I'm Not Gonna Tell How Great My MicroRendu plus Sonore Signature Power Supply Sounds!
- Thread starter Steve Bruzonsky
- Start date
And the latest update from AMR was posted earlier today with graphs, ohhhh graphs, what joy & the pitfalls of ground connections & how they affect measurements
And this summary which Amir took exception to - he doesn't realise that this is exactly what Thorsten intended
And this summary which Amir took exception to - he doesn't realise that this is exactly what Thorsten intended
He is a very sad individual. Basically the blind leading the deaf, dumb and blind.And the latest update from AMR was posted earlier today with graphs, ohhhh graphs, what joy & the pitfalls of ground connections & how they affect measurements
And this summary which Amir took exception to - he doesn't realise that this is exactly what Thorsten intended
You get blamed too Bob
Some outlandish & hilarious statements from Amir's desperate attempts to hide his misunderstandings & flawed measurements based on his strawman premise of the workings of the uRendu:
- according to him Yashn, Bob & I are responsible for Amir having to do his flawed measurements - apparently we are the reason Amir doesn't understand what Swenson meant by ""The microRendu produces a very clean USB signal to the DAC, which seems to produce lower noise levels in the DAC. The exact mechanism for this is not well understood at this time. The lower noise in the DAC allows the DAC circuit to operate at its peak performance. "
Apparently, according to Amir "Of course I decided to test this gear based on constant promotion of this device by the few of you. No matter how much I tried to explain that you should not be in this wishful mood, you all went on anyway. So I thought to bring some hard data to the discussion. That is what has happened." So take a bow, guys you forced Amir into spending $700 - I think we should have a whip around & refund him, don't you?
- this is nearly as hilarious as him blaming Swenson for not understanding how Asynch USB works
- according to him I'm "to blame" for the number of uRendu units sold
- Jeez I must write to Jesus @ Sonore to get my cut - hilarious It just gets more & more outlandish
You get blamed too Bob
As one of the personae non-grata over there I'm feeling a bit left out that I couldn't share some of the tar and feathers... Surely in all my hundreds of posts there I must have something to be blamed for in this whole affair? Perhaps Amir didn't look hard enough?
Hehe, your optimism is naive, I'm afraid - it's a permanent ban - they just don't accept peer review or alternative viewpoints/opinions.
I have to say that thread was fun though - pity they don't allow open discussions?
Some outlandish & hilarious statements from Amir desperate attempts to hide his misunderstandings & strawman measurements :
- according to him Yashn, Bob & I are responsible for Amir having to do his flawed measurements - apparently we are the reason Amir doesn't understand what Swenson meant by ""The microRendu produces a very clean USB signal to the DAC, which seems to produce lower noise levels in the DAC. The exact mechanism for this is not well understood at this time. The lower noise in the DAC allows the DAC circuit to operate at its peak performance. "
Apparently, according to Amir "Of course I decided to test this gear based on constant promotion of this device by the few of you. No matter how much I tried to explain that you should not be in this wishful mood, you all went on anyway. So I thought to bring some hard data to the discussion. That is what has happened." So take a bow, guys you forced Amir into spending $700 - I think we should have a whip around & refund him, don't you?
- this is nearly as hilarious as him blaming Swenson for not understanding how Asynch USB works
- according to him I'm "to blame" for the number of uRendu units sold
It just gets more & more outlandish
I think your mind is extrapolating a little too much John.
No way that Amir thinks you have some to do with uRendu number of units sold.
And I'm not in the clan of "you"; I'm in my own free zone.
Anyway, I'm all in for the engaged discussion between Amir and you. I followed it, made couple comments regarding some interventions by couple other members, because they weren't on topic with the post content but with the poster, you. I deleted couple of my own posts, and I'm going to delete one or two more; because I too wasn't with the topic. ...And even if I was very polite. I stopped reading after a while to attend other matters in order to expand my knowledge. :b
And no matter what, the MicroRendu is certainly making the news and the sales. ...Measurements or not; the majority of people measure with their ears. ...And ears are directly related to another part of the human anatomy. It's great to be free, it's great to be me, it's great to be alive, today.
____________
“Swifter, higher, stronger.” - Pierre de Coubertin quote
“Music must be the heritage of all men/women/children and of all social classes.”
Yes I have been reading all the foolishness, it is so misguided and rather funny. Let them enjoy themselves. most people will just ignore his silly little measurements realizing he has no real standing or credibility. Even Blizz one of his best buddies knows he is totally wrong and tried pointing it out to him.You get blamed too Bob
Some outlandish & hilarious statements from Amir's desperate attempts to hide his misunderstandings & flawed measurements based on his strawman premise of the workings of the uRendu:
- according to him Yashn, Bob & I are responsible for Amir having to do his flawed measurements - apparently we are the reason Amir doesn't understand what Swenson meant by ""The microRendu produces a very clean USB signal to the DAC, which seems to produce lower noise levels in the DAC. The exact mechanism for this is not well understood at this time. The lower noise in the DAC allows the DAC circuit to operate at its peak performance. "
Apparently, according to Amir "Of course I decided to test this gear based on constant promotion of this device by the few of you. No matter how much I tried to explain that you should not be in this wishful mood, you all went on anyway. So I thought to bring some hard data to the discussion. That is what has happened." So take a bow, guys you forced Amir into spending $700 - I think we should have a whip around & refund him, don't you?
- this is nearly as hilarious as him blaming Swenson for not understanding how Asynch USB works
- according to him I'm "to blame" for the number of uRendu units sold
It just gets more & more outlandish
I was talking tongue in cheek but what do you make of this statement of his "A lot of people have been led this path. Their subjective evaluations were tainted by assumption of reduced noise. And the few cheerleaders like you are a big part of this blame John."
Keep on keeping on, Tim
- according to him Yashn, Bob & I are responsible for Amir having to do his flawed measurements - apparently we are the reason Amir doesn't understand what Swenson meant by ""The microRendu produces a very clean USB signal to the DAC, which seems to produce lower noise levels in the DAC. The exact mechanism for this is not well understood at this time. The lower noise in the DAC allows the DAC circuit to operate at its peak performance. "
Apparently, according to Amir "Of course I decided to test this gear based on constant promotion of this device by the few of you. No matter how much I tried to explain that you should not be in this wishful mood, you all went on anyway. So I thought to bring some hard data to the discussion. That is what has happened." So take a bow, guys you forced Amir into spending $700 - I think we should have a whip around & refund him, don't you?
- this is nearly as hilarious as him blaming Swenson for not understanding how Asynch USB works
It just gets more & more outlandish
I never forced anyone to make measurements
Furthermore, it isn't true that 'The exact mechanism for this is not well understood at this time.'
The explanation has already been given in great detail by Swenson over at CA
Well, were you 'promoting' the device in any way?
Not directly but I have 'liked' some of jkeny's posts in that thread. Doesn't that count, can't I have some of the blame, pretty please?
Yea, I blame you - the first place I heard about noise floor modulation was from you - this is what finally flipped that thread - as Blumlein 88 says
"Another one of those you can't measure it but you hear it effects. How do you design for these and how would know your design was effective?
Also how can you criticize measures of something you can't measure?
And why can you not measure this? Use signals of different levels and see how the noise floor varies. That actually is an area I intend to investigate when I have time."
Funny how they are always INTENDING to do this measurement but never get a round tuit?
You can hear the dilemma that faces this mindset, can't you? It's just an untenable situation for them!
In the true spirit of the pantomime that is that thread "Oh yes you did"I never forced anyone to make measurements
Indeed but better to go on 3rd party forum postings to formulate your measurement approach, don't you think? Going back to the actual manufacturer for explanations of the premised mode of operation of the uRendu would only lead to complexity - best to keep it simple & test using a stock measurement like noise floor - close enough, right?Furthermore, it isn't true that 'The exact mechanism for this is not well understood at this time.'
The explanation has already been given in great detail by Swenson over at CA
Ah well... can't change some things... but why would you want to post over there, eh?
I need, however, to qualify my statement a little more for it to be accurate.
As it is, I was thinking along the lines of the Regen technology, of which an enhanced version is in the microRendu.
I was honing in on that because the agenda against Swenson is quite heavy-handed and obvious, starting with the mis-measurements of the Regen itself around here. That agenda is continuing with the microRendu.
So this is what I was referring to when I mentioned that the details were given over at CA.
The microRendu, however, is more than just an enhanced Regen: the motherboard is a special-purpose one.
Now, there was a good part 1 article over at CA detailing how it works, but understandably, some of the details were later redacted as they were giving away too much.
I like the meticulous approach of the design.
Hi Guys
Probably not a good idea to make comments about another forum here. I would suggest you take your arguments from here and post them in the appropriate forum. This has nothing to do with WBF
Probably not a good idea to make comments about another forum here. I would suggest you take your arguments from here and post them in the appropriate forum. This has nothing to do with WBF
The final measurements from AMR of the iFi iPower are posted
It indeed shows that apart from a 3uV peak that the PS measures at & below 1uV
The technique used for measuring this was:
"The lowest ground noise setup was used with a 9V iPower delivering 750mA current (into a 12 Ohm/50W resistor) and the signal on the +/- side of the resistor was fed into the AP2 unbalanced input."
And his conclusion:
It indeed shows that apart from a 3uV peak that the PS measures at & below 1uV
The technique used for measuring this was:
"The lowest ground noise setup was used with a 9V iPower delivering 750mA current (into a 12 Ohm/50W resistor) and the signal on the +/- side of the resistor was fed into the AP2 unbalanced input."
And his conclusion:
Let me explain how I have used Roon in my system during this year so far, and how lately the Microrendu fantastically has improved my sonics in combination with Roon:
1. Initially, I installed RoonServerInstaller64, on my then CAPSv4 (operated headless, using Teamviewer to remotely control the CAPSv4 from my PCs or iPad) (I didn't install the "full" RoonInstaller64 program because Windows 8.1 Pro had been optimized on my CAPSv4 to elimate unnecessary functions, including those necessary for Roon's video display). This program permitted me to utilize the CAPSv4 USB output for audio.
2. In April, Roon updated to version 1.2, a BIG DEAL! I was able to install RoonInstaller64 on my Toshiba laptop; and install RoonBridgeinstaller64 on my CAPSv4. Thanks to RoonBridge on my CAPSv4, I was able to have all the internet seeking for metadata & info, and audio processing, done by my Toshiba laptop; using the RoonBridge on the CAPSv4 only as the USB audio output.
3. I then substituted my CAPSv3 (which runs JRiver for multi-channel via HDMI) (which I quit using for 2 channel via USB once I got the CAPSv4) running RoonServerInstaller64 for the Toshiba laptop, as the CAPSv3 is fanless, and as when I run Roon I am not also running JRiver (which I now use only for multi-channel) at the same time as Roon.
4. In May, I replaced the CAPSv4 as a RoonBridge (outputting USB audio) with the Microrendu (which comes Roonready, which is the same as loading RoonBridge onto a computer).
My current Roon setup:
CAPSv3 runs RoonServerInstaller64. Microrendu is Roon Ready.
WDMyCloudEX4 (Western Digital) 16 TB Server connects via ethernet cable to Linksys router/access point.
CAPSv3 connects via ethernet cable to Linksys router/access point.
Microrendu connects via ethernet cable to Linksys router/access point.
Microrendu connects via USB output/USB cable to Berkely Audio USB to digital converter.
Berkely connects via Cardas AES/EBU digital cable to Theta CBIV SSP.
Theta CBIV SSP connects via three Cardas AES/EBU digital cables to three external Theta Gen VIII Series 3 DACs.
I initially used the Microrendu with the HDPlex 100 watt linear power supply (LPS) that came with my CAPSv4, and it was a clear sonic improvement over the CAPSv4. After I few weeks, my new Sonore Signature Power Supply (with 2 Synergistic Research black fuses) arrived, and this was a substantial sonic improvement even more than before!
Note that my CAPSv3 (and now sold CAPSv4) Windows 8.1 Pro operating systems were optimized by Andrew Gillis, Small Green Computer (he also wrote the software for the Microrendu) to delete unnecessary functions for the best audio sonics and to avoid operating hiccups. I have personally experienced operating hiccups when using a computer without having Windows optimized for audio usage.
All this mumbojumbo and noise is just that, noise. Objective science must also take into account subjective, and in this case, I have no doubt of methodology mistakes for one to equate a laptop sonics & noise with the microrendu. But I'm not gonna waste my time bantering and arguing this - I am having too much fun listening to music sounding its very best in my system! Have at it folks!
1. Initially, I installed RoonServerInstaller64, on my then CAPSv4 (operated headless, using Teamviewer to remotely control the CAPSv4 from my PCs or iPad) (I didn't install the "full" RoonInstaller64 program because Windows 8.1 Pro had been optimized on my CAPSv4 to elimate unnecessary functions, including those necessary for Roon's video display). This program permitted me to utilize the CAPSv4 USB output for audio.
2. In April, Roon updated to version 1.2, a BIG DEAL! I was able to install RoonInstaller64 on my Toshiba laptop; and install RoonBridgeinstaller64 on my CAPSv4. Thanks to RoonBridge on my CAPSv4, I was able to have all the internet seeking for metadata & info, and audio processing, done by my Toshiba laptop; using the RoonBridge on the CAPSv4 only as the USB audio output.
3. I then substituted my CAPSv3 (which runs JRiver for multi-channel via HDMI) (which I quit using for 2 channel via USB once I got the CAPSv4) running RoonServerInstaller64 for the Toshiba laptop, as the CAPSv3 is fanless, and as when I run Roon I am not also running JRiver (which I now use only for multi-channel) at the same time as Roon.
4. In May, I replaced the CAPSv4 as a RoonBridge (outputting USB audio) with the Microrendu (which comes Roonready, which is the same as loading RoonBridge onto a computer).
My current Roon setup:
CAPSv3 runs RoonServerInstaller64. Microrendu is Roon Ready.
WDMyCloudEX4 (Western Digital) 16 TB Server connects via ethernet cable to Linksys router/access point.
CAPSv3 connects via ethernet cable to Linksys router/access point.
Microrendu connects via ethernet cable to Linksys router/access point.
Microrendu connects via USB output/USB cable to Berkely Audio USB to digital converter.
Berkely connects via Cardas AES/EBU digital cable to Theta CBIV SSP.
Theta CBIV SSP connects via three Cardas AES/EBU digital cables to three external Theta Gen VIII Series 3 DACs.
I initially used the Microrendu with the HDPlex 100 watt linear power supply (LPS) that came with my CAPSv4, and it was a clear sonic improvement over the CAPSv4. After I few weeks, my new Sonore Signature Power Supply (with 2 Synergistic Research black fuses) arrived, and this was a substantial sonic improvement even more than before!
Note that my CAPSv3 (and now sold CAPSv4) Windows 8.1 Pro operating systems were optimized by Andrew Gillis, Small Green Computer (he also wrote the software for the Microrendu) to delete unnecessary functions for the best audio sonics and to avoid operating hiccups. I have personally experienced operating hiccups when using a computer without having Windows optimized for audio usage.
All this mumbojumbo and noise is just that, noise. Objective science must also take into account subjective, and in this case, I have no doubt of methodology mistakes for one to equate a laptop sonics & noise with the microrendu. But I'm not gonna waste my time bantering and arguing this - I am having too much fun listening to music sounding its very best in my system! Have at it folks!
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