 6 Oyaide dedicated lines down the depth of my room to terminate in 6 Furutech duplexes, allowing up to 12 components to be powered.
 

sujay

Member Sponsor
May 5, 2012
516
219
955
Singapore
Sure Sujay.
Basically my electrician installed a splitter on the incoming mains to the house, and a new 100A fuse.
From the splitter, feed A went to the chapel, B to the audio room.
This means that my power does not get adulterated by the domestics.
This feed to my room is a 16mm Cu SWA cable. This terminates in my room in a dedicated treated Consumer Unit CU. From this CU we run a single Oyaide line to the balanced transformer, another Oyaide back from the transformer to the CU. And then from the CU, my 6 Oyaide dedicated lines down the depth of my room to terminate in 6 Furutech duplexes, allowing up to 12 components to be powered.

Thanks! Let me read some more from their website before reverting with specific questions if I have any
Cheers
 

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